6 ms·

I sometimes wonder which materials I directly interact with on a regular basis that people in a few decades wouldn't touch for anything short of large amounts o

by ashark 9y ago

I sometimes wonder which materials I directly interact with on a regular basis that people in a few decades wouldn't touch for anything short of large amounts of money. History tells us there are probably a few. Guessing at least a couple are plastics or plastic additives/coatings of some kind. Maybe whatever they replaced BPA with. Possibly gasoline will qualify. Probably one or two things currently on/in our food.

johnchristopher 9y ago
Some years ago (and I mean decades) my teenage self read somewhere or heard someone talking of the unknown dangers of some gas being released by motherboards (think: silent killers).
- gech 9y ago
  Interesting - found this https://ask.slashdot.org/story/02/09/09/1828240/gassing-off---motherboards-that-smell https://ask.slashdot.org/story/02/09/09/1828240/gassing-off-... The manufacturing process might not have been completed, the solders etc.
- Moru 9y ago
  That is usually flame retardant: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flame_retardant https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flame_retardant
  - johnchristopher 9y ago
    Thanks, that looks like it.
vanderZwan 9y ago
I expect the practice of of "sous vide in plastic bags" to be shown as long-term unhealthy sooner or later. It's one of those things where I wonder if the plastics really are as safe as claimed, or just "safer than the standard we set (and we didn't set it high, and our way of measuring is flawed)".
- test6554 9y ago
  It's a good point. I can't remember the last time I saw a plastic bag that gave a safe temperature range right there on the bag or package containing the bags. You'd think they would say Safe for food up to 200 degrees F or something.
  - jordanb 9y ago
    My Mom feels guilty that she used those "sterile" plastic bags in our baby bottles when we were little. Of course they were BPA.
test6554 9y ago
I thought it was common knowledge that you don't want your skin to come in contact with gasoline, and if it does to wash it off relatively quickly.
- megaman22 9y ago
  I dunno, we used to use gasoline to scrub off oil-based paint and stains...
AskewEgret 9y ago
Nanoparticles. They irritate your lungs in ways that are very similar to asbestos irritation. And of course, it's your body's reaction to the irritation that kills you. Example: http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/acsnano.7b01873 http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/acsnano.7b01873
- copperx 9y ago
  So I'm assuming that includes zinc oxide sunscreen, which is touted as the "least harmful sunscreen" there is.
  - vanderZwan 9y ago
    Well, that a cream, not dust. So is more of a skin issue, so then the question there is whether it penetrates the skin and turns out to do stuff to the tissue underneath. I guess that the problem with a lot of these things is that we don't have good (enough?) predictive models for long-term damage.
  - KozmoNau7 9y ago
    I sure hope not, as it's the only type of sunscreen that really works for me.
    - copperx 9y ago
      Do you get burned when using other sunscreens?
      - KozmoNau7 9y ago
        I have to use at least SPF 50, and if I'm out in the sun all day, even that is definitely reaching its limits, I need the physical sunscreen as well.
nether 9y ago
Sunblock I bet. Rubbing that cream into your skin multiple times per day can't be good. In the hiking community, many hikers are moving to sun blocking clothing. There are even sun gloves now.
- copperx 9y ago
  Why is sunblock bad while moisturizers ok?
  - allenz 9y ago
    Presumably sunblock is more chemically exotic and thus is more likely to be harmful due to greater variance in harm, lack of knowledge about the mechanisms of harm, inability to fully characterize the harm using current tests, etc.
leggomylibro 9y ago
The diesel fumes you get from walking along any road will probably be high on the list. One reason why that VW scandal was so morally objectionable is that diesel emissions are fairly local pollutants. Skimping on filtering them offloads an extreme negative externality to every person who gets near your customer/product; it's like poisoning a well. And of course, VW sure isn't alone in cutting inconvenient corners for cash. Lead solder will probably also be up there. Yeah, yeah, ROHS and REACH and whatever, but there are plenty of exemptions and the barrel-scrapers just ignore them anyways.
- kaybe 9y ago
  Funfact: The highest concentration of NO2 is not found around pedestrians but inside the cars. Most models don't have suitable filter in the standard issue outside of Europe and Japan (and there only the higher-class private ones).
  - megy 9y ago
    Good, exactly where it should be highest.
    - kaybe 9y ago
      Sometimes I can't help but think so too, but many people are not on the road by choice. Many commercial vehicles don't have filters.
  - copperx 9y ago
    Are we talking about the cabin air filter? and do you know of any 3rd party suitable replacements?
    - copperx 9y ago
      Post append: According to [1], a simple activated charcoal cabin air filter is better than the stock one in removing diesel exhaust particles. [1]: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24621126 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24621126
cstrat 9y ago
