16 ms·

Linux on Samsung Galaxy smartphones

350 points by djvdorp 9y ago

herpderperator 9y ago
I did something like this (shared kernel and chroot) on an old Nexus S back in 2012 with Gentoo. You can use a precompiled stage3 tarball which contains the fundamental filesystem layout and utilities (for the target architecture), and then for anything else that you need, you just use Portage (Gentoo's package manager) to compile stuff for you. Not super practical in terms of battery life and time if you're constantly compiling packages but a cool project nonetheless. This wasn't the exact guide I used, but it's the same idea: http://thinkmoult.com/installing-gentoo-android-chroot/ http://thinkmoult.com/installing-gentoo-android-chroot/
- hdhzy 9y ago
  Very cool thanks for sharing! > Not super practical in terms of battery life Samsung avoided this problem by requiring that the phone is connected to the dock that is also charging it.
SakiWatanabe 9y ago
Engadget article: https://www.engadget.com/2017/10/19/samsung-introduces-linux-on-galaxy/ https://www.engadget.com/2017/10/19/samsung-introduces-linux...
turbinerneiter 9y ago
chroot ftw! (right?)
byterollingbits 9y ago
No thanks! I'm not buying a phone that won't get updated with security updates. My trash box is littered with Korean Android phones that have no upgrade path or ability to clean with a fresh install. I'm opting for a Pixel 2 and an iPhone X for work and personal. They're expensive at first, but way cheaper and far more convenient in the long run. They always have immediate security updates, and they update their OS for atleast 3 years. Korean phones are rip offs, they barely update at all. Every single one of my Korean phones are still waiting for security updates. It costs way more to own a Samsung or LG phone in the long run. Don't buy Samsung or LG phones.
- microcolonel 9y ago
  You sound like a bigot, dividing phone manufacturers by country. Nation and industry are not so close in Korea that you could conflate any one company (especially any one subdivision) with every other similar company in the country. The Pixel 2 and iPhone 8 are as Korean as a Kia. Surely you should not buy them, since they contain that pesky Korean commoditized OLED technology.
- swiley 9y ago
  It doesn't matter who the OEM is. All Android phones are now wrappers around the Qualcomm snapdragon SOCs if they're sold in the US. They all have the update problem because Qualcomm has refused to work with other organizations or maintain their kernel forks.
  - microcolonel 9y ago
    It's been getting better recently as third parties have taken on the work of maintaining drivers for Qualcomm chipsets, there are now a lot of their chipsets which can run on upstream kernels, and if Android kernels were closer to upstream, AOSP kernels could probably be built to function on some Qualcomm chipsets today.
- kasabali 9y ago
  Samsung is pretty good at security updates actually. See this 4.5 years old phone here [0] (july), or this 3.5 years old one [1] (september). 0: https://www.sammobile.com/firmwares/galaxy-s4/GT-I9505/ https://www.sammobile.com/firmwares/galaxy-s4/GT-I9505/ 1: https://www.sammobile.com/firmwares/galaxy-s5/SM-G900F/ https://www.sammobile.com/firmwares/galaxy-s5/SM-G900F/
djvdorp 9y ago
Samsung press release: http://www.samsungmobilepress.com/stories/samsung-dex's-expanding-ecosystem-pushes-the-possibilities-of-the-smartphone http://www.samsungmobilepress.com/stories/samsung-dex's-expa...
- saagarjha 9y ago
  > At Samsung, we continuously ask ourselves what else is possible, and what else we can do to bring a better experience for our users. Here's a tip: don't mess with my scrolling.
jankotek 9y ago
Can Galaxy even run without Linux kernel?
- pjmlp 9y ago
  In theory yes. Android doesn't expose a proper Linux to userspace and Google has been clapping down what we are allowed to do with the NDK since Android 7.0 (edit: corrected, only started in 7.0). So playing "what if", you can replace Linux with something else that is compatible the NDK APIs and no one would notice, other than the OEMs.
  - throwaway613834 9y ago
    > Android doesn't expose a proper Linux to userspace and Google has been clapping down what we are allowed to do with the NDK since Android 6.0. Would you have a link to more details/reading on this? I wasn't aware.
    - pjmlp 9y ago
      Here are the official NDK APIs. https://developer.android.com/ndk/guides/stable_apis.html https://developer.android.com/ndk/guides/stable_apis.html Here are the documentation entries related to clamping down unauthorized use of other on-device libraries or Linux Syscalls. https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2016/06/android-changes-for-ndk-developers.html https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2016/06/android-ch... https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2016/06/improving-stability-with-private-cc.html https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2016/06/improving-... https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2017/07/seccomp-filter-in-android-o.html https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2017/07/seccomp-fi... https://developer.android.com/about/versions/nougat/android-7.0-changes.html#ndk https://developer.android.com/about/versions/nougat/android-... https://developer.android.com/about/versions/oreo/android-8.0-changes.html#security-all https://developer.android.com/about/versions/oreo/android-8.... Small correction, it is actually Android 7.0, not 6.0
      - throwaway613834 9y ago
TheChaplain 9y ago
If I understand this correctly, it's a LXC with a distribution built by Samsung?
camillomiller 9y ago
Maybe 2018 is finally the year of the Linux desktop. Wait... :) Jokes aside, I can see how this would be useful for sysadmin and devs - bring along your smartphone and you're set - but this would never fly for a general, even if geeky, public. Very nice approach though, curious to see where this ends up going.
- herbst 9y ago
  To be fair this is already what we do. Android already IS linux. You can install plenty of scripting environments like Ruby or Python while having access to the underlaying Linux system which is only partly crippled. Personally i see this more as a marketing thing from Samsung than anything else.
  - CaptSpify 9y ago
    A shitty, half-assed linux. Until I can just put Debian on natively, and use apt-get for packages without a problem, I want us to keep moving to an actual linux on the phone. I'm quite eager to get away from android
    - herbst 9y ago
      I would love to get away from Android, but this is helping as much as Ubuntu on Windows is helping to get away from Windows. If you'd want debian natively this also was possible for a while, next to the option to have it run on a compatibility mode on top of your android kernel but does not even require root. Both methods supporting apt-get, X, and whatever else runs on ARM. Then there is also the Ubuntu phone project (which i assume is pretty much dead meanwhile) which has no Android in the mix at all. Except a possible compatibility layer for apps. Also its not a half-assed linux. Its just a linux that uses weird libraries to build their environment on which are not compatible with your desktop like environments.
      - CaptSpify 9y ago
        > I would love to get away from Android, but this is helping as much as Ubuntu on Windows is helping to get away from Windows. I'm not sure how much this helps, I'm just replying to the idea that we "Android already IS linux". That is technically true, but not practically true. I also don't want Debian to run on top of the android kernel, but I want to use Debian's kernel. The android one is pretty neutered and crappy. And yes, it is half-assed linux precisely because it's intentionally not compatible with desktop-like environments. Android has different goals than I want out of a phone, and that's perfectly fine, but that doesn't mean I have to be happy with Android as my only option (excluding IOS as that is a different beast altogether). Just because you are OK with it doesn't mean that I have to be, and every step further we take from Android, the better, IMO.
