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Mainstream tech companies don't want to be accused of fraud, or even seen to be somehow connected with fraud. Naturally they want to avoid ICOs, that instantly

Mainstream tech companies don't want to be accused of fraud, or even seen to be somehow connected with fraud. Naturally they want to avoid ICOs, that instantly undermines their credibility. I talked to a guy who runs a successful ICO prepararion consulting, just told him 'i am a successful developer who did these and those things, is there a way to partner with you to make some leverage out of it?' and he told me that there is nothing technical in what they do, that is a machine to make money out of money, like, you bring in $150-$1000K and make $5-$10M on ICO with minimal effort and luck needed, that's it. No programming needed, they copy-paste all the minimal technical stuff needed. They never ask 'founders' if they have any programming backgrounds or if they actually plan to build anything, just to avoid embarrassment as everyone kinda knows they aren't. More, usually they aren't even under their real names, which is sensible for a criminal. Everything blockchain-related is at best a Ponzi scheme and usually, outright fraud, except the structures that provide technical means for these frauds, like Ethereum itself. And yes, these events make me feel that the next financial meltdown is coming. There is already too much too easy money around. If blockchain was ready in 2009, that just couldn't happen.

WikipediasBad 9y ago
>Everything blockchain-related is at best a Ponzi scheme and usually, outright fraud, except the structures that provide technical means for these frauds, like Ethereum itself. Oh please. Quit your whining. Yes, there are criminals and fraudsters in crypto trying to squeeze money and run since it's not regulated, but "everything blockchain-related is at best a Ponzi-scheme"?? That's like saying facebook stock is a Ponzi scheme because Peter Thiel got it 100,000x less in price than the people who bought it today on the exchange.
- anovikov 9y ago
  No, Bitcoin valuation is fine! Until some better crypto - which will really solve scalability problem - replaces it. What's not fine is that all or nearly all 'entrepreneurial' activity in blockchain space is aimed at pulling money out of pockets of clueless people, presenting it as 'investment', but really gambling. People who are building nearly all projects just know they aren't going to even start building anything, they are just after collecting money. Those limited who do, have no chance because their tokens will inevitably collapse too once this Ponzi scheme explodes, people will just sell every kind of shitcoin when they know it was a scam, and even 'investors' in those who aren't scams, will inevitably lose money too.
  - dreit1 9y ago
    There are plenty examples of responsibly run ICO's. OMG for example.
- loceng 9y ago
  Facebook's stock value is dictated/grounded by a relative amount of real value they've captured (along with predictable future potential), e.g. value they're already providing.
  - WikipediasBad 9y ago
    What real world value? What does that even mean to have "real value"? Selling advertising now has "real world value"? How? FB allowing people to bid on eyeballs of random people surfing their site has as much real world value as pieces of paper with dead presidents on them (or imaginary coins on a blockchain). The only reason it has value is because we agree it's valuable.
    - anovikov 9y ago
      Well Facebook stock actually means owning a part of Facebook. Owning coins mean nothing and that is openly stated in every ICO whitepaper. Also Facebook makes real world revenue and profit. Almost no blockchain startup has, or even builds, or even plans to build, a product, and almost all of their declared products are at the very least, impossible due to network scalability limits, or for the most part, even ridiculous by themselves. Plain fakes, exist only as words.
    - alexasmyths 9y ago
      "What real world value? What does that even mean to have "real value"?" The credibility of their business to generate future profits as decided upon by investors who investigate their markets, the credibility of their team and execs, etc. etc.. Most ICOs are done because those companies would not stand a chance at raising actual money - by people doing real due diligence. Doing an ICO is in fact, a pretty string signal that there is something not good about the situation. In Kik's case, well, they have maybe 3 million daily actives, and it's slowly dying, nearly zero revenues. Can't do an IPO. Should make you wonder about putting money into a currency that is dependent on their 'ecosystem'.
SippinLean 9y ago
>Everything blockchain-related is at best a Ponzi scheme You may want to look up the definition of a Ponzi scheme. In Bitcoin there is no central authority, there are no paid dividends for that central authority to route to older members instead of newer ones, etc. Ponzi (and Pyramid) are very specific, the next time you copy/paste this rant "scam" should suffice without making you seem as misinformed.

WikipediasBad 9y ago

>Everything blockchain-related is at best a Ponzi scheme and usually, outright fraud, except the structures that provide technical means for these frauds, like Ethereum itself. Oh please. Quit your whining. Yes, there are criminals and fraudsters in crypto trying to squeeze money and run since it's not regulated, but "everything blockchain-related is at best a Ponzi-scheme"?? That's like saying facebook stock is a Ponzi scheme because Peter Thiel got it 100,000x less in price than the people who bought it today on the exchange.

anovikov 9y ago
No, Bitcoin valuation is fine! Until some better crypto - which will really solve scalability problem - replaces it. What's not fine is that all or nearly all 'entrepreneurial' activity in blockchain space is aimed at pulling money out of pockets of clueless people, presenting it as 'investment', but really gambling. People who are building nearly all projects just know they aren't going to even start building anything, they are just after collecting money. Those limited who do, have no chance because their tokens will inevitably collapse too once this Ponzi scheme explodes, people will just sell every kind of shitcoin when they know it was a scam, and even 'investors' in those who aren't scams, will inevitably lose money too.
- dreit1 9y ago
  There are plenty examples of responsibly run ICO's. OMG for example.
loceng 9y ago
Facebook's stock value is dictated/grounded by a relative amount of real value they've captured (along with predictable future potential), e.g. value they're already providing.
- WikipediasBad 9y ago
  What real world value? What does that even mean to have "real value"? Selling advertising now has "real world value"? How? FB allowing people to bid on eyeballs of random people surfing their site has as much real world value as pieces of paper with dead presidents on them (or imaginary coins on a blockchain). The only reason it has value is because we agree it's valuable.
  - anovikov 9y ago
    Well Facebook stock actually means owning a part of Facebook. Owning coins mean nothing and that is openly stated in every ICO whitepaper. Also Facebook makes real world revenue and profit. Almost no blockchain startup has, or even builds, or even plans to build, a product, and almost all of their declared products are at the very least, impossible due to network scalability limits, or for the most part, even ridiculous by themselves. Plain fakes, exist only as words.
  - alexasmyths 9y ago
    "What real world value? What does that even mean to have "real value"?" The credibility of their business to generate future profits as decided upon by investors who investigate their markets, the credibility of their team and execs, etc. etc.. Most ICOs are done because those companies would not stand a chance at raising actual money - by people doing real due diligence. Doing an ICO is in fact, a pretty string signal that there is something not good about the situation. In Kik's case, well, they have maybe 3 million daily actives, and it's slowly dying, nearly zero revenues. Can't do an IPO. Should make you wonder about putting money into a currency that is dependent on their 'ecosystem'.

SippinLean 9y ago

>Everything blockchain-related is at best a Ponzi scheme You may want to look up the definition of a Ponzi scheme. In Bitcoin there is no central authority, there are no paid dividends for that central authority to route to older members instead of newer ones, etc. Ponzi (and Pyramid) are very specific, the next time you copy/paste this rant "scam" should suffice without making you seem as misinformed.