I think we are about to go through a change in how flame retardants are classified and handled. The chemicals in use today (in clothing, mattresses, lounges and other fabrics) are known toxic and carcinogenic.
chiefalchemist 9y ago
I predict you can put your screen based electronic devices at the top of that list.
DonHopkins 9y ago
I was shocked to discover that my apartment had lead flashing around the roof and balcony, so I researched it a bit, and read some reassuring stuff claiming it was safe (and has less toxic run-off than zinc), and some other less-than-reassuring stuff, so I'm not totally convinced it's safe for my cats to sit in contact with on the balcony. Of course workers installing it must be careful, but it's claimed to be not harmful to people using the building, or to the environment (from run-off). Just don't lick it or let kids play with it. On principle, I'd rather have flashing that's ok to lick, and safe for kids to play with and cats to sit on, but that's just not an option at this time. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flashing_(weatherproofing) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flashing_(weatherproofing) Not only flashing, but entire roofs can be covered in lead sheeting! https://nl.pinterest.com/pin/381680137144209527/?lp=true https://nl.pinterest.com/pin/381680137144209527/?lp=true Lead Flashing: Is it Dangerous? http://bestqualityroofingandchimney.blogspot.nl/2015/01/lead-flashing-is-it-dangerous.html http://bestqualityroofingandchimney.blogspot.nl/2015/01/lead... Are lead roofing and flashings a problem? https://www.fs.fed.us/eng/toolbox/haz/haz22.htm https://www.fs.fed.us/eng/toolbox/haz/haz22.htm Lead roofing and flashings are much more likely to be a health hazard for people working with the materials than for people using the building. Lead has been used for roofing for centuries and is one of the oldest flashing materials. It is durable and soft enough to be formed into complex shapes. Lead roofing and flashings can last over 200 years. Generally speaking, lead roofing or flashing that is in good shape may safely be left in place. Lead can be used safely if worker exposure is monitored and lead is handled properly to avoid skin contact, ingestion, and exposure to lead dust and fumes. Lead Sheet Goes Full Circle: https://elsia.org.uk/sustainability/other-research/ https://elsia.org.uk/sustainability/other-research/ This document sets out to provide a scientifically sound appraisal of the use of lead sheet in construction applications. Research findings in the document show that lead sheet poses no risk to the environment, even when water run-off is taken into account, and does not present any risk to human beings. Providing simple hygienic precautions are observed people who handle significant quantities of lead do not expose themselves to health risks. Low environmental impact of lead sheet on buildings A study conducted in 2005 looked at the environmental impact of lead sheet used in the building industry. With the following conclusions: There is no risk related to emissions of lead sheet into the environment. These conclusions are still valid even if it is assumed that all building roofs are disconnected from the sewer system and that the runoff enters the environment directly. Chemical hazards: Lead: http://www.health.gov.au/internet/publications/publishing.nsf/Content/ohp-enhealth-raintank-cnt-l~ohp-enhealth-raintank-cnt-l-4~ohp-enhealth-raintank-cnt-l-4.2 http://www.health.gov.au/internet/publications/publishing.ns... Surveys of rainwater from domestic tanks have identified lead contamination as a potential problem. Results have been variable with exceedances of the ADWG health-related guideline value of 10 µg/L (NHMRC & NRMMC 2004) ranging from 0% to 15% of samples collected (SA Health unpublished results 1999-2009; Simmons et al. 2001; Chapman et al. 2006 and 2008; Morrow et al. 2007; Huston et al. 2009; Rodrigo et al. 2009). In addition to these results a survey in Melbourne recorded a particularly high exceedance frequency of 33% (Magyar 2008). As discussed in other sections the reduction of lead concentrations in paint and the introduction of lead free petrol have decreased the risk from paint and general traffic emissions. However, roof materials and uncoated lead flashing in particular remain a potential source of contamination (Simmons et al. 2001; Chapman et al. 2006; Magyar et al. 2008; Huston et al. 2009), as rainwater tends to be acidic and may mobilise lead, and possibly other metals, into solution. The increasing availability of lead-free or coated lead flashing is expected to reduce future concentrations of lead in rainwater tanks. Roof catchments used in the collection of rainwater for drinking should not include uncoated lead flashing. Alternative materials should be used in new roofs or when renovating or extending roofs. In existing roofs, painting of uncoated flashing will reduce the risk of contamination. Lead may also enter rainwater from lead washers for roofing screws. These can be replaced with plastic washers. Leaching of lead into roof run-off may be more of a problem from poorly maintained roofs and gutters, where the process could be increased by the action of water made acidic with organic substances from materials such as leaf litter.
KozmoNau7 9y ago
Gasoline is absolutely already on that list. It's a little bit crazy that we're allowed to interact so casually with such a potent solvent and known carcinogen (mostly due to the benzene content) on an everyday basis.