pjmlp 9y ago
Given how Tizen has been managed thus far I am not having big hopes for it, but lets see.
- bostand 9y ago
  Tizen on smartwatch is pretty awesome. Imho its miles ahead of the other watch OSes
  - pjmlp 9y ago
    I guess you never bother to actually program on it. Tizen already went through these reboots: 1 - Replaced Meego SDK with Bada OS SDK 2 - Replaced Bada OS SDK with EFL + C++ SDK 3 - Dropped C++ SDK and replaced a new pure C API alongside EFL 4 - Currently adopting .NET Core + Xamarin.Forms Then there is the whole issue of code quality. https://what.thedailywtf.com/topic/15001/enlightened https://what.thedailywtf.com/topic/15001/enlightened https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/07/12/samsungs_tizen_no_longer_worst_ever/ https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/07/12/samsungs_tizen_no_l...
    - bostand 9y ago
      I have, it has is quirks. With that said, use their smartwatches. The UI is so much better than the competition it's not even funny. And then you have Samsung pay card emulation magic....
    - distances 9y ago
      I never understood why Samsung didn't stick with Qt for Tizen. Was it because it was owned by Nokia back then? Everything they've tried to do on the UI layer is something I wouldn't touch with an eleven-foot pole.
    - wvenable 9y ago
      Samsung also has a webkit-Javascript based SDK as well. It's actually pretty good as it exposes a lot of OS functionality in the JavaScript API. It might be the best option right now.
JorgeGT 9y ago
It's quite interesting that with the power of today's mobile devices (multicore 1GHz+ CPUs, GPUs, 2Gb+ RAM) we still don't have a standardized interface to plug them into desktop peripherals and launch a desktop OS/GUI. One would thing that such an universal interface would quickly become a standard offering in airports, hotels, libraries, conferences, etc.
- baldfat 9y ago
  AT&T killed that idea fast 6 years ago. When the Motorola Atrix came out with the ability to do that AT&T charge a $20 tethering fee to use the laptop dock with the phone! That blew my mind. The phone wasn't tethering data to anything but itself. https://www.wired.com/2011/03/motorola-atrix/ https://www.wired.com/2011/03/motorola-atrix/
  - KozmoNau7 9y ago
    Tethering fees are another "brilliant" invention by the customer-hating American telcos. You get a set amount of data per month, for instance 20GB. Why should they care at all what you decide to use that data for?
    - maxerickson 9y ago
      Nah, they love their customers that happily shovel over large piles of money for whatever they happen to offer.
    - Brakenshire 9y ago
      Doesn't seem to be a thing in the UK, at least it hasn't been an issue for the 2 telecoms companies I've used.
      - ballade 9y ago
        As it is with most countries in Europe and I think many in Asia as well (correct me if I'm wrong). This is just an example of America's hardcore capitalism where certain markets are dominated by a few key players and the only entity capable of stopping them from enacting these batshit insane anti-consumer tactics are congress who are more than happy to take their bribes whilst shafting the average American consumer.
nickcw 9y ago
I think termux ( https://termux.com/ https://termux.com/ ) does most of what I need when I need a bit of emergency Linux on my phone. Termux provides a recompiled debian distro which runs as a android App. It doesn't chroot or need root and it works amazingly well. No desktop apps though.
- bostand 9y ago
  Another vote for termux! It's specially useful on chromeos
  - dreta 9y ago
    It’s more useful to have standard Linux installed, unless you’re incredibly sensitive about security. I treat Chromebooks as cheap Linux machines. You can buy a brand new netbook, and you know Linux will run on it with no driver issues. It’s still chroot, but you get everything you need to do development.
    - sfifs 9y ago
      You can install GalliumOS distribution and get full Linux on most Chromebooks. You can flash firmware and get a proper laptop too
- samuell 9y ago
  Wow, cool and really well working app! Now I only need to get me a great b/t keyboard that fits in a pocket :)
  - Tepix 9y ago
    The Waytools Textblade is still vaporware after 1000 days. Stay away from them until they ship a product.
  - jasonkostempski 9y ago
    When I was a kid, the phones had hardware keyboards built-in!
padraic7a 9y ago
This is definitely interesting and I would be curious to see where it goes in the future. In the meantime however anyone who wants to use Linux on their phone today should check out https://ubports.com/ https://ubports.com/ It works now!
- kagamine 9y ago
  I followed the link, but don't quite understand the product. Does Ubuntu Touch OnePlusOne replace the OS on the device? So I buy one of the supported phones listed, and then erase and replace Android with this in it's place? Or it installs on top of?
  - padraic7a 9y ago
    It replaces the OS, so you will lose everything you currently have on the phone. The installation process is similar to flashing a ROM and you can choose to reflash and move back to Android in the future.
    - kagamine 9y ago
      Actually sounds good. I'm tired of Apple devices going in a direction that doesn't fit with what I want, and have never been impressed with Android.
- eat_veggies 9y ago
  Does it still maintain phone functionality (sms, calling, data)?
  - padraic7a 9y ago
    Yep.
5h 9y ago
I've been using termux and a fold out bluetooth keyboard for django development & code review for quite a while on my pixel XL. I absolutely love having my dev work on my phone, being able to hack away or do code review for 5 minutes wherever is incredible. At home using a chrome-cast and have it on a big screen. It would be nice to have a window manager I suppose - but i'll probably end up in a full screen terminal anywya. When mobile the biggest problem for me is just plain old screen size - I'm tempted to get a cheap Chinese tablet and use it as a remote screen somehow - leaving my phone in my pocket.
- JepZ 9y ago
  Yeah, screen size sucks. Didn't Intel build some wireless screen technology a few years ago? Somehow I never saw it in action, but as far as I can imagine I would like to have a >24 inch screen which I could use as a normal Display Port monitor, but also via NFC (+ some magic wireless technology) as a wireless monitor for my smart phone. Does anybody know where I can buy such a device or why it is not yet available?
  - nrki 9y ago
    It's called WiDi / Miracast. It's in most Android phones. Many TVs support it, or you can buy an adapter.
- ansible 9y ago
  If you're going to carry a tablet and a BT keyboard, you might as well just get a light Chromebook instead. While I can run Linux locally via crouton, I mostly just SSH into my workstation and resume my screen sessions.
  - digi_owl 9y ago
    Depends a bit on how small you can get a chromebook. After all, the smallest tablets are in the 7-8" screen range, while most chromebooks i have seen are 10"+.
    - 9y ago
dobecker 9y ago
>> Thank you for showing your interest in the Samsung for Galaxy project This should be Linux for Galaxy right?
- Shengbo 9y ago
  Yes.
- Bretlei 9y ago
  I thought the same thing!
- castis 9y ago
  Could also be 'Thank you for showing your interest in Samsung for the Galaxy project'?
jaclaz 9y ago
As often happens, I don't understand why one would want to subscribe in order to be notified when it becomes public. I mean, I can understand subscribing in order to get a beta or pre-release, but if right now nothing is available and when it will be available it will be public, it seems to me nothing more than a personal data collection. When it will be public there will also be a lot of publicity about it, so it's not likely that one needs to be notified.
- pjmlp 9y ago
  The whole point is not to notify you, rather to get a feeling how much people would eventually buy it.
  - jaclaz 9y ago
    >The whole point is not to notify you, rather to get a feeling how much people would eventually buy it. Sure, but I wasn't expressing a doubt on why Samsung put that on, I was doubting why an end user would want to give away his/her name/email/company, substantially in exchange of nothing.
