5 ms·

A) Are we sure it even flies? B) Do they have the very nuanced tech to handle the complexities of stealth? C) Most important: it's a team, not a pilot. What m

A) Are we sure it even flies? B) Do they have the very nuanced tech to handle the complexities of stealth? C) Most important: it's a team, not a pilot. What makes US Air Power so effective is the coordination, and multi-role availability etc. AWACS, communications, meshed fighter groups, all sorts of strike packages from cruise missiles to drones etc.. So when you need to go in stealth and do the AA + Comms network, you can do that. When you need low-air with some jamming support etc. you can do that. When you need to hit something way past the horizon you can do that. When you want to linger forever you can re-fuel and do that. Hopefully it will never matter, but the ability to project power makes a difference, even if it's not used. Time to get some good gear into India ...

jjoonathan 9y ago
They'll figure it out.
orb_yt 9y ago
Of course it flies: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyCagF0RUQQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyCagF0RUQQ
King-Aaron 9y ago
a) yes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_CK3N8mOXs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_CK3N8mOXs b ) you can probably assume, considering the vast tech industry in China, that if they haven't yet they will soon. c) Why would you assume their operational and strategic capabilities are lacking in these areas? The Chinese have a very capable armed forces https://www.globalfirepower.com/country-military-strength-detail.asp?country_id=china https://www.globalfirepower.com/country-military-strength-de... https://www.lowyinstitute.org/issues/chinese-military https://www.lowyinstitute.org/issues/chinese-military
- alexasmyths 9y ago
  a) Just because you show a video of an airframe in the air, does not remotely mean that the Jet specified, with all it's gear, is flying and operable. b) No - stealth for jets is a very, very specific thing with lots of nuance that has no civilian counterpart. What 'tech' does China make that surpasses most of the world? Almost none. The article today about their car factories: all Swedish and Swiss robots. So they're not even at that stage. Same thing with Engines - a very key component that most nations do not seem to be able to do on their own. Apparently the new US F series have surfaces tweaked down to the mm, bigger than that, it's not stealthy. And it requires a lot of specialized maintenance. c) The Chinese have no experience whatsoever operating in the kinds of systems that the US has. Those things take experience and time to develop. Can the Chinese AF effectively deploy drones 1/2 way around the world now? That's not 'one tech' - that's a whole pile of tech and operational abilities rolled into one. And that's just drones. How many re-fuellers do they have ready? How many Aircraft carriers (really, 0). How many forward stations can they deploy to in an instant? No, as far as they have come along the last 20 years, this is one area they are going to be quite far behind in, for still some time yet. I roughly say they are about where they are with their aircraft carrier.
  - justicezyx 9y ago
    > a) Just because you show a video of an airframe in the air, does not remotely mean that the Jet specified, with all it's gear, is flying and operable. So it acutally cannot fly, that's what you are saying. > What 'tech' does China make that surpasses most of the world? Almost none. China tech is among the world's most advanced. Let's not confuse being the absolute #1 with just being advanced. > c) The Chinese have no experience whatsoever operating in the kinds of systems that the US has. "had" They used to have a despicable internet economy, look at what they are doing now.
    - alexasmyths 9y ago
