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I fail to see the problem with affiliate links in that context. The site openly disclosed that they use affiliate links to amazon. The site provides a value, a

I fail to see the problem with affiliate links in that context. The site openly disclosed that they use affiliate links to amazon. The site provides a value, a ranked list of compatible devices. I might actually use it if I were shopping around for a device. Building and maintaining it probably takes some effort. It deserves to get paid. If you think that all for-profit pages should be banned from mention then this here would be a barren place, devoid of links to useful services. added after the parent modified his post: Even after you changed your comment, I fail to see a problem. The poster explicitly says "I maintain", openly disclosing his affiliation with the site. The site does not recommend a specific device as "the best", it provides a list, ranked by a disclosed set of criteria from which you can pick. You can actually change the filters and the sort order - cheapest, graded by performance, ... We can agree or disagree on the specific sort criteria picked or the completeness of the list, but the grandparent actually does sometimes engage into discussions about this, soliciting feedback (and I presume implementing it). It adds value over the device lists that LEDE and OpenWRT provide. The grandparent does mention the page every time the context makes sense, but alas, when else would he mention it? Would you prefer if the grandparent just posts the link as a reply to each and every post? He built something that adds value, so why not mention it? It's not like it's the only thing the GP ever posts. Seems more like a lurker from the comment history, but come on, the last mention was 141 days ago, it's not like it's spammy. All in all your comment comes off as being jealous someone built something that provides a little income.

jlgaddis 9y ago
> The site openly disclosed that they use affiliate links to amazon. Did it? I was on an iPad and only realized they were affiliate links after I clicked on one and it took to Amazon. Immediately, I looked at the URL to see if there was a referral tag in there. I then went back and noticed "DISCLOSURE" at the very bottom, in the footer, but I don't recall seeing any mention of it before that. > If you think that all for-profit pages should be banned from mention then this here would be a barren place, devoid of links to useful services. Did I say anything even remotely close to that?
- Xylakant 9y ago
  > Did it? It says first thing on the top that links go to amazon. There's a link at the bottom to the full discussion. What's the issue if the links to amazon are affiliate links? It's not like they're forcing you to buy or that the value you get from the site is reduced by that. They don't hype a specific device either. > Did I say anything even remotely close to that? I very much understood your complaint about "spammy, since he links to a page that he's affiliated with" to go in the direction that nobody should link to a monetized service he's somehow affiliated with, yes.
  - megaman22 9y ago
    I'm of the oppinion that all links to amazon, for example, should be affiliate links. Somebody should be getting that cut.
    - EwanToo 9y ago
      Ideally I think it would be https://smile.amazon.com/ https://smile.amazon.com/ but I know it's never that simple..
    - TheSpiceIsLife 9y ago
      This is a great comment. It disrupts the whole argument and turns it on its head.
  - mikeash 9y ago
    It talks a lot about Amazon, but there's no mention of using affiliate links. The issue is that there's a conflict of interest when a page that gives you advice on what to buy uses affiliate links. If they get a cut of my purchase, then they're incentivized to get me to buy the most expensive alternative rather than the best one, and to buy something rather than stick with what I have if what I have is adequate. This is not an insurmountable problem, but disclosure is important so I know what's going on.
- lovelearning 9y ago
  I wanted to ignore this since I don't enjoy subjective arguments, but since you seem to be virtue signalling about disclosures, I'd like to point out that your own page with Amazon affiliate links [http://evilrouters.net/bookshelf/ http://evilrouters.net/bookshelf/] does not disclose your affiliation to Amazon (which is itself a violation of section 5 of the Amazon affiliate program agreement), nor does your DISCLOSURE page (whose link is also at the very bottom right of your page). The other commentator's disclosure page (http://rooftopbazaar.com/disclosure/ http://rooftopbazaar.com/disclosure/) comes across as a proper honest disclosure to me. Sorry, your comments seem like hypocrisy to me.
stordoff 9y ago
I agree that the use of affiliate links isn't a huge issue, but I'm not sure I'd agree that the site _openly_ discloses the use of Amazon affiliate links. To learn that information, you have to notice "Disclosure" in the footer (which doesn't indicate what sort of disclosure it is), and even then the resultant page doesn't have a straight-forward statement along the lines of "This site makes use of Amazon affiliate links". I also feel like the following is possibly _slightly_ misleading, or at least intended to induce the use of the provided links: > By using any link on this site – affiliate or not – you will get a better deal by purchasing a corresponding product through that link than you would by going directly through the linked company’s site
alsetmusic 9y ago
> All in all your comment comes off as being jealous someone built something that provides a little income. I don’t consider the comment as a display of jealousy. It appears (to me) that it originates from a dislike of self-promotion. Note: I am not taking a position on the matter of self-promotion, but on the conclusion of jealousy.
- Xylakant 9y ago
  I count single digit mentions in 1669 days that procotor is registered on HN. That would be lousy self promotion. I believe that proctor genuinely believes he built something useful and wants to share it. The snark in jlgaddis post rubs me the wrong way.
  - alsetmusic 9y ago
    > I count single digit mentions in 1669 days that procotor is registered on HN. That would be lousy self promotion. Lousy of not, it’s still self-promotion. This is true whether it occurs once or many times. > I believe that proctor genuinely believes he built something useful and wants to share it. I agree. > The snark in jlgaddis post rubs me the wrong way. Clearly. However, you aren’t defending your accusation of jealousy. Jealousy was the key word that I was addressing.
    - Xylakant 9y ago
      > Lousy of not, it’s still self-promotion. This is true whether it occurs once or many times. If a few mentions of something you built counts as self promotion, then even the description and the link to the blog that jlgaddis has on his profile page is self-promotion. It promotes a blog that he writes, possibly to further his professional career. > Clearly. However, you aren’t defending your accusation of jealousy. Jealousy was the key word that I was addressing. Ok, let me rephrase that to be more clear: It rubs me in a way that makes me personally believe that something more than "I don't like self promotion" is at play. And I believe that it's jealousy. You obviously don't, but that's personal perception I guess.