    - jhasse 9y ago
      Because he wants this to happen.
throwaway613834 9y ago
[OT] Does anybody have any idea when the Windows x86-on-ARM phones will come out? That's what I'm really waiting for and not seeing much information on.
MikusR 9y ago
https://twitter.com/TizenHelper/status/920507238485233664 https://twitter.com/TizenHelper/status/920507238485233664 Some pictures from a demo booth. Runs Ubuntu 16.04.2 on 4.4.13-1.
nopacience 9y ago
We need phone drivers! To enable us to install any distro or OS. I would love to download X distro directly from their website > install on the smartphone somehow > boot > install phone drivers > make calls I have nothing against Android. I would like to choose who creates the OS used on my smartphone
- morganvachon 9y ago
  > "I would love to download X distro directly from their website > install on the smartphone somehow > boot > install phone drivers > make calls" Unfortunately it will never be that simple. First, the distro you want would need to have an ARM port targeting the same version of ARM SoC in the phone. ARM isn't like x86 with just two targets (32 bit and 64 bit), it's a quagmire. Second, your distro of choice would need to stick with the exact kernel version used by the phone, and I guarantee if you take any three Android phones by three different manufacturers made in the past two years, you'll see three different kernel versions, each with tweaks made just for that device. Said tweaks would make it impossible to have a distro targeting all three devices even if they did have the exact same kernel version. Third, your distro maintainer would need to own or have access to every Android device she wished to target, and while that works for a community driven project like Lineage OS, it's not realistic for the lone Linux distro developer or small team who wants to add phones as targets for their existing desktop class distro.
  - swiley 9y ago
    >Unfortunately it will never be that simple. First, the distro you want would need to have an ARM port targeting the same version of ARM SoC in the phone. ARM isn't like x86 with just two targets (32 bit and 64 bit), it's a quagmire. People say this a lot but that's not my experience. I have a lot of ARM machines and move binaries and complete distros (sans kernel) between them all the time without recompiling. Everything after ARMv7 is pretty well behaved.
  - Brakenshire 9y ago
    > Second, your distro of choice would need to stick with the exact kernel version used by the phone, and I guarantee if you take any three Android phones by three different manufacturers made in the past two years, you'll see three different kernel versions, each with tweaks made just for that device. Said tweaks would make it impossible to have a distro targeting all three devices even if they did have the exact same kernel version. Would this apply for the new Purism phone? i.e. if all the drivers are upstreamed into the mainline kernel, does thstnot mean you can use any kernel past the point where the drivers are included, without modification?
dm319 9y ago
I can hear Shuttleworth swearing right now.
- tinco 9y ago
  Swearing? Don't you mean jubilating? Isn't Ubuntu on Samsung Galaxy phones exactly what he would want?
  - morganvachon 9y ago
    Who said it will be Ubuntu? If this is anything like past attempts at a Linux desktop running from a mobile phone, it will be a Samsung optimized (i.e. locked down) half baked chroot monstrosity with limited tools and locked to the phone's ancient, bastardized kernel with zero security updates from launch forward. I think it would be awesome and amazing if I was completely wrong about all of that, but I'm not holding my breath. I'd rather wait for the Pyra to release and carry two devices than torture myself with an impossible dream.
    - Jonnax 9y ago
      Here's a photo of it running Ubuntu 16.04 at a Samsung booth with a 4.4. Kernel. https://twitter.com/TizenHelper/status/920507238485233664 https://twitter.com/TizenHelper/status/920507238485233664
      - morganvachon 9y ago
        Thank you, that's refreshing to know they are supporting a major distro.
      - deusum 9y ago
        I spy a Virtual Box, no? The kernel looks too new for Android, as well. I'm guessing users here don't want the emu penalty, just extend what's already there a bit.
        9y ago
emilsedgh 9y ago
This is amazing. The reason we have high quality free software for desktops is that you can easily install anything you want on your laptops and PC's. Significance of this is that it allows free software stacks to be built for phones. Kudos to Samsung for such move. Let's hope other phone makers also open up the phones.
saagarjha 9y ago
> Linux on Galaxy allows the latest Samsung Galaxy smartphone users to run their preferred Linux distribution on their smartphones utilizing the same Linux kernel that powers the Android OS to ensure the best possible performance. (emphasis mine) I knew there was a catch somewhere. I seriously doubt there's a technical reason why older Galaxy models can't support running Linux as well. I don't understand why it's so difficult for Android manufacturers to allow users to install whatever they want–I bought my phone, now let me install what I want. Sure, void the warrant or refuse to support it, but don't get in my way.
- herbst 9y ago
  Just a side thought. But afaik in all of europe you do not void your warrant when you root your phone or otherwise brick it software sidely. Its usually written somewhere, but afaik not legally enforceable (because as you said, you bought the hardware).
- simonh 9y ago
  We're all used to having desktop computers with generic x86 compatible processors and highly standardized internal interfaces and components, and compiling our software and installing it on any x86 computer we want. Smartphones with ARM SOCs aren't like that because they aren't just a CPU, they also include a crapload of additional system components. Even SOCs like the Snapdragon within a specific model will offer many variations to the manufacturers. Outside the SOC itself, phone hardware is far less standardized than on a PC. You can't compile your Linux distro for ARM then install it on any smartphone, the kernel needs to be tailored to the specific phone. That's why even though unlocked Android phones are around it really takes the manufacturer themselves to be able to do something like this because only they have the detailed understanding of the platform and the resources. Otherwise, other people would be doing it.
  - saagarjha 9y ago
    In a perfect world manufacturers would give out this information, but it's understandable that they wouldn't (this doesn't mean that I don't think they should, but I know why they wouldn't). The issue is with "locked" bootloaders–the manufacturer is going through extra effort to make sure you can't run another operating system on your phone. This is inexcusable since it's not just a passive lack of helpfulness, it's an intent to make sure you can't have full control of your phone.
diegoprzl 9y ago
Just bought a Dex Station. If Emacs runs well enough then it will be a lifesaver.
- bergie 9y ago
  If Emacs is all you need, you can run it today with Termux. Dex is of course nice for giving a bigger screen etc. What this "Linux on Galaxy" thing will provide on top of Termux is X (or Wayland?) and probably a bigger selection of software.
  - MikusR 9y ago
    https://i.imgur.com/Nt8S1lw.jpg https://i.imgur.com/Nt8S1lw.jpg Example of Emacs in termux on dex. You can also run in semi fullscreen tabbar and applist will be visible.
  - diegoprzl 9y ago
    I already tried Emacs in Termux but I was too slow and did crash while trying to do some things. Nowadays I simply use JuiceSSH and mosh to connect to my main computer. I would like to have Emacs in my smartphone even while I don't have mobile signal though.
stephenr 9y ago
