6 ms·

Why do we keep using Facebook?

32 points by imartin2k 9y ago

noncoml 9y ago
I haven’t used FB for years, I don’t even have an account, and don’t miss it at all. When I want to connect with my friends I use WhatsApp, for brainless time passing I use Reddit and I use HN for stimulation and discussion.
- icebraining 9y ago
  > I haven’t used FB for years (...) When I want to connect with my friends I use WhatsApp Mark Zuckerberg rubs his hands :) Not a criticism, I do the same, despite having refused to join FB.
- kelnos 9y ago
  And that's why FB's acquisitions of Instagram and WhatsApp were so brilliant: Zuck recognizes that he's going to inevitably lose some people from FB, so he's diversified.
westiseast 9y ago
The blog poster seems to be missing the critical point - maybe he's never smoked. It's an addiction. To your phone, to social response, to 'new'. The way way to give up is to treat it like an addiction.
- hellofunk 9y ago
  Actually, I would say that you were missing the critical point that he is making in the article. It's not an addiction in this case, I also would like to get off Facebook, and I am certainly not addicted to it since I check in on it maybe once a month. But I stay for the same reason the author does, which is that everyone I know is on there, and I don't have an easy way to stay in touch with them otherwise.
omarchowdhury 9y ago
At the heart of it? The need to connect with others. (Not saying that Facebook satisfies this need, but it is a need.)
KozmoNau7 9y ago
I don't know about others, but I use it primarily to keep up to date on bands I like, and because it's a convenient way to manage an event and invite people.
- ubercow 9y ago
  >keep up to date on bands I like Specifically for this use case I like Songkick [0]. Lets me know when anyone I'm following is touring near me. Lets you import artists from Spotify too. 0: https://www.songkick.com/home https://www.songkick.com/home
  - KozmoNau7 9y ago
    I used Bandsintown for the same thing for a while. But neither gives you updates straight from the bands, about contests and other stuff that isn't directly tour-related.
- stinos 9y ago
  Same here. Most, if not all, bands/labels/party organizers I know are on FB. Even the more underground ones eventually switched. And last time I checked there was still no proper alternative (and the forums I used to frequent for that same goal are gone or close to dead, mostly because of FB). For me this is the key value of FB, the solcial aspect is close to non-existing for me, most of my 'friends' being blocked so their messages don't generate noise amongst the messages from bands I do want to see. I do realize this makes me a bit of an outlier though: none of the typical science/articles about FB, like this one, applies to me because I'm not in it for the social part. I do understand it though; just like I'd urge hose who are like 'I got rid of FB and didn't miss it one moment' to realize that while it's possible that worked for you, some people just don't have that luxury of being able to easily quit. I'd also miss FB if it were to disappear tomorrow, but mainly because I'd had to spend time and search for a new practical tool which does the same as what I use it for now.
kisstheblade 9y ago
What I have found that everyone uses facebook to post stuff about themselves and voice their "important" opinions on stuff. Nobody uses it to "connect". Or for sure maybe sometimes but surely it's not the only way that people can connect in these days. I can connect with people in a myriad of ways, as always, even before facebook. I have seen absolutely no change in how "connected" I am after facebook has taken over. Anyhow if it so important for "connecting" then how come I, without facebook, still am very much connected with my friends and family.
- herbst 9y ago
  > What I have found that everyone uses facebook to post stuff about themselves and voice their "important" opinions on stuff. I have got the very same impression. It ended up like a huge ego driven circle jerk. Most "communication" happens passively (likes, post emojis, passive comments, shares). And barely anyone is even interested in provided OC. Its a sad place these days
xupybd 9y ago
Focus on friends that only share memes and Facebook makes you feel awesome
- gfredtech 9y ago
  During my last days, I spent my time on Facebook for the memes. But I still deleted it anyways
zw123456 9y ago
I removed my account a few months back (you have to request that, you can't delete it on your own, which I think sucks). I did it because I feel that they betrayed our democracy for profit and I do not want to support an organization like that. And that was the feedback I gave them. I do not miss it one bit.
- humanrebar 9y ago
  If you think companies like facebook can manipulate democracy, you have problems with open democracy, at least information-age democracy, not facebook in particular. Undergirding democracy is the idea that citizens are intelligent and trustworthy enough to deal with yellow journalism, propaganda, etc. Or, at least, that is a downside of the least bad approach to governance so far.
  - kelnos 9y ago
    > Undergirding democracy is the idea that citizens are intelligent and trustworthy enough to deal with yellow journalism, propaganda, etc. The Nov 2016 US election, and the investigations into news propagation on sites like FB, is outright proof that citizens are in fact not intelligent enough on average to deal with this. I'm not trying to shit on people or be flippant, but... it's not looking good. Certainly censoring people or legislating FB into oblivion isn't the answer, but I'm not sure what is. "Educate everyone better" seems like a catch-22 at best, likely destined to fail. And I don't think this is an example of a company influencing elections. FB was pretty unwitting there. Others found creative, unintended ways to use the platform to do their dirty work.
