4 ms·

> Don’t kid, most people aren’t renting because they prefer it. I can't speak for the USA but in Germany - specifically where we live, home ownership is not/ba

> Don’t kid, most people aren’t renting because they prefer it. I can't speak for the USA but in Germany - specifically where we live, home ownership is not/barely worth it financially speaking. The taxes alone for "owning property" i.e. renting it from the government until you die are extremely high. You pay 6.5% (varies by state) of the property value in "Grunderwerbsteuer" when you initially buy and then for a home valued at around 250k (fairly normal prices) you're looking at a 2-4k per year in taxes. Throw on top of that all your upkeep costs in time and money and it really doesn't look like such a nice deal. That's why we haven't bought and I don't want to. Nowadays, "home ownership" is just another name for renting where the costs are slightly less and the upkeep to you in time and effort is more.

joe_the_user 9y ago
Let me rephrase it, People in the US aren't paying outrageous rent for tiny spaces because they think it's a great way to live.
johntiger1 9y ago
I saw an article recently about how an American immigrant was purchasing a home in Germany and was actually forced to pay LESS by the housing authority! Despite German economic strength, house prices are not outrageous. Whatever Germany is doing, they are doing right
gerdesj 9y ago
I used to be a British Army brat in (West) DE ('70s-80's) and my received wisdom was that Germans would generally rent and save up for ownership of a property out of town for retirement. Whereas us Brits would aspire to home ownership earlier. All of that is obviously bollocks, sort of. As another ahem European, I'm more interested in a German's views on home ownership and why I'm commenting here. You said: "That's why we haven't bought and I don't want to." implying it is all about tax. I'd be intrigued to explore this farther. You mentioned earlier "The taxes alone for "owning property" i.e. renting it from the government until you die are extremely high" - could you clarify that.
barrkel 9y ago
Property taxes as a brake on house prices make sense, and since we all need to pay taxes, they can be revenue neutral should the government structure them that way. The way it seems to work in the Anglosphere is that house prices are mainly limited by the cost of money. When interest rates are low, long mortgages for enormous sums are affordable so people bid up the cost of desireable places to live. But it's a zero-sum game - increased property prices don't create more land in the desireable area, and due to planning laws and nimbyism they usually don't increase density much either. Everybody works harder and pays more for approximately the same distribution of physical assets - except for the windfall for people who got in early, who turn into a political support base for parties that then need to keep house prices propped up. And the cycle needs to continue, otherwise those mortgages would have negative equity.
simonsarris 9y ago
In New Hampshire, you can pay that much or more in taxes. Plucking a random house nearby: https://www.redfin.com/NH/Amherst/47-Merrimack-Rd-03031/home/108644392 https://www.redfin.com/NH/Amherst/47-Merrimack-Rd-03031/home... For sale for: $284,900 Assessed at: $269,500 Taxes (2016) $6,764 (New Hampshire has no sales tax, and high property taxes, quite high in some towns...)

joe_the_user 9y ago

Let me rephrase it, People in the US aren't paying outrageous rent for tiny spaces because they think it's a great way to live.

johntiger1 9y ago

I saw an article recently about how an American immigrant was purchasing a home in Germany and was actually forced to pay LESS by the housing authority! Despite German economic strength, house prices are not outrageous. Whatever Germany is doing, they are doing right

gerdesj 9y ago

I used to be a British Army brat in (West) DE ('70s-80's) and my received wisdom was that Germans would generally rent and save up for ownership of a property out of town for retirement. Whereas us Brits would aspire to home ownership earlier. All of that is obviously bollocks, sort of. As another ahem European, I'm more interested in a German's views on home ownership and why I'm commenting here. You said: "That's why we haven't bought and I don't want to." implying it is all about tax. I'd be intrigued to explore this farther. You mentioned earlier "The taxes alone for "owning property" i.e. renting it from the government until you die are extremely high" - could you clarify that.

barrkel 9y ago

Property taxes as a brake on house prices make sense, and since we all need to pay taxes, they can be revenue neutral should the government structure them that way. The way it seems to work in the Anglosphere is that house prices are mainly limited by the cost of money. When interest rates are low, long mortgages for enormous sums are affordable so people bid up the cost of desireable places to live. But it's a zero-sum game - increased property prices don't create more land in the desireable area, and due to planning laws and nimbyism they usually don't increase density much either. Everybody works harder and pays more for approximately the same distribution of physical assets - except for the windfall for people who got in early, who turn into a political support base for parties that then need to keep house prices propped up. And the cycle needs to continue, otherwise those mortgages would have negative equity.

simonsarris 9y ago

In New Hampshire, you can pay that much or more in taxes. Plucking a random house nearby: https://www.redfin.com/NH/Amherst/47-Merrimack-Rd-03031/home/108644392 https://www.redfin.com/NH/Amherst/47-Merrimack-Rd-03031/home... For sale for: $284,900 Assessed at: $269,500 Taxes (2016) $6,764 (New Hampshire has no sales tax, and high property taxes, quite high in some towns...)