This has exactly the same problem as Microsoft's WSL: they're conflating Linux with "distribution built around GNU userland". I'm not a gnu zealot. I think rms has many faults. But a major company saying "now you can run Linux on android" or "now you can run Linux on Windows subsystem for Linux" is beyond stupid. In the case of Samsung it's Like saying you can make a sandwich out of a sandwich. In the case of Microsoft it's like saying you can make a real roast chicken out of a soy chicken.
- swiley 9y ago
  I've always thought of WSL as "implementing the Linux kernel API on Windows so you can run software written for it." I don't think it's necessarily restricted to GNU it's just that's what most people use and it's what's included.
  - stephenr 9y ago
    That is what it is - it's a compatibility layer to provide (a subset of) Linux kernel system calls on Windows, allowing the user to run ELF binaries as-is. The problem is Microsoft's phrasing. They're calling the distros (eg ubuntu or suse) that can run on WSL sans Linux (as they use the NT kernel w/WSL) "Linux". https://twitter.com/TechBandCamp/status/920733089948504064 https://twitter.com/TechBandCamp/status/920733089948504064 It's like saying "for our lactose intolerant customers we sell cheeseburgers without cheese".
    - nolok 9y ago
      That's because they need the public and marketing name to be understood not by the tech deciders who understands what it is and how it works, but by their boss. Said boss have very little idea what "kernel compatibility layer" or "running ELF binary as-is" means, but they do get "running linux".
      - stephenr 9y ago
        The announcement that includes the name change (from bash on Windows of all things) is pages long. They could have said "run a Linux Distribution" or "run Debian/RedHat/Centos". This is aimed at technical people, who should either know or be able to understand that Linux is the name of the kernel and is explicitly not part of this - WSL is (claimed to be) free of any Linux source.
neals 9y ago
So can we go Samsung -> Linux -> Virtual Box -> Windows? Or is that not how this works?
- icebraining 9y ago
  To get fast VMs, you need the guest OS (in this case, Windows) to be built for the same CPU architecture, and preferably to have virtualization features on the CPU. Since you're not likely to get either, you'd have to emulate the CPU. QEMU can do it, but it'll be slow. On the other hand, if Windows 98 is enough for you, you can run it on your phone right now: http://copy.sh/v86/?profile=windows98 http://copy.sh/v86/?profile=windows98 That site is doing the CPU emulation in JavaScript(!). It's fast enough because, well, it's Windows 98.
ericfrederich 9y ago
Ubuntu wanted to do this but it never went anywhere... and they didn't open source their code. What an absolute shame. I really loved the idea of it. You had the whole Android / Java / Bionic runtime sharing the same kernel as your GNU stuff. They had a way that you could even access your Android stuff from within your desktop environment like apps, contacts, text messages, etc.
- j605 9y ago
  It is open source and it is being continued at https://ubports.com/ https://ubports.com/
  - dharma1 9y ago
    I think he might be talking about Ubuntu for Android, which was classic Ubuntu running on an Android phone, predating Ubuntu Touch. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ubuntu_for_Android https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ubuntu_for_Android It worked on Galaxy S4, and Samsung were really close to shipping it on every S4. It never did ship though, and the project was abandoned. A couple of people who worked on it tried to push for open sourcing it, but I don't think it ever was open sourced. You could hook it up to an external monitor with an MHL-HDMI cable. Of course the SoC wasn't as beefy as ones we have now, but it was pretty OK.
jpalomaki 9y ago
What I would like to do is use my phone as portable storage device and then plug it in to external processing unit and boot from my phone. The external processing unit could be desktop computer, laptop or tablet. The reason? When sitting behind my desk at home or office I don't like to be limited with the mobile CPU. I have the required kWhs to power a proper CPU, GPU and run 64GB of memory. I also don't want to run separate computers on each location, because keeping these in sync (OS settings, applications, databases etc) is painful. Technically we are almost there. We can put reasonably fast flash storage to the phone. USB-C should provide enough bandwidth. On OS software side we would need some work to make plugging in/out convenient. I don't want to do a full reboot every time I "unplug" the phone from desktop processing unit and move it somewhere else. As I move between processing units I would like to keep my apps open, maybe just doing a hibernate/sleep and then waking the system up connected to a different processing unit. This solution means double spending on CPUs and memory, but desktop hardware is relatively cheap.
- jordache 9y ago
  We really need robust USBC drivers. Even Apple, being in the forefront of USB C connectivity, is vastly lacking in robust USB C operations. Plug in/out of usbc cables causes dramatically high crash rate on the new MBPs
  - jonaswi 9y ago
    Ah so I am not the only one! My MacBook Pro was regularly crashing completely when I unplugged my dock while it was closed. I now always have to wake up my MacBook before I unplug the dock.
  - fragmede 9y ago
    By "forefront of USB-C connectivity", you mean the new iPhones still use the proprietary lightning connector, to the detriment of progress.
    - jordache 9y ago
      first mass market laptop to be exclusively on USBC? Yeah if anyone, you'd get expect them to get the USB C stuff right... But it wasn't the case. It's downright infuriating to use.
themtutty 9y ago
Why does this link go directly to a sign-up page?
0xFFFE 9y ago
I miss my N900, I could run full fledged Debian on it. The Maemo OS also had Terminal app with full SSH client & server app. I used to SSH into my phone from my laptop just for kicks. And then Nokia had to go and fuck it all up.
- thesandlord 9y ago
  I had a N810. Great device, but once iPhone and Android smartphones came out, the market for these quickly shrunk to niche status.
obenn 9y ago
Will there be immediate driver support for the DeX docking stations? I have an S8+ and this might push me to purchasing one of the stations as well.
pedroaraujo 9y ago
I'm surprised no one commented about this yet: https://maruos.com/ https://maruos.com/
bfrog 9y ago
Maybe I'm the only one that is getting tired of smart phones? I feel like it just takes over every ones life sometimes. I'm ready to go back to a $30 nokia that just f'n works for half a decade, doesn't die every day due to battery usage, and in general... doesn't spy on my entire life story for the supposed purpose of better targeted ads. I think there's some serious room back in the mobile market with the way these devices are going. Outrageously expensive disposables aren't sustainable forever. At some point people get tired of throwing $500 in the bin for the exact same thing they had last year, just so they can have a full day worth of battery charge again.
- blubb-fish 9y ago
  would love to do that, too - but if you use the phone responsibly and maturely then its smartphone capabilities are pretty useful. for starters - don't throw away the phone - throw away the crapps - FB, WA, IG, Twitter, SC, ...
kasabali 9y ago
It's already mentioned in sub comments but I'd like to mention GNURoot Debian [0] in a top level comment. It is regular Debian (full repository of unmodified packages unlike Termux), and unlike variety of other chroot based solutions it doesn't require root access (utilizes proot). 0: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.gnuroot.debian https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.gnuroot.de...
xchip 9y ago
I've been using for 4 years and old cellphone as my home server. I run on it Nginx + PHP, OpenVPN, Samba, SSH, MiniDLNA, a git private server, AvaHi, python scripts... To get extra memory (not that I need it) I turn off the android UI and to save power I turn off the LCD. ping me if you want to know more!
capdotnet 9y ago
i wonder how it will compare to the "Complete Linux Installer"App project.

