2 ms·

The alt-right is the logical endpoint. It kind of combines all the worst ideas from liberalism over the past 50 years (postmodernism, identity politics) with al

by api 9y ago

The alt-right is the logical endpoint. It kind of combines all the worst ideas from liberalism over the past 50 years (postmodernism, identity politics) with all the worst ideas from conservatism (nationalism, racism, biological determinism) in the previous century. I remember years ago having a discussion with a friend about "what's the worst ideology you can possibly imagine" and it kind of resembles what I came up with but (mostly) minus the theocracy (I pictured a pomo professor, a Christian Reconstructionist, and a fascist hashing out a synthesis). In some respects it's worse-- its obnoxious meme aesthetic is far trashier than anything I would have ever imagined. No dystopian writer could have come up with a fever dream as hideous as the collision of 4chan and Stormfront. Maybe you have to hit bottom before things can bounce back. I have a tough time imagining anything worse than this, but I'm sure people will try.

snerbles 9y ago
The fictional history of Star Trek did have a global nuclear war in the 21st century.
occultist_throw 9y ago
But that's what is talked about in Star Trek DS9. Except we have the similar name, but very different meaning... Sanctuary Districts. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Past_Tense_(Star_Trek:_Deep_Space_Nine) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Past_Tense_(Star_Trek:_Deep_Sp... Effectively, the governments at the time (USA), figured it was cheaper to ghettoize poor, sick, and others whom cannot support themselves. Wall them off, and keep them out of society. Out of sight, out of mind. This literally is the thoughts of the Right-Wing. Ive seen that justification here, on HN. Why bother with the poor? They have no money! Better to keep them 'away', as 'We' are better. Of course, right now we have White-Nationalists beating on their drums. But the real war here is against the poor. Black people are.. disdained by the Conservative elite because they are primarily low income (by way of discrimination, but thats aside the point!). Ideally, all poor trash should be taken out, white, black, asian, native - you name it. No money = no livelihood = no choice = no living. EDIT: Seriously? -1's? Am I wrong? I would love to see the conservative plans to boost people from poverty, medical maladies, and systemic discrimination. So far, what I see are attacks on any programs trying to assist with poverty, medical, and discrimination. And these attacks are done by the "ruling party", Republicans, with their base plans being as such. This article is a great internal view of how Republicans support white supremacy values. https://www.thenation.com/article/exclusive-lee-atwaters-infamous-1981-interview-southern-strategy/ https://www.thenation.com/article/exclusive-lee-atwaters-inf...
wutbrodo 9y ago
> It kind of combines all the worst ideas from liberalism over the past 50 years (postmodernism, identity politics) Not to be pedantic, but those are _illiberal_ ideas. You're conflating liberals and the left, which was mostly fine when they were in a coalition for a while. But if you're talking about identity politics et al, you're very specifically describing things that are almost definitionally illiberal.
- snerbles 9y ago
  It's tragic that some consider "classical liberal" an alt-right dog whistle.
  - wutbrodo 9y ago
    Yea, liberalism just isn't in vogue anywhere on the political spectrum. The kind of people you're talking about are particularly intellectually dishonest and morally decrepit, but a rejection of liberalism seems to have taken root all over the place.
Apocryphon 9y ago
All countercultural movements are trashy. The alt-right certainly have hit a certain watermark for going for cheap shocks and taboo-breaking transgressive behavior, but that's because they're attuned to the standards of the current generation. In the '70s, punk was countercultural and the Brits banned "God Save the Queen" by the Sex Pistols just because the cover had Elizabeth II wearing a nose ring. What's considered trashy or taboo shifts with each generation.

by api 9y ago

snerbles 9y ago

The fictional history of Star Trek did have a global nuclear war in the 21st century.

occultist_throw 9y ago

But that's what is talked about in Star Trek DS9. Except we have the similar name, but very different meaning... Sanctuary Districts. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Past_Tense_(Star_Trek:_Deep_Space_Nine) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Past_Tense_(Star_Trek:_Deep_Sp... Effectively, the governments at the time (USA), figured it was cheaper to ghettoize poor, sick, and others whom cannot support themselves. Wall them off, and keep them out of society. Out of sight, out of mind. This literally is the thoughts of the Right-Wing. Ive seen that justification here, on HN. Why bother with the poor? They have no money! Better to keep them 'away', as 'We' are better. Of course, right now we have White-Nationalists beating on their drums. But the real war here is against the poor. Black people are.. disdained by the Conservative elite because they are primarily low income (by way of discrimination, but thats aside the point!). Ideally, all poor trash should be taken out, white, black, asian, native - you name it. No money = no livelihood = no choice = no living. EDIT: Seriously? -1's? Am I wrong? I would love to see the conservative plans to boost people from poverty, medical maladies, and systemic discrimination. So far, what I see are attacks on any programs trying to assist with poverty, medical, and discrimination. And these attacks are done by the "ruling party", Republicans, with their base plans being as such. This article is a great internal view of how Republicans support white supremacy values. https://www.thenation.com/article/exclusive-lee-atwaters-infamous-1981-interview-southern-strategy/ https://www.thenation.com/article/exclusive-lee-atwaters-inf...

wutbrodo 9y ago

> It kind of combines all the worst ideas from liberalism over the past 50 years (postmodernism, identity politics) Not to be pedantic, but those are _illiberal_ ideas. You're conflating liberals and the left, which was mostly fine when they were in a coalition for a while. But if you're talking about identity politics et al, you're very specifically describing things that are almost definitionally illiberal.

snerbles 9y ago
It's tragic that some consider "classical liberal" an alt-right dog whistle.
- wutbrodo 9y ago
  Yea, liberalism just isn't in vogue anywhere on the political spectrum. The kind of people you're talking about are particularly intellectually dishonest and morally decrepit, but a rejection of liberalism seems to have taken root all over the place.

Apocryphon 9y ago

All countercultural movements are trashy. The alt-right certainly have hit a certain watermark for going for cheap shocks and taboo-breaking transgressive behavior, but that's because they're attuned to the standards of the current generation. In the '70s, punk was countercultural and the Brits banned "God Save the Queen" by the Sex Pistols just because the cover had Elizabeth II wearing a nose ring. What's considered trashy or taboo shifts with each generation.