15 ms·
Smarter speed bump using non-Newtonian liquid
- naraniano 9y agoBeing Spanish, I know someone will stab those with a knife or a screwdriver the first day they are installed. That someone might even be me. I mean I'm happy they are proud of their invention but, please. Don't make me laugh.
- iaw 9y agoI was actually thinking it's a brilliant application but no where near durable enough to be practical.
- ricardobeat 9y agoHow many public lighting bulbs and metro card readers have you broken recently? Those are all more fragile than this.
- naraniano 9y agoNone, because nobody hates lighting bulbs or metro card readers, while every driver hates speed bumps. Well, maybe not all drivers, but one driver who hates that damn speed bump that he has to drive over every day is enough to make that baby bleed. :) I'm just being realistic. I've lived in an impoverished area all of my life and I know how things here work. I'm saying what I honestly believe would happen with these.
- tempestn 9y agoYou might be right that they'd be vandalized. I expect you're getting down votes largely for suggesting you'd do it yourself.
- naraniano 9y agoWhat I meant, although I guess it wasn't clear, is that from my own experience a vandal is many times not what you expect him to be. Sometimes, he's some guy with glasses who posts on Hacker News. And sometimes, that vandal is not a he, but a she. I've seen it all. :)
- nils-m-holm 9y agoI really appreciate the brutal honesty of your initial comment! Of course there is a vandal in every single one of us and those who say otherwise (or downvote) are in denial.
- tempestn 9y agoThat may be true of many, but certainly not everyone. I find most vandalism to be pretty morally reprehensible, since it does damage to another person or to society as a whole, for no benefit besides momentary enjoyment. I have significantly more compassion for a thief than a vandal. (Of course, these feelings would be somewhat proportional to the degree of damage caused.)
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- Jyaif 9y agoAnd that's why we can't have nice things.
- _nalply 9y agoAdd a fine mesh and connect the mesh to electricity like a cattle fence. Insert screwdriver and... ZORCH! Muahaha.
- gruez 9y agowhat screwdriver are you using that has conductive handles?
- dsfyu404ed 9y agox2. Put one in a rural area and eventually someone will come along and shoot it. That's what happens to absurdly low speed limits and moronically placed stop signs. I don't see why a speed bump would be any different.
- Xylakant 9y agoThis is going to be fun. Some people will learn that it's soft at slow speeds and will assume it's always soft and severely damage their cars.
- TeMPOraL 9y agoNo tears shed by me. Speed limits are to be obeyed, not ignored.
- naraniano 9y agoLet's see if you shed a tear when a car breaks and city hall (this is, all the citizens, including you) has to pay for it.
- Xylakant 9y agoThese are installed in areas with speed limits at walking speeds. So if you're driving fast enough to damage your car and then seek damages, the best thing will that might happen is that they'll laugh you off. The worst thing is that you'll loose your drivers license. (No tears shed either)
- blincoln 9y agoMaybe where you live. In the Seattle area[1], speed bumps are frequently installed on residential streets where the actual limit is 25-30 miles per hour (40-50 kilometers/hour using non-legacy units). It's typically done in "problems areas" where a small number of people drive 25-50% or more over the limit, but it's extremely frustrating, because it forces drivers to drive way below the actual limit when crossing the speed bumps - especially if they're the bolt-down kind. i.e. the effect is to cause irritation for ~99% of drivers in order to punish a tiny minority. [1] I'm sure it happens elsewhere in the US, too.
- Xylakant 9y agoSo if this kind would be installed, then they'd be soft at regulated speed and only solid at speeds significantly exceeding those. I doubt you'd be able to sue the city for breaking your car then - you have been warned. Still, no tear shed.
- jmdocherty 9y agoThis a really interesting idea. The problem of stabbing/puncturing can be solved by moving the liquid lower in the ground and having a floating more robust layer above. I imagine it would be particularly useful in places like outside hospitals where ambulances would prefer a smooth ride if possible. However, I'm sure we used to make a liquid with similar properties when we were children out of cornflower (?) and water.