350 points by djvdorp 9y ago

I did something like this (shared kernel and chroot) on an old Nexus S back in 2012 with Gentoo. You can use a precompiled stage3 tarball which contains the fundamental filesystem layout and utilities (for the target architecture), and then for anything else that you need, you just use Portage (Gentoo's package manager) to compile stuff for you. Not super practical in terms of battery life and time if you're constantly compiling packages but a cool project nonetheless. This wasn't the exact guide I used, but it's the same idea: http://thinkmoult.com/installing-gentoo-android-chroot/ http://thinkmoult.com/installing-gentoo-android-chroot/

hdhzy 9y ago
Very cool thanks for sharing! > Not super practical in terms of battery life Samsung avoided this problem by requiring that the phone is connected to the dock that is also charging it.

SakiWatanabe 9y ago

Engadget article: https://www.engadget.com/2017/10/19/samsung-introduces-linux-on-galaxy/ https://www.engadget.com/2017/10/19/samsung-introduces-linux...

turbinerneiter 9y ago

chroot ftw! (right?)

byterollingbits 9y ago

No thanks! I'm not buying a phone that won't get updated with security updates. My trash box is littered with Korean Android phones that have no upgrade path or ability to clean with a fresh install. I'm opting for a Pixel 2 and an iPhone X for work and personal. They're expensive at first, but way cheaper and far more convenient in the long run. They always have immediate security updates, and they update their OS for atleast 3 years. Korean phones are rip offs, they barely update at all. Every single one of my Korean phones are still waiting for security updates. It costs way more to own a Samsung or LG phone in the long run. Don't buy Samsung or LG phones.

microcolonel 9y ago
You sound like a bigot, dividing phone manufacturers by country. Nation and industry are not so close in Korea that you could conflate any one company (especially any one subdivision) with every other similar company in the country. The Pixel 2 and iPhone 8 are as Korean as a Kia. Surely you should not buy them, since they contain that pesky Korean commoditized OLED technology.
swiley 9y ago
It doesn't matter who the OEM is. All Android phones are now wrappers around the Qualcomm snapdragon SOCs if they're sold in the US. They all have the update problem because Qualcomm has refused to work with other organizations or maintain their kernel forks.
- microcolonel 9y ago
  It's been getting better recently as third parties have taken on the work of maintaining drivers for Qualcomm chipsets, there are now a lot of their chipsets which can run on upstream kernels, and if Android kernels were closer to upstream, AOSP kernels could probably be built to function on some Qualcomm chipsets today.
kasabali 9y ago
Samsung is pretty good at security updates actually. See this 4.5 years old phone here [0] (july), or this 3.5 years old one [1] (september). 0: https://www.sammobile.com/firmwares/galaxy-s4/GT-I9505/ https://www.sammobile.com/firmwares/galaxy-s4/GT-I9505/ 1: https://www.sammobile.com/firmwares/galaxy-s5/SM-G900F/ https://www.sammobile.com/firmwares/galaxy-s5/SM-G900F/

djvdorp 9y ago

Samsung press release: http://www.samsungmobilepress.com/stories/samsung-dex's-expanding-ecosystem-pushes-the-possibilities-of-the-smartphone http://www.samsungmobilepress.com/stories/samsung-dex's-expa...

saagarjha 9y ago
> At Samsung, we continuously ask ourselves what else is possible, and what else we can do to bring a better experience for our users. Here's a tip: don't mess with my scrolling.

jankotek 9y ago

Can Galaxy even run without Linux kernel?

pjmlp 9y ago
In theory yes. Android doesn't expose a proper Linux to userspace and Google has been clapping down what we are allowed to do with the NDK since Android 7.0 (edit: corrected, only started in 7.0). So playing "what if", you can replace Linux with something else that is compatible the NDK APIs and no one would notice, other than the OEMs.
- throwaway613834 9y ago
  > Android doesn't expose a proper Linux to userspace and Google has been clapping down what we are allowed to do with the NDK since Android 6.0. Would you have a link to more details/reading on this? I wasn't aware.
  - pjmlp 9y ago
    Here are the official NDK APIs. https://developer.android.com/ndk/guides/stable_apis.html https://developer.android.com/ndk/guides/stable_apis.html Here are the documentation entries related to clamping down unauthorized use of other on-device libraries or Linux Syscalls. https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2016/06/android-changes-for-ndk-developers.html https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2016/06/android-ch... https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2016/06/improving-stability-with-private-cc.html https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2016/06/improving-... https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2017/07/seccomp-filter-in-android-o.html https://android-developers.googleblog.com/2017/07/seccomp-fi... https://developer.android.com/about/versions/nougat/android-7.0-changes.html#ndk https://developer.android.com/about/versions/nougat/android-... https://developer.android.com/about/versions/oreo/android-8.0-changes.html#security-all https://developer.android.com/about/versions/oreo/android-8.... Small correction, it is actually Android 7.0, not 6.0
    - throwaway613834 9y ago

TheChaplain 9y ago

If I understand this correctly, it's a LXC with a distribution built by Samsung?

camillomiller 9y ago

Maybe 2018 is finally the year of the Linux desktop. Wait... :) Jokes aside, I can see how this would be useful for sysadmin and devs - bring along your smartphone and you're set - but this would never fly for a general, even if geeky, public. Very nice approach though, curious to see where this ends up going.

herbst 9y ago
To be fair this is already what we do. Android already IS linux. You can install plenty of scripting environments like Ruby or Python while having access to the underlaying Linux system which is only partly crippled. Personally i see this more as a marketing thing from Samsung than anything else.
- CaptSpify 9y ago
  A shitty, half-assed linux. Until I can just put Debian on natively, and use apt-get for packages without a problem, I want us to keep moving to an actual linux on the phone. I'm quite eager to get away from android
  - herbst 9y ago
    I would love to get away from Android, but this is helping as much as Ubuntu on Windows is helping to get away from Windows. If you'd want debian natively this also was possible for a while, next to the option to have it run on a compatibility mode on top of your android kernel but does not even require root. Both methods supporting apt-get, X, and whatever else runs on ARM. Then there is also the Ubuntu phone project (which i assume is pretty much dead meanwhile) which has no Android in the mix at all. Except a possible compatibility layer for apps. Also its not a half-assed linux. Its just a linux that uses weird libraries to build their environment on which are not compatible with your desktop like environments.
    - CaptSpify 9y ago
      > I would love to get away from Android, but this is helping as much as Ubuntu on Windows is helping to get away from Windows. I'm not sure how much this helps, I'm just replying to the idea that we "Android already IS linux". That is technically true, but not practically true. I also don't want Debian to run on top of the android kernel, but I want to use Debian's kernel. The android one is pretty neutered and crappy. And yes, it is half-assed linux precisely because it's intentionally not compatible with desktop-like environments. Android has different goals than I want out of a phone, and that's perfectly fine, but that doesn't mean I have to be happy with Android as my only option (excluding IOS as that is a different beast altogether). Just because you are OK with it doesn't mean that I have to be, and every step further we take from Android, the better, IMO.