    - humanrebar 9y ago
      There are serious implications to that conclusion. The citizens are the watchers in a democracy. If they can't be trusted to come to reasonable conclusions on their own, there is no other authority qualified to ensure they are properly informed and vetted. It is circular, to say the least, to have the government regulate how to educate citizens about how to pick the next government.
newscracker 9y ago
It seems like people becoming increasingly physically isolated and not connecting even with neighbors makes online connections valuable. It's pervasive and avoids moving physically. And of course, the network effect of others being on Facebook.
- Sir_Substance 9y ago
  >It seems like people becoming increasingly physically isolated and not connecting even with neighbors makes online connections valuable. This kind of thinking never held much water with me. You don't get to choose your neighbors, the odds that they'll be compatible with you in the way that might lead to meaningful friendships is extremely low. None of my parents friends are former neighbors. Lots of them are former church-goers from the various churches they've attended though. I think that shows that you really only need one thing in common to help filter out the majority of the population. If you like bowling, take up bowling, and I bet you'll find quite a few people you get on with quite well. Ditto paintball, and obviously ditto friday night drinking. But the idea that Facebook is "ruining the connection we used to have with the people around us" is pretty much nonsense. We never really cared that much about the people around us, neighbors were always just acquaintances.
  - kelnos 9y ago
    Very much agreed. I've lived in the bay area for 13 years, in apartments with at least 20 units in them (usually many more), and I have not known even one of my neighbors. Beyond that, I have a very healthy in-person social life filled with people I've met through other avenues. Even though you'd think it'd be easy to do so, I just don't have much interest in meeting the other people who live in my building. This isn't universal, of course -- one of my good friends lives in a building with 4 units, and he knows everyone who lives there. Diff'rent strokes, I guess. I wonder if knowing your neighbors is more of a suburban/rural/family thing? When I was growing up (suburbs of NJ and later MD), we always at least knew the people who lived on our block, even if we weren't close friends with them.
    - 9y ago
Kluny 9y ago
Based on the other comments so far, it sounds like HN'ers mostly don't use facebook and don't miss it. Fair enough, but I'm in the same camp as the article's author, and looking for a way out. I might be unique, but I didn't really have much of a social life before facebook. That's not causal relationship - before 2007ish I was a very introverted kid who didn't know how to make friends or form strong relationships. All of my good friendships came into existence after about 2009, when I started to learn how to socialize better, and for the most part, facebook is my main contact point with all those people. That's only because facbook was the dominant communication method during that time. But there it is, and I'm stuck with it, and I can't seem to get unstuck. I want to hear about the new babies, jobs, city moves, projects, and parties that people have going on, and facebook is the best way to get that info. But 90% of what you get there is political garbage, pointless memes, MLMs, and facebook's own "manufactured content". It's frustrating and it's making me unhappy too.
- skrebbel 9y ago
  > I want to hear about the new babies, jobs, city moves, projects, and parties that people have going on This is the point. We non Facebook users decided we don't care enough about that stuff. Or at least not until someone tells us about it in person. There's no real problem with hearing half a year late that a friend of a friend, who is also a direct acquaintance of sorts, became a parent.
  - jamesrcole 9y ago
    You're generalising a lot about the motivations of users and non-users.
    - skrebbel 9y ago
      Fair enough.
- flohofwoe 9y ago
  At least in Germany this role of keeping up to date about events among family and friends seems to have moved to WhatsApp. You still get all the baby- and vacation-pictures, but without the propaganda-, 'you might like'- and advertisement-postings Facebook is bombarding you with. Personally I have moved off Facebook since end 2016 and was one of the last holdouts, most of my family, and friends from the 'real world' don't have an Facebook account or have left their account idle since long before that. PS: the irony is of course that WhatsApp is owned by Facebook ;)
Nothorized 9y ago
Ok, I a
Nothorized 9y ago
Ok, I am not be the "usual" reader of Hacker News (HN). I am reading HN since 2012 for disclaimer. So basically, Facebook (FB) is for socializing in real life. Since I am currently in exchange, It is useful to create parties and to invite people to them. It is also useful to talk with your friend on the other side of the earth (more than Whatsapp), to keep up to date with them. And it is also the best way to get into groups, to exchange ideas, or into the group of your university. So basically, FB is my social life. Do I like that ? No. But would i have a social life without FB ? No. Most of the people here are seeing FB as the devil, but it helps me to invite to parties girls I want to hang out with or get invited to parties, and since everyone (or most of the people, more most of the people) are looking for raising their number of friends on Facebook, it is really useful to connect with new peoples. But, yes, I am invited to parties without FB, but not as much. Also, for group projects, it is the closest thing to Slack for College students. So as much as I hate FB, it is really useful, sadly.
