9 ms·

On the other hand, people would complain about the horrible battery life. In any case, the solution is rather simple: just replace the battery.

modeless 9y ago
If the battery is so small that it can't last 2 years of normal wear without becoming "horrible", the design is bad. Papering over the bad design by making the phone run at less than 60% of rated speed, on purpose, is even worse. Battery wear is expected, but it is not reasonable to expect that the CPU will be affected too, and this has never been disclosed AFAIK. Also, replacing a non-user-replaceable battery is not a "simple" solution.
- threeseed 9y ago
  (1) All batteries degrade. Really not sure why you think Apple would be any different. (2) Replacing the battery is simple. You take it to a phone shop or to Apple and in about an hour it is done. Most people aren't self servicing electronics or pretty much anything these days.
  - modeless 9y ago
    > not sure why you think Apple would be any different. I don't and my comment doesn't suggest that. What I suggest is that phones with non-user-replaceable batteries should be designed with capacity large enough so that life is still acceptable after two years of normal wear without throttling the CPU. As for how "simple" replacing the battery is, I don't consider a $79 repair that requires an appointment and driving to an Apple Store and wasting an hour of my day "simple".
    - muninn_ 9y ago
      Could be worse. You could wait a few days for Samsung to send you a box so you can mail your phone in.
    - coldtea 9y ago
      >I don't and my comment doesn't suggest that. What I suggest is that phones with non-user-replaceable batteries should be designed with capacity large enough so that life is still acceptable after two years of normal wear without throttling the CPU. Whether user serviceable or not is irrelevant, as long as they have a support program to replace your battery.
      - pritambaral 9y ago
        As your parent points out: > As for how "simple" replacing the battery is, I don't consider a $79 repair that requires an appointment and driving to an Apple Store and wasting an hour of my day "simple". A support program is still far more trouble than user-replaceable batteries.
  - MereInterest 9y ago
    (1) All batteries degrade. This should be accounted for in the initial design, so that there is sufficient battery life at the end of product life, not just at the beginning. (2) Replacing the battery should be simple. Pop open the back cover, pull out the battery, and push the new one in. Heck, I used to carry a spare battery just in case, because it took 15 seconds to swap. Taking it to a phone shop and waiting an hour isn't what I would call simple.
    - drcross 9y ago
      >This should be accounted for in the initial design, so that there is sufficient battery life at the end of product life, not just at the beginning. If this was the case, the title of this post would be "iPhones don't use all available battery power" instead of what it is. You can't please all the people all the time.
      - pbhjpbhj 9y ago
        People would be so upset that they didn't have to charge their phone so often and that the completely sealed in battery lasted longer before making their phone appear to become obsolete?
        sokoloff 9y ago
        They might be upset when their phone was 3/4 inch / 2 cm thick and weighed 3/4 of a pound / 1/3 kg.
      - MereInterest 9y ago
        I'm really not sure how that follows at all. If the battery life of a new device is 3 days, and the battery life of a 2-year-old device is 1 day, at no point is there battery power that is unused.
    - Bud 9y ago