- LeifCarrotson 9y agoI'm sure they will make it pretty durable. A reasonable method of construction would be like a tire, with steel mesh under thick, tough rubber. And it's corn starch, not corn flower, and water. About a 2:1 ratio.
- maxerickson 9y agoCornstarch. It is processed to isolate the starch.
- DanBC 9y ago> I'm sure we used to make a liquid with similar properties when we were children out of cornflower (?) and water. lots of people call this oobleck, and there are a gajillion of youtube videos about it.
- fencepost 9y agoIncreased expense and fragility to reduce the impact of going over speed bumps that (if properly designed) already have less impact when drivers are at out below the desired speed? Seems to me that there are likely more durable me cost effective ways to spend that money, such as making sure that bumps actually are properly sized /shaped for their target speeds. This seems like an interesting concept that's worth the effort and expense only for very niche applications.
- hirsin 9y agoA student startup built something similar for potholes, which i think is a better use of the tech (1). Essentially road repair crews could carry a couple bags of the fluid and drop the bag into a pothole, where it would confirm to the shape of the hole while stiffening on impact from the tires. Unsurprisingly this was invented in Cleveland. 1. http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2012-04/bouncy-thickening-water-powder-mix-could-serve-temporary-pothole-patch http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2012-04/bouncy-thic...
- amenod 9y ago> Unsurprisingly this was invented in Cleveland. For us uninitiated - why? Quality if the roads there?
- astrobase_go 9y agothe roads in and around the cleveland metro area have high traffic loads; undergo long periods of fluctuating cold temperatures during the winter; and get nailed periodically by lake-effect snow and ice. as such, they experience lots of freezing and thawing, experience high traffic from lots of tractor trailers and snow plows, and get coated with de-icing materials (salt, or more recently sand-based grit in some areas). synergistically, these conditions are extremely rough on paved roads, so potholes are ubiquitous and painful.
- blackguardx 9y agoAnother commentor explained how potholes form, but I'll add that Cleveland doesn't have a lot of money and tends to defer maintenance. When I was living there, road signs saying "Steel Plate on Road" were a common sight. I remember the city fixed a water pipe and instead of re-paving the street, they just left several giant 4ft x 8ft steel plates with corresponding sign for over a year.
- phyllostachys 9y agoThis is also true for the rest of the areas around Lake Erie, western PA, and probably western NY (I don't have much experience with that area). I live about an hour south of Erie, PA and the road I travel to and from work has needed resurfaced after every winter over the last 3 or 4 years.
- karmakaze 9y agoImmediately brings to mind the shield exercise in Dune which only the slow blade can pierce. Can't recall if it had a name.
- pebers 9y agoIt didn't have a name, that was just how the shields worked - they opposed motion, so only slow-moving things could pierce them.
- Havoc 9y agoThey were the result of a Holtzman generator and was an attribute inherent to shields rather than just the shield exercise. The actual slow vs fast aspect was never given a name per se.
- code_duck 9y ago"BIV baden inteligente de velocidad This Intelligent Speed Bump (BIV) is based in Non-Newtonian fluids dynamics in which particles in natural movement as liquid align when receiving an impact, thus entering into a solid state. This fluid is also biodegradable and harmless for human beings.This fluid inside the BIV is the solution to vehicles at sensible speed that will find no obstacle when driving over it. The other essential element to achieve the BIV is the plastic covering made of a special material highly resistant to aging, wear, vandalism and unfavorable weather conditions. Our plastics are planned for recycling purposes so that we can ensure sustainability by reusing disposed plastics. BIV is a new speed bump that guarantees effectiveness at exceeding speed regardless vehicles' type or weight. The speed limitation that we set will be effective for every user at the road. Installations is a fast and simple procedure by screwing up the metal plates onto the pavement in 15 minutes. This Intelligent Speed Bump is registered and patented worldwide with the aim of improving road traffic and road safety: - Reduces the possibility of traffic accidents and fatigue caused to shock absorbers. - Reduces pollution, fuel consumption and noise pollution caused by continuous bumping Currently BIV is available for indoor activities: Parking lots, Garage and Covered areas."
