5 ms·

Walter Isaacson Goes Inside the Mind of Leonardo Da Vinci

50 points by dayve 9y ago

sarcasm_heals 9y ago
Isaacson recently gave a promotional talk on the KERA Think podcast: http://think.kera.org/2017/10/18/the-strange-and-wonderful-mind-of-leonardo-da-vinci/ http://think.kera.org/2017/10/18/the-strange-and-wonderful-m...
te_chris 9y ago
The Observer (Sunday Guardian) gave this a glowing review yesterday. Very interested in this book.
SCAQTony 9y ago
What troubled me about the article is that it implies Leonardo was a peaceful man yet these are points 4, 5 and 6 in in his resume: "... 4. Again, I have kinds of mortars; most convenient and easy to carry; and with these I can fling small stones almost resembling a storm; and with the smoke of these cause great terror to the enemy, to his great detriment and confusion. 5. And if the fight should be at sea I have kinds of many machines most efficient for offense and defense; and vessels which will resist the attack of the largest guns and powder and fumes. 6. I have means by secret and tortuous mines and ways, made without noise, to reach a designated spot, even if it were needed to pass under a trench or a river. ..." http://www.openculture.com/2014/01/leonardo-da-vincis-handwritten-resume-1482.html http://www.openculture.com/2014/01/leonardo-da-vincis-handwr...
- d0mine 9y ago
  It is likely he needed money for his projects. War sells.
ancorevard 9y ago
He did certainly not. LDV has been asleep for years. He is dead. His remains are but dust. Isaacson has more likely been using his great imagination to write an exciting read. He has performed wonderfully at this in the past with other long-dead individuals. But in the cases where the person was only recently deceased and still present in first-hand memories of living individuals, Isaacson has been found to do a dismal job.
- aaron-lebo 9y ago
  What was wrong with Isaacson's biography of Jobs? I think unless it was exceptional it was going to make people unhappy, but I don't recall it being "dismal". Becoming Steve Jobs is better, though.
  - MBCook 9y ago
    It got basic facts wrong. Lots of them. Things you could easily google or ask anyone who knew a bit about computers. Gruber wrote some about it on DF: https://daringfireball.net/2012/02/walter_isaacson_steve_jobs https://daringfireball.net/2012/02/walter_isaacson_steve_job... I believe there is an entire episode of Connected or ATP about errors in the book from when it came out. Sloppy research, unasked questions, not talking to other primary sources. Just a GIANT missed opportunity/mistake.
    - henrikeh 9y ago
      To be very specific episode 42 and 43 of John Siracusa’s Hypercritical are about the book and Siracusas opinion of it. Albeit there is a lot of nit picking — especially in the latter episode — his overall point is that Isaacson’s book did not use the opportunity of having access to Jobs and the people around him. Specifically he didn’t know the industry and — apparently from the book — bother to learn about it. But relating to a bio on da Vinci? He doesn’t have exclusive access so the argument doesn’t transfer. Hypercritical: 42: The Wrong Guy https://overcast.fm/+IplN7GcE/18:32 https://overcast.fm/+IplN7GcE/18:32
      - MBCook 9y ago
        I loved Hypercritical. It didn’t occur to me that would be the podcast. Thanks. The asking the right questions thing doesn’t apply but the quality of research that he showed in his biography of Jobs makes me doubt the level of work/research in other biographies he writes.
  - mercer 9y ago
    My biggest problem was that 1) he really seemed obsessed about Jobs 'crying', and 2) he skipped over what struck me as one of the most important periods of his life: the 'wilderness' of his ex-Apple days before his return. Especially 2 is a part I had not read too much about, and I was really disappointed that he just kind of skipped the NeXT days.
jtth 9y ago
So half of what he says will be completely wrong, possibly intentionally so?
- rothbardrand 9y ago
  What I found really infuriating about his novel about Jobs was he would quote Jobs saying something true, something that anyone who knows the history or Apple or technology of the time knows is true, and then refer to unnamed other sources who claimed that this was a lie, and then assert that it's an example of Jobs lying. What a hatchet job. Worst mistake Jobs ever made was trusting that guy.
nickm12 9y ago
After Issacson's botched Steve Job's biography, I have a difficult time trusting him for any historical figure. Issacson had unprecedented access to Steve Jobs, yet the biography really didn't provide any new insight into what made him who he was.
- jotjotzzz 9y ago
  It's also possibly partly due to Steve Jobs and his RDF (reality distortion field). I actually found that biography pretty good. I think he did the best that he could with it. By presenting all points of view, its really up to you to decide. I don't think he ever said he is a liar (as someone commented) -- not sure how he could have done that. If you're reading that biography as if it's the freaking bible of Steve Jobs, then no. But it showed a lot of the sides of Steve that I did not know before and did not like. I knew he was an a-hole, but didn't know how low he had gone. I especially found the part about his first wife and daughter Lisa so very, very sad -- and he made Woz cry. What a guy.
  - astrodust 9y ago
    It's not that he was a liar, it's that he was granted a unique opportunity to write a book unlike anything anyone else could write and delivered that...turd. Sure, deadlines, pressure, but honestly, it was 80% junk that had already been written in other books or articles, 10% "why are you asking these dumb questions" and only 10% actual insight. It was a surprising weak effort is all. People expected something of more substance. It's a shame someone like Michael Lewis wasn't at bat for that book. He seems more able to dig through the layers and find out the actual story. The New New Thing gets into fantastic detail about Jim Clark even though he's just one of the people in that book.
    - MilnerRoute 9y ago
      I've always liked Steven Levy's book about Apple, Insanely Great. (He released an updated version not too long ago.) I also thought he did a great job with the profiles of historic computing pioneers in Hackers: Heroes of the Computer Revolution. (One of the few books that users the word "hackers" properly...)
MilnerRoute 9y ago
I remember a fun discussion Isaacson once had about Benjamin Franklin. After finishing a 608-page biography about Franklin's life, Isaacson was asked "Would Ben Franklin be a blogger if he were alive today?" http://www.10zenmonkeys.com/2007/12/11/what-if-ben-were-one-of-us/ http://www.10zenmonkeys.com/2007/12/11/what-if-ben-were-one-... Isaacson, who'd written a 608-page biography of Franklin, insisted that the answer was no — "not a blogger." The distinction was that Franklin "polished every word." But the question was too provocative to leave without more discussion. Ben Franklin would have a web site, Isaacson speculated. "It would be carefully crafted. It would be more like Andrew Sullivan than your normal blogger in pajamas."

