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As alarming as this is (and it is alarming) at least it's explicit. Another worrisome case is of blacklists/rankings that you can't see. No-fly lists that no o

As alarming as this is (and it is alarming) at least it's explicit. Another worrisome case is of blacklists/rankings that you can't see. No-fly lists that no one knows why you are on. Secret watch lists. Conspiracies against people with opposing political views with no clear way to know what views may have triggered this and no path to straighten a misunderstanding up. I oppose oppression in all forms but if we are going to have it, explicit is better than implicit. (And flat is better than nested:).

seanmcdirmid 9y ago
Note that if you are on the bad credit list, you aren’t allowed to fly or take the train. I guess this is so you can’t flee from your debts.
- solidsnack9000 9y ago
  You might be able to take the train or fly, but only with the lowest class of seats. There might be something punitive in this, but another aspect of it is that you don't want to sell expensive things to people with bad credit. There are myriad ways people try to get out of paying for things -- returning them, cancelling last minute, filing complaints -- that leave the merchant holding the bag even after a sale is seemingly complete.
- usaar333 9y ago
  The article discusses two things: > Sesame Credit, controlled by a private organization (Alipay) > The government's List of Dishonest People, a blacklist of people who haven't paid fines. (The article conflates them because the Sesame Credit scores are downgraded based on whether the person has unpaid fines. However, Sesame Credit doesn't affect the government list) The "credit" list has no impact on trains/flying; nonpaying of government fines does. This isn't too dissimilar from other countries, where failing to pay government-issued fines results in disciplinary measures.
  - seanmcdirmid 9y ago
    https://www.techinasia.com/china-citizens-scores-barred-from-flights https://www.techinasia.com/china-citizens-scores-barred-from... They call it a “social credit system” in china (the one that can get you barred from flights), besides not paying your fines you can get on the list if you happen to be a unharmonious dissident. It’s no wonder it is confused with the sesame credit system, since they are both credit systems that run in china. Here is a state-owned press link if you doubt tech Asia: http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1015549.shtml http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1015549.shtml

seanmcdirmid 9y ago

Note that if you are on the bad credit list, you aren’t allowed to fly or take the train. I guess this is so you can’t flee from your debts.

solidsnack9000 9y ago
You might be able to take the train or fly, but only with the lowest class of seats. There might be something punitive in this, but another aspect of it is that you don't want to sell expensive things to people with bad credit. There are myriad ways people try to get out of paying for things -- returning them, cancelling last minute, filing complaints -- that leave the merchant holding the bag even after a sale is seemingly complete.
usaar333 9y ago
The article discusses two things: > Sesame Credit, controlled by a private organization (Alipay) > The government's List of Dishonest People, a blacklist of people who haven't paid fines. (The article conflates them because the Sesame Credit scores are downgraded based on whether the person has unpaid fines. However, Sesame Credit doesn't affect the government list) The "credit" list has no impact on trains/flying; nonpaying of government fines does. This isn't too dissimilar from other countries, where failing to pay government-issued fines results in disciplinary measures.
- seanmcdirmid 9y ago
  https://www.techinasia.com/china-citizens-scores-barred-from-flights https://www.techinasia.com/china-citizens-scores-barred-from... They call it a “social credit system” in china (the one that can get you barred from flights), besides not paying your fines you can get on the list if you happen to be a unharmonious dissident. It’s no wonder it is confused with the sesame credit system, since they are both credit systems that run in china. Here is a state-owned press link if you doubt tech Asia: http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1015549.shtml http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1015549.shtml