- speedplane 9y ago
  Have you tried dropping FB? Relying on old-fashioned txt message to ask your friends whatsup?
  - jamesrcole 9y ago
    As an aside, it's funny that text messages can now be considered "old fashioned".
srge 9y ago
It's been 2 years that I have deleted both my FB accounts (one for family and friends, the other for business), my IG account and my Twitter account. All accounts had many years of activity and substantial following. I never looked back and I am very much happier. What made me decide is that I realized that I had become an self inflicted obligation to create content to feed my online personas every days. Basically I was doing things in my real life that I did not want to do just to feed a virtual person's life (mine) on other people's websites to impress my friends and contacts. This is insane.
- jamesrcole 9y ago
  I've heard other people make the same point, and I don't understand it. Why did you feel obligated to create content? A lot of the time I've used it, I've personally been happy just seeing what other people have posted.
  - srge 9y ago
    One could argue that those social platforms are designed to keep you engaged.
  - kelnos 9y ago
    I've slowed down a lot lately in my posts to FB and IG. I think the turning point for me was when I saw a friend at a party (someone I don't see often and don't have much of a one-on-one relationship with), and she told me something to the effect of "I decide where to eat based on the photos you post on IG". I'm sure she was exaggerating, and certainly didn't mean to imply any sort of obligation on my part, but it hit me... why am I posting all this stuff? I've never had any burning desire to be some sort of "online influencer", so what was I really doing? Either I'm bragging about all the cool places I've been to (which I think would be pretty lame of me), or I'm in effect advertising for the restaurants I visit (which isn't too objectionable, but certainly isn't my job). If I were posting things for artistic or comedic value that I wanted to share, or posting actual photos that illustrated what's going on in my life, I'd feel better about it. So I post less. And as for FB, my feed is overloaded with politics and social justice posts. Both of which are important, but it gets to be too much, very quickly. And it's not what I want to use FB for -- I have news aggregators for those sorts of things. I used to have pinned tabs in Firefox open for FB and Twitter, but upon closing them a couple months ago I find I'm much happier. I can still manually navigate to FB when I need to, and I still have the mobile app, but I think I'm starting to find the right level of engagement with FB that makes me happiest and gives me the most utility.
NiklasMort 9y ago
Unfortunately the amount of groups on Facebook is nowhere else to be found, especially important for people who move/travel a lot. Not to mention the majority of events & co often only is posted on FB.
- herbst 9y ago
  I travel a lot plus mostly live in a different place than i originally grew up with, so moved quite a few times, so have plenty remote friends. Still i dont miss it and i never felt i should get another FB profile. Even thought i dont had one the last 4 years. What i am trying to say is that you most likely wont even know how irrelevant FB is for you life as long as you hold on to it for whatever reasons.
ljamf 9y ago
Full disclosure up front: i work for a company which sells ads based on user behavior. I get that it's creepy, "spying" on users, but really, would you rather have ads from services which know nothing about you? Companies want to buy ads that users are interested in, obviously. If I have a company selling vegan food i would optimally only buy ads shown to people who are already vegan, right? And they probably don't want ads from your local butcher, but might be interested in my new awesome vegan food. Again, i get that it's creepy, especially on Facebooks scale, but I feel the discussion gets lopsided sometimes. I don't use Facebook much, but I'm fine with that my browser behavior is tracked.
- jcbrand 9y ago
  > would you rather have ads from services which know nothing about you? I'd rather have zero ads. If I'm interested in something, I'll search for it, or ask around.
- mbrock 9y ago
  Of course I would rather get irrelevant ads than have irresponsible firms tracking the patterns of my online behavior. That seems like an extremely obvious choice. Ads are not there for my benefits, they are memetic weapons deployed by corporations to nudge my subconscious. I haven't voluntarily clicked on a single ad in my entire life. They are 100% obnoxious, and these days, privacy violating to a staggering degree.
  - kelnos 9y ago
    You're in the minority, though. The majority of people don't even have an adblocker installed. The companies that are able to give their services away for "free" wouldn't be able to do so without the majority of people who are at least marginally accepting of their ads. I'm not trying to say you have an obligation to look at ads (I hate advertising nearly as much as you do), but I do understand and accept why these practices are there, and believe that, for the people that do see ads, targeted ads are more useful than untargeted random noise. I would happily instead pay monthly for things that are largely ad-supported, if they'd give me that option.
- 9y ago
speedplane 9y ago
Facebook says that 5.5%-11% of accounts are "fake". I'd guess the number is higher. There is so much spam, fake friend requests, and general internet hucksters on FB, that I've lost trust in the platform. Real-life people send me friend requests a few times a week, but I easily get 5-10 spammer friend requests a day. I don't know if stuff I'm reading is (1) just there; (2) put there due to an algorithm trying to cater to my tastes; (3) inserted by spammers; or (4) paid for by god-knows-who. Every time I log into FB, I feel like I'm stepping into a room with people I sort of recognize but don't know. On the internet, I rather make conversation with true strangers on Hacker News than these quasi-strangers on FB.
