7 ms·

Nice tool, but a lot of the market is being altered in a way that blows out these savings. For example, I run my business and my overall tax rate last year was

by kxyvr 9y ago

Nice tool, but a lot of the market is being altered in a way that blows out these savings. For example, I run my business and my overall tax rate last year was 28%. However, when I account for healthcare premiums and hitting my out of pocket max, I was over 40%. According to the calculator, my tax burden is reduced slightly under the plan. That said, my health costs for next year went up 37% and I'm receiving worse coverage. As such, I will be at a net loss for 2018 and it looks like it will become worse in 2019 if the individual mandate is eliminated. So, no, I don't expect a calculator to be perfect, but I can't help but stress how important the changes in healthcare costs for self-employed are under this plan.

poulsbohemian 9y ago
Wish I had more than one upvote for you, you perfectly summarize the situation for many of us.
wang_li 9y ago
Concern about the individual mandate's effect on the market is curious. It's was waived by Obama until 2016. Trump waived it for 2016 and now the tax plan will eliminate it permanently. Seems status quo.
- newfoundglory 9y ago
  No, expected future events are part of the status quo and they have been changed. Would you expect the market not to react if the government announced social security payments would all stop in 2018?
- guelo 9y ago
  Obama did not waive it in 2016.
- brobinson 9y ago
  What? I had to pay an individual mandate penalty on my 2015 tax return... If you're right, then the IRS owes me a refund.
  - wang_li 9y ago
    https://hotair.com/archives/2014/03/12/oh-by-the-way-obama-just-quietly-suspended-obamacares-individual-mandate-until-2016/ https://hotair.com/archives/2014/03/12/oh-by-the-way-obama-j...
    - meritt 9y ago
      Hardship exemptions [1] are absolutely not the same thing as waiving the penalty. [1] https://www.healthcare.gov/health-coverage-exemptions/hardship-exemptions/ https://www.healthcare.gov/health-coverage-exemptions/hardsh...
technotony 9y ago
My view is that if the individual mandate is eliminated then other insurers will come into the market with cheaper plans that don't include everything (Eg mental health) so health costs for healthy self-employed folks will go down. The thing I've always hated about Obamacare was how healthy self employed folks are subsiding the unhealthy people, this happens because most people in their 20's or 30s are covered by work plans which have a better risk pool.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- kxyvr 9y ago
  I'm sure it will for some people. That said when I was 21, I was diagnosed and treated for stage 3 melanoma and I can assure you the drugs that I took during that year were not cheap. At this point, it's been more than a decade and I'm wonderfully healthy, but I'm considered a high-risk because of my past with cancer. Now, there's a very valid moral question as to whether or not I'm entitled to have my healthcare subsidized by others in a pool and I'm fine having that conversation. From an economic point of view, I'm just shy of my mid-thirties with an advanced degree, been in the black with a self-funded business for the last 4-5 years, and have the potential to release products in the near future that could return millions in tax dollars. However, I may be robbed of that opportunity if I'm unable to purchase health insurance that covers cancer. Certainly, that's a frustrating proposition given that the only major misstep that I had was being unfortunate enough to become afflicted with a disease not under my control. And, just in case someone is curious about high-risk pools, I actually currently carry insurance from one because the ACA marketplace in my state does not offer PPOs and I have one regular appointment out of state. Anyway, the coverage and cost of high-risk pools varied wildly from state to state. As an example, since I'm familiar with TX, prior to disbanding the pool, the law allowed high-risk individuals to purchase insurance at twice the prevailing rate from the pool. If I recall correctly, its pool used a PPO, which is no longer found on the exchange, so we'll use a gold plan EPO to approximate. In Harris county, the current premium for that rate is $429/month with an out of pocket max of $6350. If we went back to the old model of twice the prevailing rate, I'd have to budget $16,646/year, which isn't all that far off from what it used to be. Now, that's just TX and different states had different rules. In the state I'm currently in, the 2018 premium will be $514/month with a $5000 out of pocket max. And, to be clear, there is cheaper health insurance available, but my perspective of coverage and costs changed dramatically after my illness. Health insurance doesn't mean much if it doesn't cover the doctors you trust for a price you can afford. Anyway, my point is that just because someone is in their 30's and healthy doesn't mean that their coverage will become cheaper or even attainable. Further, this has broad economic implications because it will quite simply force many of us out of the self-employed market because it's not responsible to carry an insurance plan that does not provide comprehensive coverage. This tax plan has been touted as helping small businesses, but it may end mine depending on what happens to the market in 2019.

