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Alphabet considers Lyft investment of about $1B
- SilasX 9y agoTo address the elephant in the room: >Alphabet is also an Uber shareholder through its GV venture capital arm, but Waymo, a unit of Alphabet, is currently suing Uber over self-driving car technology. As the relationship has deteriorated, Waymo signed a partnership with Lyft to work together on testing autonomous vehicles.
- nothrabannosir 9y agoThanks. As a casual observer, I was losing track.
- Fricken 9y ago>Uber is advancing on an investment from SoftBank Group Corp. and others of as much as $12 billion, most of which would allow existing shareholders to cash out. These two events don't seem unrelated, there appears to be a big shuffle-up going on. GV must be one of the shareholders looking to cash out of Uber. Google ventures was part of a 258 million dollar investment round in Uber in 2013, and it's anybody's guess as to what that's worth today with the complexities of Uber finances. Alphabet subsidiary Waymo announced a partnership with Lyft in May, though the particulars of that partnership were vague.
- msoad 9y agoInteresting observation! It makes total sense!
- ringaroundthetx 9y agoVenture Capital routinely has investments in the same kinds of ventures in their portfolio. Yes, although you - the lowly plebe - only has the ability to feign passion for and work for a single founder at a time, the same VC's will be at Startup Grind 2018 bragging about how they have two dozen of the same kinds of companies in their portfolio, because they had a moonshot on one of them in the 90s.
- wickawic 9y agoThis is a plot point in season one of Silicon Valley, for whatever that's worth.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- hkmurakami 9y agoIt's best for their licensing business if the market does not turn into a monopsony.
- nsoldiac 9y agothe "L" in the alphabet puzzle?
- pishpash 9y agoEnemy of my enemy ...
- quickthrower2 9y agoIs non-commutitivity.
- Bahamut 9y agoIt’s interesting to see Lyft doing well here - the news was quite bad for Lyft it seemed just a year ago or so, with Uber dominating headlines and in users’ minds of those inclined to use ride sharing as well as such rumors circulating such as Lyft failing to find a buyer. Fast forward after numerous gaffes on Uber’s side including the former CEO, and there seems to be a lot of good will that has shifted to Lyft. Doesn’t necessarily mean Lyft will thrive, but it looks a lot more promising than a year ago.
- delias_ 9y agoAside from the not-Uber aspect, istio and envoy have driven a lot of excitement around lyft from a tech perspective. I wonder how much that factors in here or if I'm overestimating the hype.
- ng12 9y agoThe level of differentiation is so small I don't think much of that matters. At the end of the day I care about getting from point A to be point B. Which service I use just depends on which app I feel like opening.
- MegaButts 9y ago> Which service I use just depends on which app I feel like opening. You could say the same thing about search engines, it's just a matter of which search engine you open. I'm sure you'll say 'but they give different results, and one is faster, and one doesn't track me, etcetera' - but you could make the same argument about Uber vs Lyft. At one point only one service offered tipping (although that's since changed). Initially Lyft drivers tended to fist bump their riders and would encourage them to sit in the front seat, although that seems to be less common. They do seem to be getting more and more similar, but it's not hard for them to differentiate themselves beyond price.
- grizzles 9y agoAlphabet has too much money syndrome. It's a nice problem to have; they obviously don't have enough good stuff to invest in. Lyft/Uber have no special sauce. They have a quickly growing revenue stream with dubious profit potential. That's it. Consumer internet is AlphaGoogle's bread and butter. They could easily put these guys out of business. Regulatory concern and Wall Street accounting image management would be the justification for this kind of deal.
- sumedh 9y ago> Lyft/Uber have no special sauce. So are you saying a new player can easily beat them?
- grizzles 9y agoWith Google's warchest? Without a doubt. Google could run these guys over with their unsold inventory alone. Though I imagine that's probably used to prop up the CPAs of their big buyers. They could also snap their fingers and add a taxi app to all devices with Google Play Services.
- malandrew 9y agoif they do anything to advantage installation and usage of their own app over the existing alternatives, they are going to be doing the exact same anti-competitive thing as Microsoft did with Internet Explorer.
- sumedh 9y ago> With Google's warchest? So why did Google fail with Google Plus with such a huge warchest?