      1) It is accounted for. Just not in the way you'd like, with your priorities. 2) No. It should not be simple, and there should not be a crappy "back cover" which "pops" open. If you do that, you've made a fragile piece of crap with no water resistance and much less durability and you've wasted a lot of space. Space which is in very short supply.
  - mikeash 9y ago
    All batteries degrade. Not all batteries degrade into uselessness after a mere two years. My car is coming up on three years old and its battery capacity is still better than 99% of new.
    - hanbura 9y ago
      Your cars battery is cooled instead of being abused as a heat sink, is nearly never emptied, and uses a battery chemistry that doesn't degrade when fully charged. Smartphone battery degradation is indeed a consequence of design choices, but I think those choices are reasonable. I prefer battery power and processor power now over long term battery life, as long as the battery is replaceable.
      - mikeash 9y ago
        If they’d just make it bigger they’d solve a lot of things for both of us.
        ghaff 9y ago
        Except people tend to vote with their wallets for thinner lighter phones. Probably I’d prefer a slightly thicker phone myself but I’m probably not typical.
        mikeash 9y ago
        Indeed. I really wish Apple would offer an option to have a phone that's twice as thick as their current offerings, with the extra space filled with extra battery. Keep the thin ones available for people who prefer those. But I'm not getting my hopes up for such a thing. (And to preempt the typical responses to this: I know battery cases exist, but they're a substantially inferior solution.)
        robterrell 9y ago
        It's not just us geeks. My wife and kids (at least, the daughters who are full-time snapchat users) would definitely select the larger phone with bigger battery. If you had both choices before you in the store, who wouldn't start to wonder if they'd regret the thinner/lower capacity choice?
- coldtea 9y ago
  >If the battery is so small that it can't last 2 years of normal wear without becoming "horrible", the design is bad. And you say that as an expert on batteries, having done a comprehensive comparison study?
clishem 9y ago
I have an even simpler solution: don't buy any Apple products anymore.
stordoff 9y ago
If the battery life becomes "horrible" within two years, I'd question if it was sufficient in the first place. I've had non-Apple phones in use for significantly longer than that without meaningful battery loss (i.e. I don't have to charge more frequently). It also seems that you could throttle the CPU, but provide the user a way to override it. That'd be far more reasonable IMO.
- meatbundragon 9y ago
  In terms of user experience, having the option to override might confuse those who aren't power users, and some users may unintentionally experience something that isn't the "ideal path" chosen by Apple if they do choose to opt out of the throttling experience. Of course, maybe iPhones could just tell the users to replace batteries if battery life starts to deteriorate below a certain threshold.
pbhjpbhj 9y ago
Yeah, just buy a new battery at a Walmart, pop open the battery compartment ... /s
sytelus 9y ago
I thought iPhone batteries are not replaceable. How do you go about replacing it? Is the replaced battery authentic OEM or some third party?
- dannyw 9y ago
  They’re easy to replace, as long as you have careful hands and don’t try snapping off flex cables here and there. I can do one in 120 seconds, and I’ve only done it twice.
  - icebraining 9y ago
    Failing is painful, though. I replaced an iPhone's charging plug (which means replacing a small network of cables), got everything working and charging, then crushed the screen when closing it up :|