- l0b0 9y agoI wonder how the mixture and covering will stand up to millions of crossings, at all kinds of temperatures? Does the covering turn brittle, like most materials after cooling, heating, stretching and being exposed to sunlight? Does the mixture remain uniform over time and at different temperatures, so slow drivers don't get a surprise? Can it withstand the sideways force when someone suddenly brakes while passing it? Will it withstand the rare passing of an extremely heavy vehicle, like a tank or special transport? Is it easily sabotaged?
- Balgair 9y agoPutting these in Ann Arbor or Tuscon would be the best test. How does it fair in freeze/unfreeze daily cycling like in Michigan? Hows the rubber stuff work in Tuscon where you really can fry an egg on the sidewalk? What's the cost benefit to cash pinched cities, the maintenance, etc? What happens when bored teens try to drain it or inflate it with bottle-rockets? Does the goop damage paint? ETC. I feel this is a Silicon Valley 'Problem' where everyone else has much tougher/different ones than the Redwood City slogan of 'Climate Best By Government Test.'
- exabrial 9y agoDoes it allow emergency vehicles to proceed quickly? :/ That's my main criticism of speed bumps
- maxerickson 9y agoThey are rarely placed where the prudent maximum speed is much above the posted speed. I guess if there is a patient in fragile condition in the back of an ambulance that would be an issue.
- sandworm101 9y agoCome to my city. Many limits are based on non-safety things like road noise and antiquated notions re saving fuel. Speed bumps are common in places like huge parking lots where reasonbable varies wildly throughout the day. Bumps are also used to bring traffic down well below the posted limits.
- akgerber 9y agoMost American speed limits are well above a safe speed for neighborhoods with pedestrians and cyclists. http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0386111214000235#f0035 http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0386111214...
- dfox 9y agoI think that that is exactly the reason why this will not get used. Many speedbumps are actually designed in a way that they are imperceptible when you go sufficiently fast (80km/h is usual)
- bfung 9y agoCan someone enlighten me on why we need a smarter speed bump? If cars going too fast are going to be damaged either way, there's no benefits on that end. If the motivation is that cars can go slightly faster overall over the bump to reduce traffic... then don't put a bump there!?!? Slow traffic will still be slow?
- freditup 9y agoSpeed bumps can be painful for those with back injuries (and likely other injuries). An elderly relative of mine would have to get out of vehicles at curbs or speed bumps and get back in the car on the other side. A smarter speed bump could presumably reduce this pain as long as one goes over the speed bump at a slow speed.
- azinman2 9y agoIt’s so that when you go the appropriate speed you don’t feel the bump.
- allannienhuis 9y agoWhich can reduce damage of delicate loads, like ambulances. I expect it would reduce wear-and-tear on suspension of heavy vehicles too.
- bfung 9y agoI wonder if that would make people drive progressively faster over a stretch of road until they notice the bump. Or more common, people will speed towards the bump and again, brake right before it.
- dsfyu404ed 9y ago...and the neighborhood Concerned Mothers Association (TM) that worked so hard to get the town to install them will then start complaining when they have to listen to every motorcycle and riced out Civic accelerate after the bump.
- masklinn 9y ago
- dottrap 9y agoBadenova posted the first video on the page in 2010. It's been 7 years. Anybody know how adoption has been?
- KGIII 9y agoI don't have a direct answer for you. I can try to shine some light on it. I'm retired but worked in a related field. As such, I was expected to keep up with tech such as this and to be able to model the results of this - I modeled traffic at a fine level, ideally. Since retiring, I've kept my interests up and have paid even more attention to the coming tech. I signed a non-compete, but I still have my interests. This is the first I've heard of it. I've never heard of it and know of no usage in the industry. And yes, even parking garages sometimes get modeled during the design phase. So, make of that what you will. I've not only not heard of this product, I've not even heard of this technology being proposed. This may mean that I just missed it.