- ship_it 9y ago
  Just curious, why are you still on there?
  - speedplane 9y ago
    I don't have a moral or ideological opposition to FB, more of a practical one... I don't really know who my friends are on there or who I'm talking to when I post something. I know I could exhaustively go through my friends and sort them out... but it's a pain. So I keep the account and check in once every few months. If they fixed the problems, I'd use it more.
    - Terretta 9y ago
      Fix your friends list. Consider one of these groups to keep it small and not-fake. People you’ve: - shared a roof with overnight - been in their home or had them over - shared a meal with (by invitation, not bumped into) Don’t let FB water down your personal definition of ‘friend’.
      - speedplane 9y ago
        I don't do this anymore, but long ago (I've had a FB account since at least 2005), I used to add friends I met while traveling. We'd have an awesome night in some foreign city, shared a roof, and ate dinner together... so I added them. At this point, I can't remember anything about them, but it'd meet your definition. But it's not just friends I don't remember. It's that I have all my family on there, my ex's, my kindergarten classmates, my work colleagues. I'm wouldn't say the same think to Aunty Iris as I would to my college friends.
tim333 9y ago
As a counter point to the article and most of the comments on HN, I like Facebook don't find it makes me feel bad. I suspect that in the studies showing a correlation between feeling bad and using Facebook the causation goes the other way. People who don't have enough friends and social life in the physical world both feel bad and go on Facebook as a substitute. This would be a simpler explanation for why they have 2bn users and growing - people like the service.
- mbrock 9y ago
  Like in so many situations, causality is more likely to be cyclical than linear. That's how malignant habits work: they appear to easily alleviate a symptom, but thereby prevent actual recovery or growth.
rsaarelm 9y ago
I stopped logging to Facebook years ago. I also haven't had much any interesting long-form online discussions in years and I miss them. Several people I know say Facebook comment threads and a curated friend group are just the sweet spot for them now. Still not going to log into Facebook, but I think there's an axis where my life is worse for that.
tpeo 9y ago
How much does the average user actually use Facebook, specially nowadays? I'd be rather surprised if the total amount of time spent on Facebook didn't have something like a power-law distribution. The only reason I have an account at all is so that, in the unlikely event that I might be notified of something that I actually care about or that someone might try to reach me, I'll know it. And I'm sure that is true of at least a portion of other users. Having Facebook today is like having a landline seven years ago. I wonder if in seven years Facebook will only be used for marketing, too.
- speedplane 9y ago
  Zuckerberg and Facebook are smart. They know FB isn't for everyone, that's why they have Instagram and whatsapp.
johnchristopher 9y ago
I am in a weird situation where I have to teach people about Facebook, pages and ad campaign while I myself haven't logged (not even for a sneak peek) or posted in a year. That thing is a cancer and one of the aspects of my job is basically to be a Facebook evangelist.
bukgoogle 9y ago
Please people stop it. They will inject they agenda on everything. Trying push they political agenda. They steal your private information and sell it. Follow, locate you with they mobole apps. Prosecute you for liking anything, expose your information to government / CIA officials.. Just take a moment and listen all CIA whistleblower statements.. Alex Jones have been talking about this now over 10 years and still.. there people who just follow the mainstream liars.. quite unbelievable Why people ? I really wonder so many times the ethos of these companies.. google, facebook, twitter .. all just same big brotherhood company ..
Xoros 9y ago
I use Facebook essentially as a RSS feed for bands I like since a concert I missed of one of my favorite band in 2007. They were playing in my town and I wasn't aware of it. Since then they split so I'll never see them live. So I started subscribing on my bands Facebook pages to never miss anything again. Also using it to comment sometimes.
rendall 9y ago
In my observation, unhappiness leads to more social media use, rather than the causal arrow going the other way. It's not that Facebook makes people unhappy, but unhappiness that drives many people to post prolifically on Facebook.
ryanb23 9y ago
I don't use it a ton. I prefer Twitter.
synicalx 9y ago
Unfortunately, FB is about the only way I can keep in contact with a lot of my old friends since they don't use any of the alternatives and are also scattered all over the world. What is really creepy though, is signing up for a new account, on a new device, using a fake name, and a different email address, and having FB immediately start suggesting people you've know IRL for 20+ years. I get that there's a million ways they could work out who I am, but the fact that they go to that extent from the get-go is a more than a bit creepy. I'm actually tempted to do a bit of an experiment next time I go overseas - buy a brand new device, with cash, on the other side of the world and sign up for email and then facebook using just that device and see if they can work out who I am. I'd half expect to see someone in a FB t-shirt lurking in some nearby bushes whispering into a mic...