      a) I'm not saying one way or the other, I'm saying we don't really have lot of info on what it actually is and does. b) China is not among the world's most advanced in the series of technical bits necessary for this: stealth, jet aircraft engine, weapons systems, underlying operational capabilities. c) China hasn't dropped live munitions on an actual target in what, decades? Do they have a single AFB out of their borders? Do they have an operable aircraft carrier? Do they interoperate with dozens of other nations? Have they flown actual stealth missions? You have to do all of that to get good at it. I will be a long while.
      - olympus 9y ago
        The stance you're taking is one that is dangerous. China has a billion people and a lot of really smart ones. a) The J-20 does fly, but it isn't fully operational. But functioning prototypes do exist and have fired missiles. If you aren't satisfied with pictures and videos I guess you'll just have to join the PLAAF and become a pilot yourself. b) China may bad at engine construction and lag in stealth, but they are world class at designing weapons and their operational ability. The PL-12 and upcoming PL-15 are extremely advanced and their integrated air defense is seriously good. c) China has drops live munitions on regular occasion. They do it during training and during weapons development. Just because the US and Russia are dropping bombs in Syria doesn't mean they are getting good practice out of it. China's aerospace development is far beyond their aircraft carrier development. Don't think that just because they can't project power across the globe that they are impotent. The ability to operate carriers and resupply underway is exclusive to the USA. Literally every other country has to stop at a friendly port to resupply. China threatens plenty of countries within its range. The thing about war with China is that it's asymmetric, so they don't have to be as good as the USA to cause problems. If China attacks Taiwan (a commonly hypothesized scenario) they have a huge home team advantage while the USA has to drag everything halfway across the world. The USA can't rest because as soon as they are close enough to defend Taiwan they are under 24/7 threat from Chinese subs, ships, cruise missiles, and planes. China gets to use 100% of it's military for that fight, and the USA cannot use 100% because of the long logistical tail.
junkscience2017 9y ago
and NATO, in particular the USAF, can deploy in volume. The Russians field some interesting planes but then you find out they have six of them, only three flyable.
- stevenwoo 9y ago
  The usual joke/factoid is the US Navy is the #1 air force in the entire world, with the US Army and the US Air Force running a close second and third with orders changing depending upon how one counts.
  - seanmcdirmid 9y ago
    The USAF (air force) is the biggest air force in the world, the USN (navy) is second, the Army is in the top ten but number three is Russia.
    - dingaling 9y ago
      It's more of an assessment of capability rather than raw size. For example the air component of the USMC is larger than the UK RAF but the latter is more experienced and capable in long-range power projection. The IDF/AF is smaller than the Russian air forces but many times more capable.
justicezyx 9y ago
> A) Are we sure it even flies? Yes, you can just google it, and found video of public flight in air show. > B) Do they have the very nuanced tech to handle the complexities of stealth? According to many sources, China stolen the F117 debris, and apparently that's why US bombed Chinese embassy because of a "outdated map". C) Most important: it's a team, not a pilot. Y-20 the heavy weight transport aircraft. J-16 the F-15E equivalent J-10 the F-16 equivalent Kj-2000 Kj-200 Kj-500 AWSACS air craft Aircraft carriers J-15 carrier jet > What makes US Air Power so effective is the coordination Beidou: equivalent to GPS > meshed fighter groups China is one of the leaders in swarm drones
- jkaptur 9y ago
  > According to many sources, China stolen the F117 debris, and apparently that's why US bombed Chinese embassy because of a "outdated map". Would you mind linking to a few of the many sources?
  - justicezyx 9y ago
    It's a rumor, circulating on Chinese and English forums, and I have not kept reference.