- chr1 9y agoAnother interesting way of making speed bumps smarter is changing their form: two long smooth triangles so that the slope is fairly small. Amsterdam has many speed bumps of this type, and they are fairly smooth at slow speeds.
- runeks 9y agoFrom the first video: > “Whether you respect the speed limit or not, your car will suffer from a speed bump regardless.” Can anyone confirm this? I would assume the suspension can handle speed bumps fine at low speeds. That’s what it feels like from inside the car anyway. Couldn’t it be argued that, as we approach a speed of 0 mph, there exists a speed at which no damage is done to the car whatsoever? And, if we place speed bumps accordingly, there is no need for this technology — particularly considering the difference in cost and maintenance?
- TomMarius 9y agoYou still have to brake (brake pads and discs suffer for no reason), gear down (transmission suffers) and potentially move off at a low speed (clutch suffers, your wallet suffers if you go over them frequently). Even at minimal speeds (less than 20 km/h), speed bumps feel very unpleasant and I really don't like sounds my car is doing while riding over them.
- ygra 9y agoShouldn't speed bumps be designed that you move over them at the speed allowed there, e.g. 30 km/h? So theoretically there wouldn't be a slowdown, unless you're already going faster than allowed. At least I haven't seen speed bumps in 50 km/h roads just to slow people down.
- TomMarius 9y agoShould, probably, but it's common in Central Europe that on a 50km/h road, there are 2 speedbumps that can't be safely passed if you're going over 25km/h.
- honestoHeminway 9y agoHere in germany, mostly due to tech that allows speed-bump avoidcance, most villages and citys use a sort of slalom that by virtue of physics enforces a speed limit. Also beloved are narrowings to one lane, where you can not see until you are really close up, wethere somebody from the other side is entering the lane.
- Torkel 9y agoSpeaking to a founder to a competing company (https://www.edeva.se/en/ https://www.edeva.se/en/) I found out that there has been many attempts at solving the problems of speed bumps: - Everybody gets bumped, not only high speed vehicles - Emergency vehicles need to slow down - Bus drivers and others can get back problems from speed bumps Most solutions break down because the forces and the wear and tear is so tremendous. The solution from Edeva seemed clever to me because the swing a trap door down so the bump comes from the solid ground and not from a moving part. I'm curious how this liquid solution handles emergency vehicles and the wear+tear. A mechanical solution is good but very expensive. A liquid solution seems like it could be made cheaper.
- ChuckMcM 9y agoI've always wondered what it would look like to tie one of those roadside speed monitoring trailers (they have a sign telling you the speed limit, and your speed) which were in contact with a 'speed bump' filled with hydraulic fluid. The faster you go over the limit, the harder and taller the speed bump :-) If you did this with a camera system you could avoid penalizing emergency vehicles.
- lucb1e 9y ago> If you did this with a camera Yeah I've always felt like speed cameras should have been the "disruptive technology" for speed bumps but we're lagging behind for some reason, instead choosing to penalize everyone using the road. How often are speed bumps not doable at the speed the street allows, e.g. having to go 15-20kmh over the bump in a 30 zone, or more extreme, 5kmh in a 50 zone when they want you to watch out for drunk pedestrians during events when said pedestrians aren't there (or drunk) yet/anymore...
- Moru 9y agoSpeed cameras are slightly more expensive than a speedbump and way easier to sabotage. It's enough with some paint to disable it temporarily or just cut it down if you want it disabled a bit longer.
- edwhitesell 9y agoThe biggest hurdle to speedbump placement for speeders in residential areas is emergency service response times (ISO response times and such). Now, if you had a speed bump that could become perfectly smooth when emergency vehicles are approaching, but have some other slowing effect for normal traffic, that would be interesting.
- agumonkey 9y agoQuestion I asked myself for years, why not use the idea in car bumpers. Maybe not fully loaded with fluids but non newtonian approach to shock absorption.
- yjftsjthsd-h 9y agoI would speculate that it's precisely because you don't want a car to be rigid on impact.