32 points by imartin2k 9y ago

I haven’t used FB for years, I don’t even have an account, and don’t miss it at all. When I want to connect with my friends I use WhatsApp, for brainless time passing I use Reddit and I use HN for stimulation and discussion.

icebraining 9y ago
> I haven’t used FB for years (...) When I want to connect with my friends I use WhatsApp Mark Zuckerberg rubs his hands :) Not a criticism, I do the same, despite having refused to join FB.
kelnos 9y ago
And that's why FB's acquisitions of Instagram and WhatsApp were so brilliant: Zuck recognizes that he's going to inevitably lose some people from FB, so he's diversified.

westiseast 9y ago

The blog poster seems to be missing the critical point - maybe he's never smoked. It's an addiction. To your phone, to social response, to 'new'. The way way to give up is to treat it like an addiction.

hellofunk 9y ago
Actually, I would say that you were missing the critical point that he is making in the article. It's not an addiction in this case, I also would like to get off Facebook, and I am certainly not addicted to it since I check in on it maybe once a month. But I stay for the same reason the author does, which is that everyone I know is on there, and I don't have an easy way to stay in touch with them otherwise.

omarchowdhury 9y ago

At the heart of it? The need to connect with others. (Not saying that Facebook satisfies this need, but it is a need.)

KozmoNau7 9y ago

I don't know about others, but I use it primarily to keep up to date on bands I like, and because it's a convenient way to manage an event and invite people.

ubercow 9y ago
>keep up to date on bands I like Specifically for this use case I like Songkick [0]. Lets me know when anyone I'm following is touring near me. Lets you import artists from Spotify too. 0: https://www.songkick.com/home https://www.songkick.com/home
- KozmoNau7 9y ago
  I used Bandsintown for the same thing for a while. But neither gives you updates straight from the bands, about contests and other stuff that isn't directly tour-related.
stinos 9y ago
Same here. Most, if not all, bands/labels/party organizers I know are on FB. Even the more underground ones eventually switched. And last time I checked there was still no proper alternative (and the forums I used to frequent for that same goal are gone or close to dead, mostly because of FB). For me this is the key value of FB, the solcial aspect is close to non-existing for me, most of my 'friends' being blocked so their messages don't generate noise amongst the messages from bands I do want to see. I do realize this makes me a bit of an outlier though: none of the typical science/articles about FB, like this one, applies to me because I'm not in it for the social part. I do understand it though; just like I'd urge hose who are like 'I got rid of FB and didn't miss it one moment' to realize that while it's possible that worked for you, some people just don't have that luxury of being able to easily quit. I'd also miss FB if it were to disappear tomorrow, but mainly because I'd had to spend time and search for a new practical tool which does the same as what I use it for now.

kisstheblade 9y ago

What I have found that everyone uses facebook to post stuff about themselves and voice their "important" opinions on stuff. Nobody uses it to "connect". Or for sure maybe sometimes but surely it's not the only way that people can connect in these days. I can connect with people in a myriad of ways, as always, even before facebook. I have seen absolutely no change in how "connected" I am after facebook has taken over. Anyhow if it so important for "connecting" then how come I, without facebook, still am very much connected with my friends and family.

herbst 9y ago
> What I have found that everyone uses facebook to post stuff about themselves and voice their "important" opinions on stuff. I have got the very same impression. It ended up like a huge ego driven circle jerk. Most "communication" happens passively (likes, post emojis, passive comments, shares). And barely anyone is even interested in provided OC. Its a sad place these days

xupybd 9y ago

Focus on friends that only share memes and Facebook makes you feel awesome

gfredtech 9y ago
During my last days, I spent my time on Facebook for the memes. But I still deleted it anyways

zw123456 9y ago

I removed my account a few months back (you have to request that, you can't delete it on your own, which I think sucks). I did it because I feel that they betrayed our democracy for profit and I do not want to support an organization like that. And that was the feedback I gave them. I do not miss it one bit.

humanrebar 9y ago
If you think companies like facebook can manipulate democracy, you have problems with open democracy, at least information-age democracy, not facebook in particular. Undergirding democracy is the idea that citizens are intelligent and trustworthy enough to deal with yellow journalism, propaganda, etc. Or, at least, that is a downside of the least bad approach to governance so far.
- kelnos 9y ago
  > Undergirding democracy is the idea that citizens are intelligent and trustworthy enough to deal with yellow journalism, propaganda, etc. The Nov 2016 US election, and the investigations into news propagation on sites like FB, is outright proof that citizens are in fact not intelligent enough on average to deal with this. I'm not trying to shit on people or be flippant, but... it's not looking good. Certainly censoring people or legislating FB into oblivion isn't the answer, but I'm not sure what is. "Educate everyone better" seems like a catch-22 at best, likely destined to fail. And I don't think this is an example of a company influencing elections. FB was pretty unwitting there. Others found creative, unintended ways to use the platform to do their dirty work.
  - humanrebar 9y ago
    There are serious implications to that conclusion. The citizens are the watchers in a democracy. If they can't be trusted to come to reasonable conclusions on their own, there is no other authority qualified to ensure they are properly informed and vetted. It is circular, to say the least, to have the government regulate how to educate citizens about how to pick the next government.

newscracker 9y ago

It seems like people becoming increasingly physically isolated and not connecting even with neighbors makes online connections valuable. It's pervasive and avoids moving physically. And of course, the network effect of others being on Facebook.