jlgaddis 9y ago

> The site openly disclosed that they use affiliate links to amazon. Did it? I was on an iPad and only realized they were affiliate links after I clicked on one and it took to Amazon. Immediately, I looked at the URL to see if there was a referral tag in there. I then went back and noticed "DISCLOSURE" at the very bottom, in the footer, but I don't recall seeing any mention of it before that. > If you think that all for-profit pages should be banned from mention then this here would be a barren place, devoid of links to useful services. Did I say anything even remotely close to that?

Xylakant 9y ago
> Did it? It says first thing on the top that links go to amazon. There's a link at the bottom to the full discussion. What's the issue if the links to amazon are affiliate links? It's not like they're forcing you to buy or that the value you get from the site is reduced by that. They don't hype a specific device either. > Did I say anything even remotely close to that? I very much understood your complaint about "spammy, since he links to a page that he's affiliated with" to go in the direction that nobody should link to a monetized service he's somehow affiliated with, yes.
- megaman22 9y ago
  I'm of the oppinion that all links to amazon, for example, should be affiliate links. Somebody should be getting that cut.
  - EwanToo 9y ago
    Ideally I think it would be https://smile.amazon.com/ https://smile.amazon.com/ but I know it's never that simple..
  - TheSpiceIsLife 9y ago
    This is a great comment. It disrupts the whole argument and turns it on its head.
- mikeash 9y ago
  It talks a lot about Amazon, but there's no mention of using affiliate links. The issue is that there's a conflict of interest when a page that gives you advice on what to buy uses affiliate links. If they get a cut of my purchase, then they're incentivized to get me to buy the most expensive alternative rather than the best one, and to buy something rather than stick with what I have if what I have is adequate. This is not an insurmountable problem, but disclosure is important so I know what's going on.
lovelearning 9y ago
I wanted to ignore this since I don't enjoy subjective arguments, but since you seem to be virtue signalling about disclosures, I'd like to point out that your own page with Amazon affiliate links [http://evilrouters.net/bookshelf/ http://evilrouters.net/bookshelf/] does not disclose your affiliation to Amazon (which is itself a violation of section 5 of the Amazon affiliate program agreement), nor does your DISCLOSURE page (whose link is also at the very bottom right of your page). The other commentator's disclosure page (http://rooftopbazaar.com/disclosure/ http://rooftopbazaar.com/disclosure/) comes across as a proper honest disclosure to me. Sorry, your comments seem like hypocrisy to me.

stordoff 9y ago

I agree that the use of affiliate links isn't a huge issue, but I'm not sure I'd agree that the site _openly_ discloses the use of Amazon affiliate links. To learn that information, you have to notice "Disclosure" in the footer (which doesn't indicate what sort of disclosure it is), and even then the resultant page doesn't have a straight-forward statement along the lines of "This site makes use of Amazon affiliate links". I also feel like the following is possibly _slightly_ misleading, or at least intended to induce the use of the provided links: > By using any link on this site – affiliate or not – you will get a better deal by purchasing a corresponding product through that link than you would by going directly through the linked company’s site

alsetmusic 9y ago

> All in all your comment comes off as being jealous someone built something that provides a little income. I don’t consider the comment as a display of jealousy. It appears (to me) that it originates from a dislike of self-promotion. Note: I am not taking a position on the matter of self-promotion, but on the conclusion of jealousy.

Xylakant 9y ago
I count single digit mentions in 1669 days that procotor is registered on HN. That would be lousy self promotion. I believe that proctor genuinely believes he built something useful and wants to share it. The snark in jlgaddis post rubs me the wrong way.
- alsetmusic 9y ago
  > I count single digit mentions in 1669 days that procotor is registered on HN. That would be lousy self promotion. Lousy of not, it’s still self-promotion. This is true whether it occurs once or many times. > I believe that proctor genuinely believes he built something useful and wants to share it. I agree. > The snark in jlgaddis post rubs me the wrong way. Clearly. However, you aren’t defending your accusation of jealousy. Jealousy was the key word that I was addressing.
  - Xylakant 9y ago
    > Lousy of not, it’s still self-promotion. This is true whether it occurs once or many times. If a few mentions of something you built counts as self promotion, then even the description and the link to the blog that jlgaddis has on his profile page is self-promotion. It promotes a blog that he writes, possibly to further his professional career. > Clearly. However, you aren’t defending your accusation of jealousy. Jealousy was the key word that I was addressing. Ok, let me rephrase that to be more clear: It rubs me in a way that makes me personally believe that something more than "I don't like self promotion" is at play. And I believe that it's jealousy. You obviously don't, but that's personal perception I guess.