- agumonkey 9y agoYou want a controled response curve. Something that gradually stiffens so the objects get slowed down as much as possible
- vacri 9y agoMore trouble than it's worth. The current style of lightweight rubber or plastic bumper is already elastic for small collisions and absorbs some energy from larger ones, deforming as it goes. Replacing that with a comparitively complex sac of non-newtonian fluid will be more expensive to manufacture, more liable to vandalism, heavier, harder to repair, so on and so forth. It's also potentially able to make a big mess from a small accident that a regular bumper would shake off. Jam an iron bar into a regular bumper and you'll scuff it. Jam it into a non-newtonian sac, and you might rupture it.
- jv22222 9y agoI don't think that could work in th UK or Ireland... because bored kids would have too much fun cutting it open.
- Klathmon 9y agoWould a hinged hardcover solve that problem?
- PoachedSausage 9y agoOr cover it with chainmaille.
- emn13 9y agoThey'll use nails then.
- snaily 9y agoA similar idea (Custard-Filled Speed Bumps) dates from 2001 at the Half Bakery: http://www.halfbakery.com/idea/Custard-Filled_20Speed_20Bumps http://www.halfbakery.com/idea/Custard-Filled_20Speed_20Bump... - are there any earlier sightings?
- aerovistae 9y agoi mean, the real problem I feel like is that there are people walking too, and this is kind of a major trip hazard for the elderly and disabled, and/or pretty much everyone. "I'll just step here and WHOA WHAT HAPPENED WHY IS IT JELLY?!" I suspect this was a problem that didn't need to be solved.
- george_ciobanu 9y agoDid nobody notice the lady at 00:40 and the bizarre gestures she is asked to do during the demonstration?
- free_everybody 9y agoCool idea, but knowing my part of the world, people would LOVE to pop these. Lol.
- mnemotronic 9y agoI must be non-newtonian. The babe in the video had me changing from a soft to a solid state.
- sctb 9y agoPlease post civilly and substantively here or not at all. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- smilekzs 9y agoPurely out of curiousity: Is it physically possible for a sufficiently smart active suspension system defeat a conventional (i.e. solid bump on the road) speed bump?
- grzm 9y agoTaken a step further, could LIDAR/RADAR systems detect speed bumps and inform the suspension system?
- URSpider94 9y agoWatch the Bose suspension videos; they include a car vaulting over road obstacles.
- ghaff 9y agoAFAIK, that whole effort is pretty much dead.
- AstralStorm 9y agoUnless you're driving a truck, suspension doesn't have enough distance to switch to soft and nullify the bump for bumps of reasonable size. That if it wasn't super hard to change suspension properties on the fly.
- mikeytown2 9y agoI'd bet these trucks defeat it https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trophy_Truck https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trophy_Truck
- saagarjha 9y agoIf I remember correctly I saw a Bose demo where they were able to roll their car over speed bumps and it would stay completely level. I’m not sure if that completely negated their impact, but it looked like it from the video.
- 9y ago
- julius 9y agoMercedes has a neat solution for speed bumps as well. "Two cameras located at the top of the windscreen scan the streets and setup the suspension to absorb the bumps." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQsMfHg6jIE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQsMfHg6jIE
- jablan 9y agoNeat meaning "does not have to slow down and can keep on killing pedestrians"?
- honestoHeminway 9y agoDespots of this world know how to drive in style.
- mrguyorama 9y agoSpeed bumps are hell on cars even when they are going slowly. This can reduce the wear on the suspension and ride components without removing the "Go slower" motivation of the bump
- KozmoNau7 9y agoThe Citroën C6 and the current generation C5 with hydropneumatic suspension senses the bump with the front wheels and sets up the rear suspension to absorb the bump almost completely. Slightly more low-tech, but it works amazingly well in practice.
- rbanffy 9y agoWould it last the couple years a rigid speed bump does? Do we really have a problem with rigid speed bumps anyway?
- alex_duf 9y agoI stopped watching the video when they put a sexy lady dipping a finger in the liquid. Seriously it's 2017, you're trying to sell technology and you still objectify women.