Sir_Substance 9y ago
>It seems like people becoming increasingly physically isolated and not connecting even with neighbors makes online connections valuable. This kind of thinking never held much water with me. You don't get to choose your neighbors, the odds that they'll be compatible with you in the way that might lead to meaningful friendships is extremely low. None of my parents friends are former neighbors. Lots of them are former church-goers from the various churches they've attended though. I think that shows that you really only need one thing in common to help filter out the majority of the population. If you like bowling, take up bowling, and I bet you'll find quite a few people you get on with quite well. Ditto paintball, and obviously ditto friday night drinking. But the idea that Facebook is "ruining the connection we used to have with the people around us" is pretty much nonsense. We never really cared that much about the people around us, neighbors were always just acquaintances.
- kelnos 9y ago
  Very much agreed. I've lived in the bay area for 13 years, in apartments with at least 20 units in them (usually many more), and I have not known even one of my neighbors. Beyond that, I have a very healthy in-person social life filled with people I've met through other avenues. Even though you'd think it'd be easy to do so, I just don't have much interest in meeting the other people who live in my building. This isn't universal, of course -- one of my good friends lives in a building with 4 units, and he knows everyone who lives there. Diff'rent strokes, I guess. I wonder if knowing your neighbors is more of a suburban/rural/family thing? When I was growing up (suburbs of NJ and later MD), we always at least knew the people who lived on our block, even if we weren't close friends with them.
  - 9y ago

Kluny 9y ago

Based on the other comments so far, it sounds like HN'ers mostly don't use facebook and don't miss it. Fair enough, but I'm in the same camp as the article's author, and looking for a way out. I might be unique, but I didn't really have much of a social life before facebook. That's not causal relationship - before 2007ish I was a very introverted kid who didn't know how to make friends or form strong relationships. All of my good friendships came into existence after about 2009, when I started to learn how to socialize better, and for the most part, facebook is my main contact point with all those people. That's only because facbook was the dominant communication method during that time. But there it is, and I'm stuck with it, and I can't seem to get unstuck. I want to hear about the new babies, jobs, city moves, projects, and parties that people have going on, and facebook is the best way to get that info. But 90% of what you get there is political garbage, pointless memes, MLMs, and facebook's own "manufactured content". It's frustrating and it's making me unhappy too.

skrebbel 9y ago
> I want to hear about the new babies, jobs, city moves, projects, and parties that people have going on This is the point. We non Facebook users decided we don't care enough about that stuff. Or at least not until someone tells us about it in person. There's no real problem with hearing half a year late that a friend of a friend, who is also a direct acquaintance of sorts, became a parent.
- jamesrcole 9y ago
  You're generalising a lot about the motivations of users and non-users.
  - skrebbel 9y ago
    Fair enough.
flohofwoe 9y ago
At least in Germany this role of keeping up to date about events among family and friends seems to have moved to WhatsApp. You still get all the baby- and vacation-pictures, but without the propaganda-, 'you might like'- and advertisement-postings Facebook is bombarding you with. Personally I have moved off Facebook since end 2016 and was one of the last holdouts, most of my family, and friends from the 'real world' don't have an Facebook account or have left their account idle since long before that. PS: the irony is of course that WhatsApp is owned by Facebook ;)

Nothorized 9y ago

Ok, I a

Nothorized 9y ago

Ok, I am not be the "usual" reader of Hacker News (HN). I am reading HN since 2012 for disclaimer. So basically, Facebook (FB) is for socializing in real life. Since I am currently in exchange, It is useful to create parties and to invite people to them. It is also useful to talk with your friend on the other side of the earth (more than Whatsapp), to keep up to date with them. And it is also the best way to get into groups, to exchange ideas, or into the group of your university. So basically, FB is my social life. Do I like that ? No. But would i have a social life without FB ? No. Most of the people here are seeing FB as the devil, but it helps me to invite to parties girls I want to hang out with or get invited to parties, and since everyone (or most of the people, more most of the people) are looking for raising their number of friends on Facebook, it is really useful to connect with new peoples. But, yes, I am invited to parties without FB, but not as much. Also, for group projects, it is the closest thing to Slack for College students. So as much as I hate FB, it is really useful, sadly.