50 points by dayve 9y ago

Isaacson recently gave a promotional talk on the KERA Think podcast: http://think.kera.org/2017/10/18/the-strange-and-wonderful-mind-of-leonardo-da-vinci/ http://think.kera.org/2017/10/18/the-strange-and-wonderful-m...

te_chris 9y ago

The Observer (Sunday Guardian) gave this a glowing review yesterday. Very interested in this book.

SCAQTony 9y ago

What troubled me about the article is that it implies Leonardo was a peaceful man yet these are points 4, 5 and 6 in in his resume: "... 4. Again, I have kinds of mortars; most convenient and easy to carry; and with these I can fling small stones almost resembling a storm; and with the smoke of these cause great terror to the enemy, to his great detriment and confusion. 5. And if the fight should be at sea I have kinds of many machines most efficient for offense and defense; and vessels which will resist the attack of the largest guns and powder and fumes. 6. I have means by secret and tortuous mines and ways, made without noise, to reach a designated spot, even if it were needed to pass under a trench or a river. ..." http://www.openculture.com/2014/01/leonardo-da-vincis-handwritten-resume-1482.html http://www.openculture.com/2014/01/leonardo-da-vincis-handwr...

d0mine 9y ago
It is likely he needed money for his projects. War sells.

ancorevard 9y ago

He did certainly not. LDV has been asleep for years. He is dead. His remains are but dust. Isaacson has more likely been using his great imagination to write an exciting read. He has performed wonderfully at this in the past with other long-dead individuals. But in the cases where the person was only recently deceased and still present in first-hand memories of living individuals, Isaacson has been found to do a dismal job.