pjmlp 9y ago

Given how Tizen has been managed thus far I am not having big hopes for it, but lets see.

bostand 9y ago
Tizen on smartwatch is pretty awesome. Imho its miles ahead of the other watch OSes
- pjmlp 9y ago
  I guess you never bother to actually program on it. Tizen already went through these reboots: 1 - Replaced Meego SDK with Bada OS SDK 2 - Replaced Bada OS SDK with EFL + C++ SDK 3 - Dropped C++ SDK and replaced a new pure C API alongside EFL 4 - Currently adopting .NET Core + Xamarin.Forms Then there is the whole issue of code quality. https://what.thedailywtf.com/topic/15001/enlightened https://what.thedailywtf.com/topic/15001/enlightened https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/07/12/samsungs_tizen_no_longer_worst_ever/ https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/07/12/samsungs_tizen_no_l...
  - bostand 9y ago
    I have, it has is quirks. With that said, use their smartwatches. The UI is so much better than the competition it's not even funny. And then you have Samsung pay card emulation magic....
  - distances 9y ago
    I never understood why Samsung didn't stick with Qt for Tizen. Was it because it was owned by Nokia back then? Everything they've tried to do on the UI layer is something I wouldn't touch with an eleven-foot pole.
  - wvenable 9y ago
    Samsung also has a webkit-Javascript based SDK as well. It's actually pretty good as it exposes a lot of OS functionality in the JavaScript API. It might be the best option right now.

JorgeGT 9y ago

It's quite interesting that with the power of today's mobile devices (multicore 1GHz+ CPUs, GPUs, 2Gb+ RAM) we still don't have a standardized interface to plug them into desktop peripherals and launch a desktop OS/GUI. One would thing that such an universal interface would quickly become a standard offering in airports, hotels, libraries, conferences, etc.

baldfat 9y ago
AT&T killed that idea fast 6 years ago. When the Motorola Atrix came out with the ability to do that AT&T charge a $20 tethering fee to use the laptop dock with the phone! That blew my mind. The phone wasn't tethering data to anything but itself. https://www.wired.com/2011/03/motorola-atrix/ https://www.wired.com/2011/03/motorola-atrix/
- KozmoNau7 9y ago
  Tethering fees are another "brilliant" invention by the customer-hating American telcos. You get a set amount of data per month, for instance 20GB. Why should they care at all what you decide to use that data for?
  - maxerickson 9y ago
    Nah, they love their customers that happily shovel over large piles of money for whatever they happen to offer.
  - Brakenshire 9y ago
    Doesn't seem to be a thing in the UK, at least it hasn't been an issue for the 2 telecoms companies I've used.
    - ballade 9y ago
      As it is with most countries in Europe and I think many in Asia as well (correct me if I'm wrong). This is just an example of America's hardcore capitalism where certain markets are dominated by a few key players and the only entity capable of stopping them from enacting these batshit insane anti-consumer tactics are congress who are more than happy to take their bribes whilst shafting the average American consumer.

nickcw 9y ago

I think termux ( https://termux.com/ https://termux.com/ ) does most of what I need when I need a bit of emergency Linux on my phone. Termux provides a recompiled debian distro which runs as a android App. It doesn't chroot or need root and it works amazingly well. No desktop apps though.

bostand 9y ago
Another vote for termux! It's specially useful on chromeos
- dreta 9y ago
  It’s more useful to have standard Linux installed, unless you’re incredibly sensitive about security. I treat Chromebooks as cheap Linux machines. You can buy a brand new netbook, and you know Linux will run on it with no driver issues. It’s still chroot, but you get everything you need to do development.
  - sfifs 9y ago
    You can install GalliumOS distribution and get full Linux on most Chromebooks. You can flash firmware and get a proper laptop too
samuell 9y ago
Wow, cool and really well working app! Now I only need to get me a great b/t keyboard that fits in a pocket :)
- Tepix 9y ago
  The Waytools Textblade is still vaporware after 1000 days. Stay away from them until they ship a product.
- jasonkostempski 9y ago
  When I was a kid, the phones had hardware keyboards built-in!

padraic7a 9y ago

This is definitely interesting and I would be curious to see where it goes in the future. In the meantime however anyone who wants to use Linux on their phone today should check out https://ubports.com/ https://ubports.com/ It works now!

kagamine 9y ago
I followed the link, but don't quite understand the product. Does Ubuntu Touch OnePlusOne replace the OS on the device? So I buy one of the supported phones listed, and then erase and replace Android with this in it's place? Or it installs on top of?
- padraic7a 9y ago
  It replaces the OS, so you will lose everything you currently have on the phone. The installation process is similar to flashing a ROM and you can choose to reflash and move back to Android in the future.
  - kagamine 9y ago
    Actually sounds good. I'm tired of Apple devices going in a direction that doesn't fit with what I want, and have never been impressed with Android.
eat_veggies 9y ago
Does it still maintain phone functionality (sms, calling, data)?
- padraic7a 9y ago
  Yep.

5h 9y ago

I've been using termux and a fold out bluetooth keyboard for django development & code review for quite a while on my pixel XL. I absolutely love having my dev work on my phone, being able to hack away or do code review for 5 minutes wherever is incredible. At home using a chrome-cast and have it on a big screen. It would be nice to have a window manager I suppose - but i'll probably end up in a full screen terminal anywya. When mobile the biggest problem for me is just plain old screen size - I'm tempted to get a cheap Chinese tablet and use it as a remote screen somehow - leaving my phone in my pocket.

JepZ 9y ago
Yeah, screen size sucks. Didn't Intel build some wireless screen technology a few years ago? Somehow I never saw it in action, but as far as I can imagine I would like to have a >24 inch screen which I could use as a normal Display Port monitor, but also via NFC (+ some magic wireless technology) as a wireless monitor for my smart phone. Does anybody know where I can buy such a device or why it is not yet available?
- nrki 9y ago
  It's called WiDi / Miracast. It's in most Android phones. Many TVs support it, or you can buy an adapter.
ansible 9y ago
If you're going to carry a tablet and a BT keyboard, you might as well just get a light Chromebook instead. While I can run Linux locally via crouton, I mostly just SSH into my workstation and resume my screen sessions.
- digi_owl 9y ago
  Depends a bit on how small you can get a chromebook. After all, the smallest tablets are in the 7-8" screen range, while most chromebooks i have seen are 10"+.
  - 9y ago

dobecker 9y ago

>> Thank you for showing your interest in the Samsung for Galaxy project This should be Linux for Galaxy right?

Shengbo 9y ago
Yes.
Bretlei 9y ago
I thought the same thing!
castis 9y ago
Could also be 'Thank you for showing your interest in Samsung for the Galaxy project'?

jaclaz 9y ago

As often happens, I don't understand why one would want to subscribe in order to be notified when it becomes public. I mean, I can understand subscribing in order to get a beta or pre-release, but if right now nothing is available and when it will be available it will be public, it seems to me nothing more than a personal data collection. When it will be public there will also be a lot of publicity about it, so it's not likely that one needs to be notified.

pjmlp 9y ago
The whole point is not to notify you, rather to get a feeling how much people would eventually buy it.
- jaclaz 9y ago
  >The whole point is not to notify you, rather to get a feeling how much people would eventually buy it. Sure, but I wasn't expressing a doubt on why Samsung put that on, I was doubting why an end user would want to give away his/her name/email/company, substantially in exchange of nothing.
  - jhasse 9y ago
    Because he wants this to happen.

throwaway613834 9y ago

[OT] Does anybody have any idea when the Windows x86-on-ARM phones will come out? That's what I'm really waiting for and not seeing much information on.