speedplane 9y ago
Have you tried dropping FB? Relying on old-fashioned txt message to ask your friends whatsup?
- jamesrcole 9y ago
  As an aside, it's funny that text messages can now be considered "old fashioned".

srge 9y ago

It's been 2 years that I have deleted both my FB accounts (one for family and friends, the other for business), my IG account and my Twitter account. All accounts had many years of activity and substantial following. I never looked back and I am very much happier. What made me decide is that I realized that I had become an self inflicted obligation to create content to feed my online personas every days. Basically I was doing things in my real life that I did not want to do just to feed a virtual person's life (mine) on other people's websites to impress my friends and contacts. This is insane.

jamesrcole 9y ago
I've heard other people make the same point, and I don't understand it. Why did you feel obligated to create content? A lot of the time I've used it, I've personally been happy just seeing what other people have posted.
- srge 9y ago
  One could argue that those social platforms are designed to keep you engaged.
- kelnos 9y ago
  I've slowed down a lot lately in my posts to FB and IG. I think the turning point for me was when I saw a friend at a party (someone I don't see often and don't have much of a one-on-one relationship with), and she told me something to the effect of "I decide where to eat based on the photos you post on IG". I'm sure she was exaggerating, and certainly didn't mean to imply any sort of obligation on my part, but it hit me... why am I posting all this stuff? I've never had any burning desire to be some sort of "online influencer", so what was I really doing? Either I'm bragging about all the cool places I've been to (which I think would be pretty lame of me), or I'm in effect advertising for the restaurants I visit (which isn't too objectionable, but certainly isn't my job). If I were posting things for artistic or comedic value that I wanted to share, or posting actual photos that illustrated what's going on in my life, I'd feel better about it. So I post less. And as for FB, my feed is overloaded with politics and social justice posts. Both of which are important, but it gets to be too much, very quickly. And it's not what I want to use FB for -- I have news aggregators for those sorts of things. I used to have pinned tabs in Firefox open for FB and Twitter, but upon closing them a couple months ago I find I'm much happier. I can still manually navigate to FB when I need to, and I still have the mobile app, but I think I'm starting to find the right level of engagement with FB that makes me happiest and gives me the most utility.

NiklasMort 9y ago

Unfortunately the amount of groups on Facebook is nowhere else to be found, especially important for people who move/travel a lot. Not to mention the majority of events & co often only is posted on FB.

herbst 9y ago
I travel a lot plus mostly live in a different place than i originally grew up with, so moved quite a few times, so have plenty remote friends. Still i dont miss it and i never felt i should get another FB profile. Even thought i dont had one the last 4 years. What i am trying to say is that you most likely wont even know how irrelevant FB is for you life as long as you hold on to it for whatever reasons.

ljamf 9y ago

Full disclosure up front: i work for a company which sells ads based on user behavior. I get that it's creepy, "spying" on users, but really, would you rather have ads from services which know nothing about you? Companies want to buy ads that users are interested in, obviously. If I have a company selling vegan food i would optimally only buy ads shown to people who are already vegan, right? And they probably don't want ads from your local butcher, but might be interested in my new awesome vegan food. Again, i get that it's creepy, especially on Facebooks scale, but I feel the discussion gets lopsided sometimes. I don't use Facebook much, but I'm fine with that my browser behavior is tracked.

jcbrand 9y ago
> would you rather have ads from services which know nothing about you? I'd rather have zero ads. If I'm interested in something, I'll search for it, or ask around.
mbrock 9y ago
Of course I would rather get irrelevant ads than have irresponsible firms tracking the patterns of my online behavior. That seems like an extremely obvious choice. Ads are not there for my benefits, they are memetic weapons deployed by corporations to nudge my subconscious. I haven't voluntarily clicked on a single ad in my entire life. They are 100% obnoxious, and these days, privacy violating to a staggering degree.
- kelnos 9y ago
  You're in the minority, though. The majority of people don't even have an adblocker installed. The companies that are able to give their services away for "free" wouldn't be able to do so without the majority of people who are at least marginally accepting of their ads. I'm not trying to say you have an obligation to look at ads (I hate advertising nearly as much as you do), but I do understand and accept why these practices are there, and believe that, for the people that do see ads, targeted ads are more useful than untargeted random noise. I would happily instead pay monthly for things that are largely ad-supported, if they'd give me that option.
9y ago

speedplane 9y ago

Facebook says that 5.5%-11% of accounts are "fake". I'd guess the number is higher. There is so much spam, fake friend requests, and general internet hucksters on FB, that I've lost trust in the platform. Real-life people send me friend requests a few times a week, but I easily get 5-10 spammer friend requests a day. I don't know if stuff I'm reading is (1) just there; (2) put there due to an algorithm trying to cater to my tastes; (3) inserted by spammers; or (4) paid for by god-knows-who. Every time I log into FB, I feel like I'm stepping into a room with people I sort of recognize but don't know. On the internet, I rather make conversation with true strangers on Hacker News than these quasi-strangers on FB.

