4 ms·

What if you replaced your brain piecemeal, each replacement component interacting with your analog brain until there's none left. Still not you?

pmoriarty 9y ago
Yes, this would basically be death by brain damage -- even if I was somehow fooled in to thinking that I was still me at the point of death. Little by little I'd be made in to someone else. That said, it could be argued that this sort of thing happens all the time anyway. I'm not the person I once was. In a sense, the old me died and was replaced by the new me. Yet I still consider the new me to be myself. Or maybe not. The child me is dead, though echoes of him may live on in me. I guess what disturbs me about a mechanical/cybernetic brain replacement is that it would feel to me too much like some technological virus or disease taking over my mind and body -- even if it gave me some super powers or preserved me in some way. I guess some injured people or people who are dying anyway might not have much of a choice.. but as long as I still have a choice I think I'd choose to remain organic. It's not an easy choice, however, and I would have no problem use various prosthesis like glasses.. or enhancing my memory with external devices like smartphones/PDA's/computers. It's just too invasive for that to be made a part of me... at least if it starts to make decisions. But probably children born in to a world where that sort of thing was commonplace probably wouldn't have much of a problem with it.
- Jach 9y ago
  Fortunately there's a sizable chunk of the population that would have no inherent problems about preservation of identity, and even want to enjoy some of the implications that come from being able to run on a different substrate. http://ageofem.com/ http://ageofem.com/ explores the straightforward (i.e. nothing is done to prevent/alter it) scenario in quite thorough detail...
- whataretensors 9y ago
  Ehh, I'll take it over death.
  - pmoriarty 9y ago
    The point is that you'll still be dead. You'd just be fooling yourself in to thinking the clone you gave birth to is you, when it's really a separate entity whose existence does not prevent your own death at all.
    - tim333 9y ago
      Every day the me that wakes up is a bit different to the me that went to sleep so I guess by that reasoning the old me is dead and I'm just fooling myself the the new me is the old me living on. It seems to work ok though.
- ahnick 9y ago
  Right, exactly. Cells die and are replaced all the time. Sometimes people have vital organs transplanted. Yet, I assume most people still consider that their current body is "them". What would be weird is if you kept the old you and the new you. You could finally have a real conversation with yourself.
  - pmoriarty 9y ago
    "Sometimes people have vital organs transplanted. Yet, I assume most people still consider that their current body is 'them'." They don't necessarily. Some people do feel like they're not themselves after organ transplants. Like their hand isn't theirs after a hand transplant.. or that it has a mind of its own. Some experience personality changes or feel like the new body parts have their own desires. Oliver Sacks and other neurologists and psychologists have written about and studied this phenomena. Gradual brain replacement might have none of these issues, or it might have them, or even worse ones, or perhaps the changes will be more insidious and not noticeable by the people who they have them but could be noticeable by others. Even in the best case scenario, when they're without these neurological or psychological issues, that would not clear them on the philosophical level. The questions of identity would remain.
    - ahnick 9y ago
      I think this is likely implementation issues. Transplanting a different persons hand to your body that doesn't look like your hand probably would be quite jarring. If we could recreate an exact replica of someones hand then I doubt the same issues would occur. Ergo it is likely a technological problem that could be solved. Granted, it will likely take a long time to get to that state.
      - pmoriarty 9y ago
        It's not necessarily about looks. People have had similar issues with heart transplants and other organ transplants, when they've felt afterwards like they weren't themselves anymore, or that there was something foreign about their body (which technically there was). The uploaded consciousness or gradual brain replacement are pretty different from this case, though, it's true. So maybe these issues wouldn't exist or not exist in the same way, but philosophical issues of identity would remain.

pmoriarty 9y ago

Yes, this would basically be death by brain damage -- even if I was somehow fooled in to thinking that I was still me at the point of death. Little by little I'd be made in to someone else. That said, it could be argued that this sort of thing happens all the time anyway. I'm not the person I once was. In a sense, the old me died and was replaced by the new me. Yet I still consider the new me to be myself. Or maybe not. The child me is dead, though echoes of him may live on in me. I guess what disturbs me about a mechanical/cybernetic brain replacement is that it would feel to me too much like some technological virus or disease taking over my mind and body -- even if it gave me some super powers or preserved me in some way. I guess some injured people or people who are dying anyway might not have much of a choice.. but as long as I still have a choice I think I'd choose to remain organic. It's not an easy choice, however, and I would have no problem use various prosthesis like glasses.. or enhancing my memory with external devices like smartphones/PDA's/computers. It's just too invasive for that to be made a part of me... at least if it starts to make decisions. But probably children born in to a world where that sort of thing was commonplace probably wouldn't have much of a problem with it.

Jach 9y ago
Fortunately there's a sizable chunk of the population that would have no inherent problems about preservation of identity, and even want to enjoy some of the implications that come from being able to run on a different substrate. http://ageofem.com/ http://ageofem.com/ explores the straightforward (i.e. nothing is done to prevent/alter it) scenario in quite thorough detail...
whataretensors 9y ago
Ehh, I'll take it over death.
- pmoriarty 9y ago
  The point is that you'll still be dead. You'd just be fooling yourself in to thinking the clone you gave birth to is you, when it's really a separate entity whose existence does not prevent your own death at all.
  - tim333 9y ago
    Every day the me that wakes up is a bit different to the me that went to sleep so I guess by that reasoning the old me is dead and I'm just fooling myself the the new me is the old me living on. It seems to work ok though.
ahnick 9y ago
Right, exactly. Cells die and are replaced all the time. Sometimes people have vital organs transplanted. Yet, I assume most people still consider that their current body is "them". What would be weird is if you kept the old you and the new you. You could finally have a real conversation with yourself.
- pmoriarty 9y ago
  "Sometimes people have vital organs transplanted. Yet, I assume most people still consider that their current body is 'them'." They don't necessarily. Some people do feel like they're not themselves after organ transplants. Like their hand isn't theirs after a hand transplant.. or that it has a mind of its own. Some experience personality changes or feel like the new body parts have their own desires. Oliver Sacks and other neurologists and psychologists have written about and studied this phenomena. Gradual brain replacement might have none of these issues, or it might have them, or even worse ones, or perhaps the changes will be more insidious and not noticeable by the people who they have them but could be noticeable by others. Even in the best case scenario, when they're without these neurological or psychological issues, that would not clear them on the philosophical level. The questions of identity would remain.
  - ahnick 9y ago
    I think this is likely implementation issues. Transplanting a different persons hand to your body that doesn't look like your hand probably would be quite jarring. If we could recreate an exact replica of someones hand then I doubt the same issues would occur. Ergo it is likely a technological problem that could be solved. Granted, it will likely take a long time to get to that state.
    - pmoriarty 9y ago
      It's not necessarily about looks. People have had similar issues with heart transplants and other organ transplants, when they've felt afterwards like they weren't themselves anymore, or that there was something foreign about their body (which technically there was). The uploaded consciousness or gradual brain replacement are pretty different from this case, though, it's true. So maybe these issues wouldn't exist or not exist in the same way, but philosophical issues of identity would remain.