jjoonathan 9y ago

They'll figure it out.

orb_yt 9y ago

Of course it flies: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyCagF0RUQQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyCagF0RUQQ

King-Aaron 9y ago

a) yes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_CK3N8mOXs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_CK3N8mOXs b ) you can probably assume, considering the vast tech industry in China, that if they haven't yet they will soon. c) Why would you assume their operational and strategic capabilities are lacking in these areas? The Chinese have a very capable armed forces https://www.globalfirepower.com/country-military-strength-detail.asp?country_id=china https://www.globalfirepower.com/country-military-strength-de... https://www.lowyinstitute.org/issues/chinese-military https://www.lowyinstitute.org/issues/chinese-military

alexasmyths 9y ago
a) Just because you show a video of an airframe in the air, does not remotely mean that the Jet specified, with all it's gear, is flying and operable. b) No - stealth for jets is a very, very specific thing with lots of nuance that has no civilian counterpart. What 'tech' does China make that surpasses most of the world? Almost none. The article today about their car factories: all Swedish and Swiss robots. So they're not even at that stage. Same thing with Engines - a very key component that most nations do not seem to be able to do on their own. Apparently the new US F series have surfaces tweaked down to the mm, bigger than that, it's not stealthy. And it requires a lot of specialized maintenance. c) The Chinese have no experience whatsoever operating in the kinds of systems that the US has. Those things take experience and time to develop. Can the Chinese AF effectively deploy drones 1/2 way around the world now? That's not 'one tech' - that's a whole pile of tech and operational abilities rolled into one. And that's just drones. How many re-fuellers do they have ready? How many Aircraft carriers (really, 0). How many forward stations can they deploy to in an instant? No, as far as they have come along the last 20 years, this is one area they are going to be quite far behind in, for still some time yet. I roughly say they are about where they are with their aircraft carrier.
- justicezyx 9y ago
  > a) Just because you show a video of an airframe in the air, does not remotely mean that the Jet specified, with all it's gear, is flying and operable. So it acutally cannot fly, that's what you are saying. > What 'tech' does China make that surpasses most of the world? Almost none. China tech is among the world's most advanced. Let's not confuse being the absolute #1 with just being advanced. > c) The Chinese have no experience whatsoever operating in the kinds of systems that the US has. "had" They used to have a despicable internet economy, look at what they are doing now.
  - alexasmyths 9y ago
    a) I'm not saying one way or the other, I'm saying we don't really have lot of info on what it actually is and does. b) China is not among the world's most advanced in the series of technical bits necessary for this: stealth, jet aircraft engine, weapons systems, underlying operational capabilities. c) China hasn't dropped live munitions on an actual target in what, decades? Do they have a single AFB out of their borders? Do they have an operable aircraft carrier? Do they interoperate with dozens of other nations? Have they flown actual stealth missions? You have to do all of that to get good at it. I will be a long while.
    - olympus 9y ago
      The stance you're taking is one that is dangerous. China has a billion people and a lot of really smart ones. a) The J-20 does fly, but it isn't fully operational. But functioning prototypes do exist and have fired missiles. If you aren't satisfied with pictures and videos I guess you'll just have to join the PLAAF and become a pilot yourself. b) China may bad at engine construction and lag in stealth, but they are world class at designing weapons and their operational ability. The PL-12 and upcoming PL-15 are extremely advanced and their integrated air defense is seriously good. c) China has drops live munitions on regular occasion. They do it during training and during weapons development. Just because the US and Russia are dropping bombs in Syria doesn't mean they are getting good practice out of it. China's aerospace development is far beyond their aircraft carrier development. Don't think that just because they can't project power across the globe that they are impotent. The ability to operate carriers and resupply underway is exclusive to the USA. Literally every other country has to stop at a friendly port to resupply. China threatens plenty of countries within its range. The thing about war with China is that it's asymmetric, so they don't have to be as good as the USA to cause problems. If China attacks Taiwan (a commonly hypothesized scenario) they have a huge home team advantage while the USA has to drag everything halfway across the world. The USA can't rest because as soon as they are close enough to defend Taiwan they are under 24/7 threat from Chinese subs, ships, cruise missiles, and planes. China gets to use 100% of it's military for that fight, and the USA cannot use 100% because of the long logistical tail.

junkscience2017 9y ago

and NATO, in particular the USAF, can deploy in volume. The Russians field some interesting planes but then you find out they have six of them, only three flyable.

stevenwoo 9y ago
The usual joke/factoid is the US Navy is the #1 air force in the entire world, with the US Army and the US Air Force running a close second and third with orders changing depending upon how one counts.
- seanmcdirmid 9y ago
  The USAF (air force) is the biggest air force in the world, the USN (navy) is second, the Army is in the top ten but number three is Russia.
  - dingaling 9y ago
    It's more of an assessment of capability rather than raw size. For example the air component of the USMC is larger than the UK RAF but the latter is more experienced and capable in long-range power projection. The IDF/AF is smaller than the Russian air forces but many times more capable.

justicezyx 9y ago

> A) Are we sure it even flies? Yes, you can just google it, and found video of public flight in air show. > B) Do they have the very nuanced tech to handle the complexities of stealth? According to many sources, China stolen the F117 debris, and apparently that's why US bombed Chinese embassy because of a "outdated map". C) Most important: it's a team, not a pilot. Y-20 the heavy weight transport aircraft. J-16 the F-15E equivalent J-10 the F-16 equivalent Kj-2000 Kj-200 Kj-500 AWSACS air craft Aircraft carriers J-15 carrier jet > What makes US Air Power so effective is the coordination Beidou: equivalent to GPS > meshed fighter groups China is one of the leaders in swarm drones

jkaptur 9y ago
> According to many sources, China stolen the F117 debris, and apparently that's why US bombed Chinese embassy because of a "outdated map". Would you mind linking to a few of the many sources?
- justicezyx 9y ago
  It's a rumor, circulating on Chinese and English forums, and I have not kept reference.