MikusR 9y ago

https://twitter.com/TizenHelper/status/920507238485233664 https://twitter.com/TizenHelper/status/920507238485233664 Some pictures from a demo booth. Runs Ubuntu 16.04.2 on 4.4.13-1.

nopacience 9y ago

We need phone drivers! To enable us to install any distro or OS. I would love to download X distro directly from their website > install on the smartphone somehow > boot > install phone drivers > make calls I have nothing against Android. I would like to choose who creates the OS used on my smartphone

morganvachon 9y ago
> "I would love to download X distro directly from their website > install on the smartphone somehow > boot > install phone drivers > make calls" Unfortunately it will never be that simple. First, the distro you want would need to have an ARM port targeting the same version of ARM SoC in the phone. ARM isn't like x86 with just two targets (32 bit and 64 bit), it's a quagmire. Second, your distro of choice would need to stick with the exact kernel version used by the phone, and I guarantee if you take any three Android phones by three different manufacturers made in the past two years, you'll see three different kernel versions, each with tweaks made just for that device. Said tweaks would make it impossible to have a distro targeting all three devices even if they did have the exact same kernel version. Third, your distro maintainer would need to own or have access to every Android device she wished to target, and while that works for a community driven project like Lineage OS, it's not realistic for the lone Linux distro developer or small team who wants to add phones as targets for their existing desktop class distro.
- swiley 9y ago
  >Unfortunately it will never be that simple. First, the distro you want would need to have an ARM port targeting the same version of ARM SoC in the phone. ARM isn't like x86 with just two targets (32 bit and 64 bit), it's a quagmire. People say this a lot but that's not my experience. I have a lot of ARM machines and move binaries and complete distros (sans kernel) between them all the time without recompiling. Everything after ARMv7 is pretty well behaved.
- Brakenshire 9y ago
  > Second, your distro of choice would need to stick with the exact kernel version used by the phone, and I guarantee if you take any three Android phones by three different manufacturers made in the past two years, you'll see three different kernel versions, each with tweaks made just for that device. Said tweaks would make it impossible to have a distro targeting all three devices even if they did have the exact same kernel version. Would this apply for the new Purism phone? i.e. if all the drivers are upstreamed into the mainline kernel, does thstnot mean you can use any kernel past the point where the drivers are included, without modification?

dm319 9y ago

I can hear Shuttleworth swearing right now.

tinco 9y ago
Swearing? Don't you mean jubilating? Isn't Ubuntu on Samsung Galaxy phones exactly what he would want?
- morganvachon 9y ago
  Who said it will be Ubuntu? If this is anything like past attempts at a Linux desktop running from a mobile phone, it will be a Samsung optimized (i.e. locked down) half baked chroot monstrosity with limited tools and locked to the phone's ancient, bastardized kernel with zero security updates from launch forward. I think it would be awesome and amazing if I was completely wrong about all of that, but I'm not holding my breath. I'd rather wait for the Pyra to release and carry two devices than torture myself with an impossible dream.
  - Jonnax 9y ago
    Here's a photo of it running Ubuntu 16.04 at a Samsung booth with a 4.4. Kernel. https://twitter.com/TizenHelper/status/920507238485233664 https://twitter.com/TizenHelper/status/920507238485233664
    - morganvachon 9y ago
      Thank you, that's refreshing to know they are supporting a major distro.
    - deusum 9y ago
      I spy a Virtual Box, no? The kernel looks too new for Android, as well. I'm guessing users here don't want the emu penalty, just extend what's already there a bit.
      - 9y ago

emilsedgh 9y ago

This is amazing. The reason we have high quality free software for desktops is that you can easily install anything you want on your laptops and PC's. Significance of this is that it allows free software stacks to be built for phones. Kudos to Samsung for such move. Let's hope other phone makers also open up the phones.

saagarjha 9y ago

> Linux on Galaxy allows the latest Samsung Galaxy smartphone users to run their preferred Linux distribution on their smartphones utilizing the same Linux kernel that powers the Android OS to ensure the best possible performance. (emphasis mine) I knew there was a catch somewhere. I seriously doubt there's a technical reason why older Galaxy models can't support running Linux as well. I don't understand why it's so difficult for Android manufacturers to allow users to install whatever they want–I bought my phone, now let me install what I want. Sure, void the warrant or refuse to support it, but don't get in my way.

herbst 9y ago
Just a side thought. But afaik in all of europe you do not void your warrant when you root your phone or otherwise brick it software sidely. Its usually written somewhere, but afaik not legally enforceable (because as you said, you bought the hardware).
simonh 9y ago
We're all used to having desktop computers with generic x86 compatible processors and highly standardized internal interfaces and components, and compiling our software and installing it on any x86 computer we want. Smartphones with ARM SOCs aren't like that because they aren't just a CPU, they also include a crapload of additional system components. Even SOCs like the Snapdragon within a specific model will offer many variations to the manufacturers. Outside the SOC itself, phone hardware is far less standardized than on a PC. You can't compile your Linux distro for ARM then install it on any smartphone, the kernel needs to be tailored to the specific phone. That's why even though unlocked Android phones are around it really takes the manufacturer themselves to be able to do something like this because only they have the detailed understanding of the platform and the resources. Otherwise, other people would be doing it.
- saagarjha 9y ago
  In a perfect world manufacturers would give out this information, but it's understandable that they wouldn't (this doesn't mean that I don't think they should, but I know why they wouldn't). The issue is with "locked" bootloaders–the manufacturer is going through extra effort to make sure you can't run another operating system on your phone. This is inexcusable since it's not just a passive lack of helpfulness, it's an intent to make sure you can't have full control of your phone.

diegoprzl 9y ago

Just bought a Dex Station. If Emacs runs well enough then it will be a lifesaver.

bergie 9y ago
If Emacs is all you need, you can run it today with Termux. Dex is of course nice for giving a bigger screen etc. What this "Linux on Galaxy" thing will provide on top of Termux is X (or Wayland?) and probably a bigger selection of software.
- MikusR 9y ago
  https://i.imgur.com/Nt8S1lw.jpg https://i.imgur.com/Nt8S1lw.jpg Example of Emacs in termux on dex. You can also run in semi fullscreen tabbar and applist will be visible.
- diegoprzl 9y ago
  I already tried Emacs in Termux but I was too slow and did crash while trying to do some things. Nowadays I simply use JuiceSSH and mosh to connect to my main computer. I would like to have Emacs in my smartphone even while I don't have mobile signal though.