by kxyvr 9y ago

poulsbohemian 9y ago

Wish I had more than one upvote for you, you perfectly summarize the situation for many of us.

wang_li 9y ago

Concern about the individual mandate's effect on the market is curious. It's was waived by Obama until 2016. Trump waived it for 2016 and now the tax plan will eliminate it permanently. Seems status quo.

newfoundglory 9y ago
No, expected future events are part of the status quo and they have been changed. Would you expect the market not to react if the government announced social security payments would all stop in 2018?
guelo 9y ago
Obama did not waive it in 2016.
brobinson 9y ago
What? I had to pay an individual mandate penalty on my 2015 tax return... If you're right, then the IRS owes me a refund.
- wang_li 9y ago
  https://hotair.com/archives/2014/03/12/oh-by-the-way-obama-just-quietly-suspended-obamacares-individual-mandate-until-2016/ https://hotair.com/archives/2014/03/12/oh-by-the-way-obama-j...
  - meritt 9y ago
    Hardship exemptions [1] are absolutely not the same thing as waiving the penalty. [1] https://www.healthcare.gov/health-coverage-exemptions/hardship-exemptions/ https://www.healthcare.gov/health-coverage-exemptions/hardsh...

technotony 9y ago

My view is that if the individual mandate is eliminated then other insurers will come into the market with cheaper plans that don't include everything (Eg mental health) so health costs for healthy self-employed folks will go down. The thing I've always hated about Obamacare was how healthy self employed folks are subsiding the unhealthy people, this happens because most people in their 20's or 30s are covered by work plans which have a better risk pool.

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
kxyvr 9y ago
I'm sure it will for some people. That said when I was 21, I was diagnosed and treated for stage 3 melanoma and I can assure you the drugs that I took during that year were not cheap. At this point, it's been more than a decade and I'm wonderfully healthy, but I'm considered a high-risk because of my past with cancer. Now, there's a very valid moral question as to whether or not I'm entitled to have my healthcare subsidized by others in a pool and I'm fine having that conversation. From an economic point of view, I'm just shy of my mid-thirties with an advanced degree, been in the black with a self-funded business for the last 4-5 years, and have the potential to release products in the near future that could return millions in tax dollars. However, I may be robbed of that opportunity if I'm unable to purchase health insurance that covers cancer. Certainly, that's a frustrating proposition given that the only major misstep that I had was being unfortunate enough to become afflicted with a disease not under my control. And, just in case someone is curious about high-risk pools, I actually currently carry insurance from one because the ACA marketplace in my state does not offer PPOs and I have one regular appointment out of state. Anyway, the coverage and cost of high-risk pools varied wildly from state to state. As an example, since I'm familiar with TX, prior to disbanding the pool, the law allowed high-risk individuals to purchase insurance at twice the prevailing rate from the pool. If I recall correctly, its pool used a PPO, which is no longer found on the exchange, so we'll use a gold plan EPO to approximate. In Harris county, the current premium for that rate is $429/month with an out of pocket max of $6350. If we went back to the old model of twice the prevailing rate, I'd have to budget $16,646/year, which isn't all that far off from what it used to be. Now, that's just TX and different states had different rules. In the state I'm currently in, the 2018 premium will be $514/month with a $5000 out of pocket max. And, to be clear, there is cheaper health insurance available, but my perspective of coverage and costs changed dramatically after my illness. Health insurance doesn't mean much if it doesn't cover the doctors you trust for a price you can afford. Anyway, my point is that just because someone is in their 30's and healthy doesn't mean that their coverage will become cheaper or even attainable. Further, this has broad economic implications because it will quite simply force many of us out of the self-employed market because it's not responsible to carry an insurance plan that does not provide comprehensive coverage. This tax plan has been touted as helping small businesses, but it may end mine depending on what happens to the market in 2019.