- ainiriand 9y agoWelcome to Spain, my friend. Wait until you see what we do to animals.
- blkhawk 9y agoSo you are one of these "current year" people? Also I want to point out that your assumption of gender from pure appearance is abhorrent.
- mplewis 9y agoPlease don't concern troll.
- ShannonAlther 9y agoDevil's advocate: maybe she's one of the designers and happened to volunteer because she likes being a face. I think it's unusual that they'd go this route, and maybe it would sell better if the model was a man in a suit, but if this is the way to go then I'm not holding it against them.
- Icedcool 9y agoGrow up, and quit attempting to apply and project your moralism and sexism to other cultures.
- rexreed 9y agoThat's cause this video is from 2010. Yes, this is SEVEN YEARS old proposed technology. Read the comments - this didn't go anywhere. Even with the creepy model.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- 9y ago
- amelius 9y agoReminds me of: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2XQ97XHjVw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2XQ97XHjVw
- takk309 9y agoThis just looks like a solution for a problem that does not exist. Speed bump geometry can satisfy the need for a smooth ride at slow speeds. There are three general types of traffic calming devices that would get slotted into the "speed bump" category: 1) traditional speed bumps, 2) speed humps, and 3) speed tables. I won't bother explaining a traditional speed bump as many of us are already familiar with them. A speed hump is generally longer, in the direction of travel, than a speed bump but not so long that a normal passenger vehicle will have both axles on the hump at the same time. A speed table is long enough, again in the direction of travel, that both axles of a passenger vehicle will be on top of the table. With both humps and tables the transition can be designed for a given effect. A sudden transition will be more severe to motorists, while a long, gradual transition can make the hump or table comfortable for the motorist. With all of these traffic calming options emergency vehicles are a concern. However, traffic calming measures like these should not be placed on roadways that will be frequently traveled by emergency vehicles. These traffic calming measures should be placed on low-volume, low-speed local roads.
- dahart 9y agoI look forward to the problem of speed bumps disappearing when self driving cars take over. In the mean time, I know everyone hates it, but automated camera based speeding ticket systems would be cheaper and more effective than non-Newtonian speed bumps. We're also at a point in technology where cars could easily know the local speed limit and enforce it themselves.
- drzaiusapelord 9y agoI think its a little naive to expect these cars not to be modified for a speed advantage. The same way I can get stuck behind a pickup that's clearly not giving the emissions from its factory settings due to its owner's modifications and most likely illegal ones but with very little political will to stop. Or how people speed nowadays without consequences. Automated cars will have the same issues. We'll see a 3rd party mod and chip market immediately. "Go 20% over the limit" and "cut through alleys" and "aggressively pass and change lanes" or "ride the shoulder in heavy traffic" mods will be everywhere. Heck, we're kinda there now. Recently Google maps asked me to use an alley as a through street, which I found a little off-putting. Alleys aren't designed for thru traffic, have cars and people backing in and out, have children playing basketball, etc.
- dahart 9y agoEmissions is a problem that could go away with technology as well. But speed advantage over other cars on the road is a mostly emotional desire that matters to human drivers. Cars with speed advantage are marketed as such right now. I do think that marketing will disappear when cars go driverless. And don't forget we are in this case talking about people illegally speeding. You are not legally entitled to use your speed advantage to drive at twice the speed limit in a neighborhood with a school zone, even if there's a smoky pickup in front of you. And yet, if we don't put speed bumps in the way, some people will choose to do so anyway, putting others at risk. A kid in my neighborhood was killed just a couple of weeks ago by someone speeding, and there are several speed bumps near me that were installed immediately after children were hit.
- davesque 9y agoInteresting but how is this really better than just laying down a few extra layers of asphalt to create a traditional speed bump? Also, I feel like there's a risk here that the average person will have trouble understanding how such an unusual speed bump works. Therefore, it may end up causing damage to more cars.
- m-p-3 9y agoThe idea isn't bad, but like most new car tech it doesn't consider the harsher climates from northern countries. Cold and snow are tough problems to solve when implementing those.