aaron-lebo 9y ago
What was wrong with Isaacson's biography of Jobs? I think unless it was exceptional it was going to make people unhappy, but I don't recall it being "dismal". Becoming Steve Jobs is better, though.
- MBCook 9y ago
  It got basic facts wrong. Lots of them. Things you could easily google or ask anyone who knew a bit about computers. Gruber wrote some about it on DF: https://daringfireball.net/2012/02/walter_isaacson_steve_jobs https://daringfireball.net/2012/02/walter_isaacson_steve_job... I believe there is an entire episode of Connected or ATP about errors in the book from when it came out. Sloppy research, unasked questions, not talking to other primary sources. Just a GIANT missed opportunity/mistake.
  - henrikeh 9y ago
    To be very specific episode 42 and 43 of John Siracusa’s Hypercritical are about the book and Siracusas opinion of it. Albeit there is a lot of nit picking — especially in the latter episode — his overall point is that Isaacson’s book did not use the opportunity of having access to Jobs and the people around him. Specifically he didn’t know the industry and — apparently from the book — bother to learn about it. But relating to a bio on da Vinci? He doesn’t have exclusive access so the argument doesn’t transfer. Hypercritical: 42: The Wrong Guy https://overcast.fm/+IplN7GcE/18:32 https://overcast.fm/+IplN7GcE/18:32
    - MBCook 9y ago
      I loved Hypercritical. It didn’t occur to me that would be the podcast. Thanks. The asking the right questions thing doesn’t apply but the quality of research that he showed in his biography of Jobs makes me doubt the level of work/research in other biographies he writes.
- mercer 9y ago
  My biggest problem was that 1) he really seemed obsessed about Jobs 'crying', and 2) he skipped over what struck me as one of the most important periods of his life: the 'wilderness' of his ex-Apple days before his return. Especially 2 is a part I had not read too much about, and I was really disappointed that he just kind of skipped the NeXT days.

jtth 9y ago

So half of what he says will be completely wrong, possibly intentionally so?

rothbardrand 9y ago
What I found really infuriating about his novel about Jobs was he would quote Jobs saying something true, something that anyone who knows the history or Apple or technology of the time knows is true, and then refer to unnamed other sources who claimed that this was a lie, and then assert that it's an example of Jobs lying. What a hatchet job. Worst mistake Jobs ever made was trusting that guy.

nickm12 9y ago

After Issacson's botched Steve Job's biography, I have a difficult time trusting him for any historical figure. Issacson had unprecedented access to Steve Jobs, yet the biography really didn't provide any new insight into what made him who he was.

jotjotzzz 9y ago
It's also possibly partly due to Steve Jobs and his RDF (reality distortion field). I actually found that biography pretty good. I think he did the best that he could with it. By presenting all points of view, its really up to you to decide. I don't think he ever said he is a liar (as someone commented) -- not sure how he could have done that. If you're reading that biography as if it's the freaking bible of Steve Jobs, then no. But it showed a lot of the sides of Steve that I did not know before and did not like. I knew he was an a-hole, but didn't know how low he had gone. I especially found the part about his first wife and daughter Lisa so very, very sad -- and he made Woz cry. What a guy.
- astrodust 9y ago
  It's not that he was a liar, it's that he was granted a unique opportunity to write a book unlike anything anyone else could write and delivered that...turd. Sure, deadlines, pressure, but honestly, it was 80% junk that had already been written in other books or articles, 10% "why are you asking these dumb questions" and only 10% actual insight. It was a surprising weak effort is all. People expected something of more substance. It's a shame someone like Michael Lewis wasn't at bat for that book. He seems more able to dig through the layers and find out the actual story. The New New Thing gets into fantastic detail about Jim Clark even though he's just one of the people in that book.
  - MilnerRoute 9y ago
    I've always liked Steven Levy's book about Apple, Insanely Great. (He released an updated version not too long ago.) I also thought he did a great job with the profiles of historic computing pioneers in Hackers: Heroes of the Computer Revolution. (One of the few books that users the word "hackers" properly...)

MilnerRoute 9y ago

I remember a fun discussion Isaacson once had about Benjamin Franklin. After finishing a 608-page biography about Franklin's life, Isaacson was asked "Would Ben Franklin be a blogger if he were alive today?" http://www.10zenmonkeys.com/2007/12/11/what-if-ben-were-one-of-us/ http://www.10zenmonkeys.com/2007/12/11/what-if-ben-were-one-... Isaacson, who'd written a 608-page biography of Franklin, insisted that the answer was no — "not a blogger." The distinction was that Franklin "polished every word." But the question was too provocative to leave without more discussion. Ben Franklin would have a web site, Isaacson speculated. "It would be carefully crafted. It would be more like Andrew Sullivan than your normal blogger in pajamas."