- grizzles 9y agoThey didn't make a pixel perfect copy of Facebook. Instead they made their own thing, because vanity, ego, pride, etc. If they did that before 2007, we'd be talking about Facebook like it was MySpace right now.
- danblick 9y agoI've been thinking a little about the economics of self driving cars and it seems to make sense that they'd seek a partnership with a ride sharing service. While I guess the eventual goal could be "a self driving car in every garage", you'd probably pay for more for one if (1) you're using it all the time (high utilization), and (2) it introduces some other kind of savings (like not having to pay a driver). Consumers have neither really but taxi/trucking companies would have both. I guess it's a question of how much the hardware is really going to cost. Does anybody know of publications that talk about the economics here?
- cyrux004 9y agoAs of now the goal of companies leading in this area is not be a "self driving car in every garage", but ride sharing in metropolitan cities. There's no rush to provide L5 level capabilities to a farm owner in Idaho
- reilly3000 9y agoYet that farm owner will probably have a 'crew' of self-driving tractors.
- fish_fan 9y agoActually you already have mostly self driving tractors. However wheb there's that much money at stake, hiring a driver to hit "stop" if something goes wrong is a very cheap option.
- ac29 9y agoNot sure why you were downvoted -- autosteer and more advanced farm vehicle automation technology has been available and in wide use for years. Sub-cm level accuracy is widely commercially available. Planting/havesting/etc regular rows of crops on private property with computer positioning control is easy compared to high-level auto-driving on public roadways. Similar position-automation technology is widely used in mining, construction and more.
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- noncoml 9y agoAlphabet by putting its fingers in every possible pie is begging for split-up.
- malandrew 9y agoI can't wait for them to be split them up. It could be the EU or the Republican party that succeeds in making this happen.
- rifung 9y agoWhy the Republican party? Isn't the Republican party pro free market and business generally?
- andybak 9y agoInteresting that you don't regard breaking up monopolies (if we call Alphabet that for the sake of argument) as being "pro free market and business". That's assuming "pro free market" and "pro business" aren't in contradiction with each other. It rather depends which business one is being "pro" towards.
- whataretensors 9y agoI hope someone will combine decentralized currency with ride-sharing, such that the car owner gets a much higher percentage of the profits and the rider pays less. A small amount can also go to the app writer, who would be using the shared decentralized backend(such that multiple apps could share the same decentralized data store). Once self-driving arrives each transaction could be a barter based on source and destination locations, along with the self-driving car's specific schedule. An intelligent network may emerge, where specific rides are cheaper for a car that needs to go to the specified area of town. You could further augment costs by allowing the self-driving car to manage it's own energy supply. I realize there are downsides to be thought through and the technology is nowhere near ready for this idea.
- CydeWeys 9y agoWhat does the decentralized currency add to it? Why/how would drivers get a larger percentage of the fare, in combination with the rider paying less? Right now ridesharing is cheap because it's partially subsidized; prices would go up if you stop doing that.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- fleitz 9y agoService could be delivered cheaper as you wait 8 minutes for your BTC transaction to be confirmed. It's a very innovative way to increase wait times while increasing customer satisfaction amongst those who give a shit how the payment manages to transact.
- whataretensors 9y agoThere are several altcoins offering fast transactions these days. I agree about bitcoin, very slow and scary waiting for the transaction.
- quickthrower2 9y agoCentralised currency requires a bank like entity to transfer money from customer to driver. That forces the app to be centralised and one run by a unicorn. Small players will get fleeced on txn charges. A decentralised app (or apps) could work on a protocol and use bitcoin and the margins can be squeezed to almost zero as there are lots of competing apps, providers and aggregators etc. Think: like airlines. Only without the luxury/economy differentiation that exists in that industry. Ridesharing is subsidized right now but that can't last forever, right?
- SN76477 9y agoUber seem like such dickheads, I uninstalled it and used Lyft exclusively. Good for them.
- dogruck 9y agoCertainly your prerogative. But you're in coalition with the tiny minority who stopped flying United after the Chicago PD yanked the guy off a flight.
- freyir 9y agoRegardless of Uber or United, what's your point? If everybody else turns a blind eye to bad behavior, we might as well abandon our own principles out of convenience?
- pentae 9y agoI tried Lyft and I much prefer the UI! The apps way better. But then I compared quotes for a fare across town and Uber was about 40% cheaper. I'm not stingy but that seemed ridiculous to me.