modeless 9y ago

If the battery is so small that it can't last 2 years of normal wear without becoming "horrible", the design is bad. Papering over the bad design by making the phone run at less than 60% of rated speed, on purpose, is even worse. Battery wear is expected, but it is not reasonable to expect that the CPU will be affected too, and this has never been disclosed AFAIK. Also, replacing a non-user-replaceable battery is not a "simple" solution.

threeseed 9y ago
(1) All batteries degrade. Really not sure why you think Apple would be any different. (2) Replacing the battery is simple. You take it to a phone shop or to Apple and in about an hour it is done. Most people aren't self servicing electronics or pretty much anything these days.
- modeless 9y ago
  > not sure why you think Apple would be any different. I don't and my comment doesn't suggest that. What I suggest is that phones with non-user-replaceable batteries should be designed with capacity large enough so that life is still acceptable after two years of normal wear without throttling the CPU. As for how "simple" replacing the battery is, I don't consider a $79 repair that requires an appointment and driving to an Apple Store and wasting an hour of my day "simple".
  - muninn_ 9y ago
    Could be worse. You could wait a few days for Samsung to send you a box so you can mail your phone in.
  - coldtea 9y ago
    >I don't and my comment doesn't suggest that. What I suggest is that phones with non-user-replaceable batteries should be designed with capacity large enough so that life is still acceptable after two years of normal wear without throttling the CPU. Whether user serviceable or not is irrelevant, as long as they have a support program to replace your battery.
    - pritambaral 9y ago
      As your parent points out: > As for how "simple" replacing the battery is, I don't consider a $79 repair that requires an appointment and driving to an Apple Store and wasting an hour of my day "simple". A support program is still far more trouble than user-replaceable batteries.
- MereInterest 9y ago
  (1) All batteries degrade. This should be accounted for in the initial design, so that there is sufficient battery life at the end of product life, not just at the beginning. (2) Replacing the battery should be simple. Pop open the back cover, pull out the battery, and push the new one in. Heck, I used to carry a spare battery just in case, because it took 15 seconds to swap. Taking it to a phone shop and waiting an hour isn't what I would call simple.
  - drcross 9y ago
    >This should be accounted for in the initial design, so that there is sufficient battery life at the end of product life, not just at the beginning. If this was the case, the title of this post would be "iPhones don't use all available battery power" instead of what it is. You can't please all the people all the time.
    - pbhjpbhj 9y ago
      People would be so upset that they didn't have to charge their phone so often and that the completely sealed in battery lasted longer before making their phone appear to become obsolete?
      - sokoloff 9y ago
        They might be upset when their phone was 3/4 inch / 2 cm thick and weighed 3/4 of a pound / 1/3 kg.
    - MereInterest 9y ago
      I'm really not sure how that follows at all. If the battery life of a new device is 3 days, and the battery life of a 2-year-old device is 1 day, at no point is there battery power that is unused.
  - Bud 9y ago
    1) It is accounted for. Just not in the way you'd like, with your priorities. 2) No. It should not be simple, and there should not be a crappy "back cover" which "pops" open. If you do that, you've made a fragile piece of crap with no water resistance and much less durability and you've wasted a lot of space. Space which is in very short supply.
- mikeash 9y ago
  All batteries degrade. Not all batteries degrade into uselessness after a mere two years. My car is coming up on three years old and its battery capacity is still better than 99% of new.
  - hanbura 9y ago
    Your cars battery is cooled instead of being abused as a heat sink, is nearly never emptied, and uses a battery chemistry that doesn't degrade when fully charged. Smartphone battery degradation is indeed a consequence of design choices, but I think those choices are reasonable. I prefer battery power and processor power now over long term battery life, as long as the battery is replaceable.
    - mikeash 9y ago
      If they’d just make it bigger they’d solve a lot of things for both of us.
      - ghaff 9y ago
        Except people tend to vote with their wallets for thinner lighter phones. Probably I’d prefer a slightly thicker phone myself but I’m probably not typical.
        mikeash 9y ago
        Indeed. I really wish Apple would offer an option to have a phone that's twice as thick as their current offerings, with the extra space filled with extra battery. Keep the thin ones available for people who prefer those. But I'm not getting my hopes up for such a thing. (And to preempt the typical responses to this: I know battery cases exist, but they're a substantially inferior solution.)
        robterrell 9y ago
        It's not just us geeks. My wife and kids (at least, the daughters who are full-time snapchat users) would definitely select the larger phone with bigger battery. If you had both choices before you in the store, who wouldn't start to wonder if they'd regret the thinner/lower capacity choice?
coldtea 9y ago
>If the battery is so small that it can't last 2 years of normal wear without becoming "horrible", the design is bad. And you say that as an expert on batteries, having done a comprehensive comparison study?

clishem 9y ago

I have an even simpler solution: don't buy any Apple products anymore.

stordoff 9y ago

If the battery life becomes "horrible" within two years, I'd question if it was sufficient in the first place. I've had non-Apple phones in use for significantly longer than that without meaningful battery loss (i.e. I don't have to charge more frequently). It also seems that you could throttle the CPU, but provide the user a way to override it. That'd be far more reasonable IMO.

meatbundragon 9y ago
In terms of user experience, having the option to override might confuse those who aren't power users, and some users may unintentionally experience something that isn't the "ideal path" chosen by Apple if they do choose to opt out of the throttling experience. Of course, maybe iPhones could just tell the users to replace batteries if battery life starts to deteriorate below a certain threshold.

pbhjpbhj 9y ago

Yeah, just buy a new battery at a Walmart, pop open the battery compartment ... /s

sytelus 9y ago

I thought iPhone batteries are not replaceable. How do you go about replacing it? Is the replaced battery authentic OEM or some third party?

dannyw 9y ago
They’re easy to replace, as long as you have careful hands and don’t try snapping off flex cables here and there. I can do one in 120 seconds, and I’ve only done it twice.
- icebraining 9y ago
  Failing is painful, though. I replaced an iPhone's charging plug (which means replacing a small network of cables), got everything working and charging, then crushed the screen when closing it up :|