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The people who are so poor that they don't have reliable access to banking services very often are lacking reliable access to internet connected computing devic

The people who are so poor that they don't have reliable access to banking services very often are lacking reliable access to internet connected computing devices and sometimes even electricity. Additionally, trading cryptocurrency for spendable money is time consuming and expensive. The idea that cryptocurrency is a viable option for the participants of third-world economies is absurd. I'm not saying that nobody in the third-world uses cryptotokens but its very uncommon.

scythe 9y ago
As society advances, the lowest rung is brought up even though corruption persists. Many years ago, it wasn't likely for people in third world countries to have access to vaccination or clothing, but today we've eliminated smallpox and nobody wears animal skins except uncontacted tribes and people who choose to. Internet connectivity is very cheap in per capita terms and cell phone towers have gone up in places like Afghanistan and Somalia. Furthermore, the poorest people generally aren't the ones looking to evade hyperinflation, because they lack savings in the first place. Venezuela had a middle class once upon a time, though.
- root_axis 9y ago
  The bottom line is that blockchain token technology is not a fit for the problem of 3rd world banking and hyperinflation, it is stunningly out of touch to suggest that crpyo-tokens are having any significant impact on the ground in these places.
  - scythe 9y ago
    You don't know anything about the bottom line. I made claims about the potential for use, not that it was actually used. You seem to be operating on the assumption that third world = mud huts and subsistence farming, which is very untrue.
    - root_axis 9y ago
      > You don't know anything about the bottom line. I'm unsure what you mean by this. "The bottom line" is just a manner of expression. > I made claims about the potential for use, not that it was actually used And I stated why I believe this to be a dubious claim; crypto-tokens are totally impractical. Your allusion to advancements in medicine and internet connectivity is a red herring argument that hand waves away the reality of using crypo-tokens in the real world. > You seem to be operating on the assumption that third world = mud huts and subsistence farming, which is very untrue. Wow. I illustrated concerns surrounding limited accessibility to internet in the developing world and you disingenuously twisted it into an insult to the citizens of the developing world. You don't even have to venture into a 3rd world country to see the impracticality of crypo-tokens in the real world, they're barley usable even in the developed world, and at the first sign of trouble they are useless, e.g. see how far crypo-tokens take you on the ground in Puerto Rico. Jumbling around private keys, trying to coordinate meet-ups to trade crypto for money, managing all the technical issues surrounding wallet management, insane volatility, transaction fees, the concept of confirmations, client versioning, security best practices, staying abreast of blockchain politics surrounding forks and protocol changes that impact security, price, usability... it's a quagmire of impracticality.
      - dorgo 9y ago
        atm yes. First computers were huge, slow and impractical too.
        root_axis 9y ago
        > First computers were huge, slow and impractical too. So what? Every technology starts off slow and impractical including the ones that fail.
adventured 9y ago
> people who are so poor that they don't have reliable access to banking services very often are lacking reliable access to internet connected computing devices That's absolutely true when you get to the bottom ~3-4 billion people in the world. However it also used to be true about the ~2 billion people above them as well. Mobile banking - smart phones - have legitimately reshaped that for people in nations that have for example GDP per capita levels of around $3,000 to $8,000. It wasn't very long ago that the context for those people wasn't too dissimilar to that of what third world people are still dealing with today. Go back before ~2009 in small to mid size towns in Romania, Vietnam or Nigeria; today these people widely have access to easy, relatively secure banking via their phones. In the near future their mobile banking systems will provide easy access to something like Bitcoin as well, and obviously some of them already are.
josu 9y ago
His comment doesn't mention poor people "someone in a third-world country to keep money away from a hyperinflating currency". Not that many people living in third world countries are considered poor anymore. It is not a middle-class (European style) but they certainly are able to save some money. Banks are not interested in that low-middle-class which make up most of the population in cities like Mexico City, Sao Paolo, Kolkata or Beijing, so the only store of value they have access to are state-sponsored/controlled pension funds (which they may never get back) or real estate in areas where property rights are not that well defined. So crypto is a very real answer to these people that are connected to the internet 24/7 through their smartphones. Your comment mostly applies to rural areas in 3rd countries.