ship_it 9y ago
Just curious, why are you still on there?
- speedplane 9y ago
  I don't have a moral or ideological opposition to FB, more of a practical one... I don't really know who my friends are on there or who I'm talking to when I post something. I know I could exhaustively go through my friends and sort them out... but it's a pain. So I keep the account and check in once every few months. If they fixed the problems, I'd use it more.
  - Terretta 9y ago
    Fix your friends list. Consider one of these groups to keep it small and not-fake. People you’ve: - shared a roof with overnight - been in their home or had them over - shared a meal with (by invitation, not bumped into) Don’t let FB water down your personal definition of ‘friend’.
    - speedplane 9y ago
      I don't do this anymore, but long ago (I've had a FB account since at least 2005), I used to add friends I met while traveling. We'd have an awesome night in some foreign city, shared a roof, and ate dinner together... so I added them. At this point, I can't remember anything about them, but it'd meet your definition. But it's not just friends I don't remember. It's that I have all my family on there, my ex's, my kindergarten classmates, my work colleagues. I'm wouldn't say the same think to Aunty Iris as I would to my college friends.

tim333 9y ago

As a counter point to the article and most of the comments on HN, I like Facebook don't find it makes me feel bad. I suspect that in the studies showing a correlation between feeling bad and using Facebook the causation goes the other way. People who don't have enough friends and social life in the physical world both feel bad and go on Facebook as a substitute. This would be a simpler explanation for why they have 2bn users and growing - people like the service.

mbrock 9y ago
Like in so many situations, causality is more likely to be cyclical than linear. That's how malignant habits work: they appear to easily alleviate a symptom, but thereby prevent actual recovery or growth.

rsaarelm 9y ago

I stopped logging to Facebook years ago. I also haven't had much any interesting long-form online discussions in years and I miss them. Several people I know say Facebook comment threads and a curated friend group are just the sweet spot for them now. Still not going to log into Facebook, but I think there's an axis where my life is worse for that.

tpeo 9y ago

How much does the average user actually use Facebook, specially nowadays? I'd be rather surprised if the total amount of time spent on Facebook didn't have something like a power-law distribution. The only reason I have an account at all is so that, in the unlikely event that I might be notified of something that I actually care about or that someone might try to reach me, I'll know it. And I'm sure that is true of at least a portion of other users. Having Facebook today is like having a landline seven years ago. I wonder if in seven years Facebook will only be used for marketing, too.

speedplane 9y ago
Zuckerberg and Facebook are smart. They know FB isn't for everyone, that's why they have Instagram and whatsapp.

johnchristopher 9y ago

I am in a weird situation where I have to teach people about Facebook, pages and ad campaign while I myself haven't logged (not even for a sneak peek) or posted in a year. That thing is a cancer and one of the aspects of my job is basically to be a Facebook evangelist.

bukgoogle 9y ago

Please people stop it. They will inject they agenda on everything. Trying push they political agenda. They steal your private information and sell it. Follow, locate you with they mobole apps. Prosecute you for liking anything, expose your information to government / CIA officials.. Just take a moment and listen all CIA whistleblower statements.. Alex Jones have been talking about this now over 10 years and still.. there people who just follow the mainstream liars.. quite unbelievable Why people ? I really wonder so many times the ethos of these companies.. google, facebook, twitter .. all just same big brotherhood company ..

Xoros 9y ago

I use Facebook essentially as a RSS feed for bands I like since a concert I missed of one of my favorite band in 2007. They were playing in my town and I wasn't aware of it. Since then they split so I'll never see them live. So I started subscribing on my bands Facebook pages to never miss anything again. Also using it to comment sometimes.

rendall 9y ago

In my observation, unhappiness leads to more social media use, rather than the causal arrow going the other way. It's not that Facebook makes people unhappy, but unhappiness that drives many people to post prolifically on Facebook.

ryanb23 9y ago

I don't use it a ton. I prefer Twitter.

synicalx 9y ago

Unfortunately, FB is about the only way I can keep in contact with a lot of my old friends since they don't use any of the alternatives and are also scattered all over the world. What is really creepy though, is signing up for a new account, on a new device, using a fake name, and a different email address, and having FB immediately start suggesting people you've know IRL for 20+ years. I get that there's a million ways they could work out who I am, but the fact that they go to that extent from the get-go is a more than a bit creepy. I'm actually tempted to do a bit of an experiment next time I go overseas - buy a brand new device, with cash, on the other side of the world and sign up for email and then facebook using just that device and see if they can work out who I am. I'd half expect to see someone in a FB t-shirt lurking in some nearby bushes whispering into a mic...