by ashark 9y ago

johnchristopher 9y ago

Some years ago (and I mean decades) my teenage self read somewhere or heard someone talking of the unknown dangers of some gas being released by motherboards (think: silent killers).

gech 9y ago
Interesting - found this https://ask.slashdot.org/story/02/09/09/1828240/gassing-off---motherboards-that-smell https://ask.slashdot.org/story/02/09/09/1828240/gassing-off-... The manufacturing process might not have been completed, the solders etc.
Moru 9y ago
That is usually flame retardant: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flame_retardant https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flame_retardant
- johnchristopher 9y ago
  Thanks, that looks like it.

vanderZwan 9y ago

I expect the practice of of "sous vide in plastic bags" to be shown as long-term unhealthy sooner or later. It's one of those things where I wonder if the plastics really are as safe as claimed, or just "safer than the standard we set (and we didn't set it high, and our way of measuring is flawed)".

test6554 9y ago
It's a good point. I can't remember the last time I saw a plastic bag that gave a safe temperature range right there on the bag or package containing the bags. You'd think they would say Safe for food up to 200 degrees F or something.
- jordanb 9y ago
  My Mom feels guilty that she used those "sterile" plastic bags in our baby bottles when we were little. Of course they were BPA.

test6554 9y ago

I thought it was common knowledge that you don't want your skin to come in contact with gasoline, and if it does to wash it off relatively quickly.

megaman22 9y ago
I dunno, we used to use gasoline to scrub off oil-based paint and stains...

AskewEgret 9y ago

Nanoparticles. They irritate your lungs in ways that are very similar to asbestos irritation. And of course, it's your body's reaction to the irritation that kills you. Example: http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/acsnano.7b01873 http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/acsnano.7b01873

copperx 9y ago
So I'm assuming that includes zinc oxide sunscreen, which is touted as the "least harmful sunscreen" there is.
- vanderZwan 9y ago
  Well, that a cream, not dust. So is more of a skin issue, so then the question there is whether it penetrates the skin and turns out to do stuff to the tissue underneath. I guess that the problem with a lot of these things is that we don't have good (enough?) predictive models for long-term damage.
- KozmoNau7 9y ago
  I sure hope not, as it's the only type of sunscreen that really works for me.
  - copperx 9y ago
    Do you get burned when using other sunscreens?
    - KozmoNau7 9y ago
      I have to use at least SPF 50, and if I'm out in the sun all day, even that is definitely reaching its limits, I need the physical sunscreen as well.

nether 9y ago

Sunblock I bet. Rubbing that cream into your skin multiple times per day can't be good. In the hiking community, many hikers are moving to sun blocking clothing. There are even sun gloves now.

copperx 9y ago
Why is sunblock bad while moisturizers ok?
- allenz 9y ago
  Presumably sunblock is more chemically exotic and thus is more likely to be harmful due to greater variance in harm, lack of knowledge about the mechanisms of harm, inability to fully characterize the harm using current tests, etc.

leggomylibro 9y ago

The diesel fumes you get from walking along any road will probably be high on the list. One reason why that VW scandal was so morally objectionable is that diesel emissions are fairly local pollutants. Skimping on filtering them offloads an extreme negative externality to every person who gets near your customer/product; it's like poisoning a well. And of course, VW sure isn't alone in cutting inconvenient corners for cash. Lead solder will probably also be up there. Yeah, yeah, ROHS and REACH and whatever, but there are plenty of exemptions and the barrel-scrapers just ignore them anyways.

kaybe 9y ago
Funfact: The highest concentration of NO2 is not found around pedestrians but inside the cars. Most models don't have suitable filter in the standard issue outside of Europe and Japan (and there only the higher-class private ones).
- megy 9y ago
  Good, exactly where it should be highest.
  - kaybe 9y ago
    Sometimes I can't help but think so too, but many people are not on the road by choice. Many commercial vehicles don't have filters.
- copperx 9y ago
  Are we talking about the cabin air filter? and do you know of any 3rd party suitable replacements?
  - copperx 9y ago
    Post append: According to [1], a simple activated charcoal cabin air filter is better than the stock one in removing diesel exhaust particles. [1]: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24621126 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24621126

cstrat 9y ago

I think we are about to go through a change in how flame retardants are classified and handled. The chemicals in use today (in clothing, mattresses, lounges and other fabrics) are known toxic and carcinogenic.

chiefalchemist 9y ago

I predict you can put your screen based electronic devices at the top of that list.