stephenr 9y ago

This has exactly the same problem as Microsoft's WSL: they're conflating Linux with "distribution built around GNU userland". I'm not a gnu zealot. I think rms has many faults. But a major company saying "now you can run Linux on android" or "now you can run Linux on Windows subsystem for Linux" is beyond stupid. In the case of Samsung it's Like saying you can make a sandwich out of a sandwich. In the case of Microsoft it's like saying you can make a real roast chicken out of a soy chicken.

swiley 9y ago
I've always thought of WSL as "implementing the Linux kernel API on Windows so you can run software written for it." I don't think it's necessarily restricted to GNU it's just that's what most people use and it's what's included.
- stephenr 9y ago
  That is what it is - it's a compatibility layer to provide (a subset of) Linux kernel system calls on Windows, allowing the user to run ELF binaries as-is. The problem is Microsoft's phrasing. They're calling the distros (eg ubuntu or suse) that can run on WSL sans Linux (as they use the NT kernel w/WSL) "Linux". https://twitter.com/TechBandCamp/status/920733089948504064 https://twitter.com/TechBandCamp/status/920733089948504064 It's like saying "for our lactose intolerant customers we sell cheeseburgers without cheese".
  - nolok 9y ago
    That's because they need the public and marketing name to be understood not by the tech deciders who understands what it is and how it works, but by their boss. Said boss have very little idea what "kernel compatibility layer" or "running ELF binary as-is" means, but they do get "running linux".
    - stephenr 9y ago
      The announcement that includes the name change (from bash on Windows of all things) is pages long. They could have said "run a Linux Distribution" or "run Debian/RedHat/Centos". This is aimed at technical people, who should either know or be able to understand that Linux is the name of the kernel and is explicitly not part of this - WSL is (claimed to be) free of any Linux source.

neals 9y ago

So can we go Samsung -> Linux -> Virtual Box -> Windows? Or is that not how this works?

icebraining 9y ago
To get fast VMs, you need the guest OS (in this case, Windows) to be built for the same CPU architecture, and preferably to have virtualization features on the CPU. Since you're not likely to get either, you'd have to emulate the CPU. QEMU can do it, but it'll be slow. On the other hand, if Windows 98 is enough for you, you can run it on your phone right now: http://copy.sh/v86/?profile=windows98 http://copy.sh/v86/?profile=windows98 That site is doing the CPU emulation in JavaScript(!). It's fast enough because, well, it's Windows 98.

ericfrederich 9y ago

Ubuntu wanted to do this but it never went anywhere... and they didn't open source their code. What an absolute shame. I really loved the idea of it. You had the whole Android / Java / Bionic runtime sharing the same kernel as your GNU stuff. They had a way that you could even access your Android stuff from within your desktop environment like apps, contacts, text messages, etc.

j605 9y ago
It is open source and it is being continued at https://ubports.com/ https://ubports.com/
- dharma1 9y ago
  I think he might be talking about Ubuntu for Android, which was classic Ubuntu running on an Android phone, predating Ubuntu Touch. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ubuntu_for_Android https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ubuntu_for_Android It worked on Galaxy S4, and Samsung were really close to shipping it on every S4. It never did ship though, and the project was abandoned. A couple of people who worked on it tried to push for open sourcing it, but I don't think it ever was open sourced. You could hook it up to an external monitor with an MHL-HDMI cable. Of course the SoC wasn't as beefy as ones we have now, but it was pretty OK.

jpalomaki 9y ago

What I would like to do is use my phone as portable storage device and then plug it in to external processing unit and boot from my phone. The external processing unit could be desktop computer, laptop or tablet. The reason? When sitting behind my desk at home or office I don't like to be limited with the mobile CPU. I have the required kWhs to power a proper CPU, GPU and run 64GB of memory. I also don't want to run separate computers on each location, because keeping these in sync (OS settings, applications, databases etc) is painful. Technically we are almost there. We can put reasonably fast flash storage to the phone. USB-C should provide enough bandwidth. On OS software side we would need some work to make plugging in/out convenient. I don't want to do a full reboot every time I "unplug" the phone from desktop processing unit and move it somewhere else. As I move between processing units I would like to keep my apps open, maybe just doing a hibernate/sleep and then waking the system up connected to a different processing unit. This solution means double spending on CPUs and memory, but desktop hardware is relatively cheap.

jordache 9y ago
We really need robust USBC drivers. Even Apple, being in the forefront of USB C connectivity, is vastly lacking in robust USB C operations. Plug in/out of usbc cables causes dramatically high crash rate on the new MBPs
- jonaswi 9y ago
  Ah so I am not the only one! My MacBook Pro was regularly crashing completely when I unplugged my dock while it was closed. I now always have to wake up my MacBook before I unplug the dock.
- fragmede 9y ago
  By "forefront of USB-C connectivity", you mean the new iPhones still use the proprietary lightning connector, to the detriment of progress.
  - jordache 9y ago
    first mass market laptop to be exclusively on USBC? Yeah if anyone, you'd get expect them to get the USB C stuff right... But it wasn't the case. It's downright infuriating to use.

themtutty 9y ago

Why does this link go directly to a sign-up page?

0xFFFE 9y ago

I miss my N900, I could run full fledged Debian on it. The Maemo OS also had Terminal app with full SSH client & server app. I used to SSH into my phone from my laptop just for kicks. And then Nokia had to go and fuck it all up.

thesandlord 9y ago
I had a N810. Great device, but once iPhone and Android smartphones came out, the market for these quickly shrunk to niche status.

obenn 9y ago

Will there be immediate driver support for the DeX docking stations? I have an S8+ and this might push me to purchasing one of the stations as well.

pedroaraujo 9y ago

I'm surprised no one commented about this yet: https://maruos.com/ https://maruos.com/

bfrog 9y ago

Maybe I'm the only one that is getting tired of smart phones? I feel like it just takes over every ones life sometimes. I'm ready to go back to a $30 nokia that just f'n works for half a decade, doesn't die every day due to battery usage, and in general... doesn't spy on my entire life story for the supposed purpose of better targeted ads. I think there's some serious room back in the mobile market with the way these devices are going. Outrageously expensive disposables aren't sustainable forever. At some point people get tired of throwing $500 in the bin for the exact same thing they had last year, just so they can have a full day worth of battery charge again.

blubb-fish 9y ago
would love to do that, too - but if you use the phone responsibly and maturely then its smartphone capabilities are pretty useful. for starters - don't throw away the phone - throw away the crapps - FB, WA, IG, Twitter, SC, ...

kasabali 9y ago

It's already mentioned in sub comments but I'd like to mention GNURoot Debian [0] in a top level comment. It is regular Debian (full repository of unmodified packages unlike Termux), and unlike variety of other chroot based solutions it doesn't require root access (utilizes proot). 0: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.gnuroot.debian https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.gnuroot.de...

xchip 9y ago

I've been using for 4 years and old cellphone as my home server. I run on it Nginx + PHP, OpenVPN, Samba, SSH, MiniDLNA, a git private server, AvaHi, python scripts... To get extra memory (not that I need it) I turn off the android UI and to save power I turn off the LCD. ping me if you want to know more!

capdotnet 9y ago

i wonder how it will compare to the "Complete Linux Installer"App project.