scythe 9y ago

As society advances, the lowest rung is brought up even though corruption persists. Many years ago, it wasn't likely for people in third world countries to have access to vaccination or clothing, but today we've eliminated smallpox and nobody wears animal skins except uncontacted tribes and people who choose to. Internet connectivity is very cheap in per capita terms and cell phone towers have gone up in places like Afghanistan and Somalia. Furthermore, the poorest people generally aren't the ones looking to evade hyperinflation, because they lack savings in the first place. Venezuela had a middle class once upon a time, though.

root_axis 9y ago
The bottom line is that blockchain token technology is not a fit for the problem of 3rd world banking and hyperinflation, it is stunningly out of touch to suggest that crpyo-tokens are having any significant impact on the ground in these places.
- scythe 9y ago
  You don't know anything about the bottom line. I made claims about the potential for use, not that it was actually used. You seem to be operating on the assumption that third world = mud huts and subsistence farming, which is very untrue.
  - root_axis 9y ago
    > You don't know anything about the bottom line. I'm unsure what you mean by this. "The bottom line" is just a manner of expression. > I made claims about the potential for use, not that it was actually used And I stated why I believe this to be a dubious claim; crypto-tokens are totally impractical. Your allusion to advancements in medicine and internet connectivity is a red herring argument that hand waves away the reality of using crypo-tokens in the real world. > You seem to be operating on the assumption that third world = mud huts and subsistence farming, which is very untrue. Wow. I illustrated concerns surrounding limited accessibility to internet in the developing world and you disingenuously twisted it into an insult to the citizens of the developing world. You don't even have to venture into a 3rd world country to see the impracticality of crypo-tokens in the real world, they're barley usable even in the developed world, and at the first sign of trouble they are useless, e.g. see how far crypo-tokens take you on the ground in Puerto Rico. Jumbling around private keys, trying to coordinate meet-ups to trade crypto for money, managing all the technical issues surrounding wallet management, insane volatility, transaction fees, the concept of confirmations, client versioning, security best practices, staying abreast of blockchain politics surrounding forks and protocol changes that impact security, price, usability... it's a quagmire of impracticality.
    - dorgo 9y ago
      atm yes. First computers were huge, slow and impractical too.
      - root_axis 9y ago
        > First computers were huge, slow and impractical too. So what? Every technology starts off slow and impractical including the ones that fail.

adventured 9y ago

> people who are so poor that they don't have reliable access to banking services very often are lacking reliable access to internet connected computing devices That's absolutely true when you get to the bottom ~3-4 billion people in the world. However it also used to be true about the ~2 billion people above them as well. Mobile banking - smart phones - have legitimately reshaped that for people in nations that have for example GDP per capita levels of around $3,000 to $8,000. It wasn't very long ago that the context for those people wasn't too dissimilar to that of what third world people are still dealing with today. Go back before ~2009 in small to mid size towns in Romania, Vietnam or Nigeria; today these people widely have access to easy, relatively secure banking via their phones. In the near future their mobile banking systems will provide easy access to something like Bitcoin as well, and obviously some of them already are.

josu 9y ago

His comment doesn't mention poor people "someone in a third-world country to keep money away from a hyperinflating currency". Not that many people living in third world countries are considered poor anymore. It is not a middle-class (European style) but they certainly are able to save some money. Banks are not interested in that low-middle-class which make up most of the population in cities like Mexico City, Sao Paolo, Kolkata or Beijing, so the only store of value they have access to are state-sponsored/controlled pension funds (which they may never get back) or real estate in areas where property rights are not that well defined. So crypto is a very real answer to these people that are connected to the internet 24/7 through their smartphones. Your comment mostly applies to rural areas in 3rd countries.