- onion2k 9y agoThat probably means the driver is earning more, which indirectly results in a better and more sustainable service which I see as two huge benefits. While I'd be hesitant too, I might use Lyft despite it costing more. As it is though I live in the UK so I can't.
- icebraining 9y agoIt probably means the driver is earning more per ride. It might very well mean they're earning less in total.
- chickenbane 9y agoI didn't uninstall, but Lyft is first choice unless it's on surge pricing. Must admit Uber Eats is useful though
- KKKKkkkk1 9y agoTo my knowledge, the background check that Lyft has for its drivers is so lax that people can drive without having a social security number. I'm wondering how many undocumented drivers are working for Lyft as opposed to Uber, and how this squares with their squeaky-clean image.
- ballenf 9y agoSeriously, you're worried about whether they might be undocumented? If Lyft has Lax background checks that would have me worried more about my safety and less about immigration issues. Are these lax checks something you know firsthand or have read somewhere?
- KKKKkkkk1 9y agoI'm not worried about them being undocumented. What bothers me is that a company that claims to follow the law to a T and uses that as a marketing point contributes to violations of US immigration law. (I know a guy who has driven for Lyft for months while he had a tourist visa. He entered an all-zeros SSN when he registered, and they never followed up.)
- golfer 9y agoCitation needed.
- quickthrower2 9y agoWell there are plenty of social security numbers floating around now.
- Kiro 9y agoHow is Lyft any better than Uber?
- sschueller 9y agohttp://www.uberscandals.org http://www.uberscandals.org
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- piyushpr134 9y agoLyft will be the first taxi company with self driving cars at scale. With this investment, they won’t bother with other markets till they have US sorted out.
- jondubois 9y agoIt's strange when companies leak that kind of information before a deal has been signed. It sounds desperate... Like if that will increase the pressure on Google to follow through with the deal... Or maybe it's also to incentivize prospective investors to sign over their funds to Lyft. To me it reads like a warning sign that Lyft desperately needs money.
- viridian 9y agoI think you've hit the nail on the head here. I don't think it's a surprise to anyone that Lyft needs money. Both Lyft and Uber are operating at a big loss, and Lyft has been bleeding drivers over to Uber for the last couple of months if the user surveys from /r/lyft and /r/uber on reddit are any thing to go by. If someone in Lyft management thinks that this leak will help twist Alphabet's arm even a little, of course they are going to leak it.
- elvirs 9y agoGlad to hear this, I hope lyft uses the funds to get more drivers on board and advertise to more passengers. Lyft is transparent about its cut which is flat 25% while uber is being a total scam sometimes keeping up to 55% of the fare to itself.
- stanmancan 9y agoWhat's the game plan here? Burn investors money by offering cheap rides until...self driving cars can take over? It seems Uber and Lyft are both heavily subsidizing the actual cost of the ride and paying for that out of pocket. I use both services (Lyft preferably) when travelling to a country with drivers, and I'm not sure I've ever paid full price for a ride. "$25 credit" "50% off" "half price all weekend" promos seem to be coming in constantly. Is either company building a viable business? Or will usage sharply drop off once they have to eventually charge a realistic rate for a ride? Or are the drivers just a temporary casualty and the plan is to get rid of them completely ASAP?
- JimmyAustin 9y agoI'm not sure what Lyft's story is, but Uber is profitable in developed market, but is pouring enormous amounts of cash into expanding as rapidly as possible. I believe that if they cut back growth efforts, they can hit profitability relatively quickly, but this would probably bring the valuation down from the sky high level that it is at the moment.
- eganist 9y agoUber subsidizes some rides even without discounts. Just a few nights ago I paid ~$17 for a pool ride where 1) I was the only passenger the entire length of the ride and 2) the driver was paid ~$21.
- rb808 9y agopresumably that is balanced by the times when there are two riders paying $17 and the driver is paid $21.
- kungito 9y agoI use Uber about once a month in various EU countries and I never get a discount? How do I get where you are?
- tibiapejagala 9y agoNot relevant to you questions, but I'm shocked about the discounts. My only ride without paying the full price was the first ride. For the record it has been like this in Poland since 2016. It is cheaper here, but at the same ratio vs. taxi prices. Also no uber pool here or Lyft at all here.
- ulfw 9y agoAfter having invested $300MM in Uber, this is an interesting diversification strategy.