DonHopkins 9y ago

I was shocked to discover that my apartment had lead flashing around the roof and balcony, so I researched it a bit, and read some reassuring stuff claiming it was safe (and has less toxic run-off than zinc), and some other less-than-reassuring stuff, so I'm not totally convinced it's safe for my cats to sit in contact with on the balcony. Of course workers installing it must be careful, but it's claimed to be not harmful to people using the building, or to the environment (from run-off). Just don't lick it or let kids play with it. On principle, I'd rather have flashing that's ok to lick, and safe for kids to play with and cats to sit on, but that's just not an option at this time. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flashing_(weatherproofing) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flashing_(weatherproofing) Not only flashing, but entire roofs can be covered in lead sheeting! https://nl.pinterest.com/pin/381680137144209527/?lp=true https://nl.pinterest.com/pin/381680137144209527/?lp=true Lead Flashing: Is it Dangerous? http://bestqualityroofingandchimney.blogspot.nl/2015/01/lead-flashing-is-it-dangerous.html http://bestqualityroofingandchimney.blogspot.nl/2015/01/lead... Are lead roofing and flashings a problem? https://www.fs.fed.us/eng/toolbox/haz/haz22.htm https://www.fs.fed.us/eng/toolbox/haz/haz22.htm Lead roofing and flashings are much more likely to be a health hazard for people working with the materials than for people using the building. Lead has been used for roofing for centuries and is one of the oldest flashing materials. It is durable and soft enough to be formed into complex shapes. Lead roofing and flashings can last over 200 years. Generally speaking, lead roofing or flashing that is in good shape may safely be left in place. Lead can be used safely if worker exposure is monitored and lead is handled properly to avoid skin contact, ingestion, and exposure to lead dust and fumes. Lead Sheet Goes Full Circle: https://elsia.org.uk/sustainability/other-research/ https://elsia.org.uk/sustainability/other-research/ This document sets out to provide a scientifically sound appraisal of the use of lead sheet in construction applications. Research findings in the document show that lead sheet poses no risk to the environment, even when water run-off is taken into account, and does not present any risk to human beings. Providing simple hygienic precautions are observed people who handle significant quantities of lead do not expose themselves to health risks. Low environmental impact of lead sheet on buildings A study conducted in 2005 looked at the environmental impact of lead sheet used in the building industry. With the following conclusions: There is no risk related to emissions of lead sheet into the environment. These conclusions are still valid even if it is assumed that all building roofs are disconnected from the sewer system and that the runoff enters the environment directly. Chemical hazards: Lead: http://www.health.gov.au/internet/publications/publishing.nsf/Content/ohp-enhealth-raintank-cnt-l~ohp-enhealth-raintank-cnt-l-4~ohp-enhealth-raintank-cnt-l-4.2 http://www.health.gov.au/internet/publications/publishing.ns... Surveys of rainwater from domestic tanks have identified lead contamination as a potential problem. Results have been variable with exceedances of the ADWG health-related guideline value of 10 µg/L (NHMRC & NRMMC 2004) ranging from 0% to 15% of samples collected (SA Health unpublished results 1999-2009; Simmons et al. 2001; Chapman et al. 2006 and 2008; Morrow et al. 2007; Huston et al. 2009; Rodrigo et al. 2009). In addition to these results a survey in Melbourne recorded a particularly high exceedance frequency of 33% (Magyar 2008). As discussed in other sections the reduction of lead concentrations in paint and the introduction of lead free petrol have decreased the risk from paint and general traffic emissions. However, roof materials and uncoated lead flashing in particular remain a potential source of contamination (Simmons et al. 2001; Chapman et al. 2006; Magyar et al. 2008; Huston et al. 2009), as rainwater tends to be acidic and may mobilise lead, and possibly other metals, into solution. The increasing availability of lead-free or coated lead flashing is expected to reduce future concentrations of lead in rainwater tanks. Roof catchments used in the collection of rainwater for drinking should not include uncoated lead flashing. Alternative materials should be used in new roofs or when renovating or extending roofs. In existing roofs, painting of uncoated flashing will reduce the risk of contamination. Lead may also enter rainwater from lead washers for roofing screws. These can be replaced with plastic washers. Leaching of lead into roof run-off may be more of a problem from poorly maintained roofs and gutters, where the process could be increased by the action of water made acidic with organic substances from materials such as leaf litter.

KozmoNau7 9y ago

Gasoline is absolutely already on that list. It's a little bit crazy that we're allowed to interact so casually with such a potent solvent and known carcinogen (mostly due to the benzene content) on an everyday basis.