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The best hypothesis, IMHO from those I've read, to why Apple ditched the jack, was to get a share of the market for headphones - either through their own headph
by retSava 9y ago
The best hypothesis, IMHO from those I've read, to why Apple ditched the jack, was to get a share of the market for headphones - either through their own headphones (Apple-branded and Beats), or through MFI.
In any case, now without the jack, they now get a share of any accessory you connect. The adapter, and any 3rd party adapters and headphones, need to be certified as MFI, which includes buying and incorporating the Apple MFI chip (forgot the name) into the design.
Which is entirely in their right of course, but it is a consumer hostile move.
- chrisseaton 9y ago> they now get a share of any accessory you connect Bluetooth audio is an open standard isn't it? I use Bluetooth speakers not made by Apple and not certified for Apple. And doesn't the iPhone include a headphone adapter? So they don't get any extra share that way either.
- stuntkite 9y agoYeah. Bluetooth and BLE don't need to be part of MFi. MFi is about standards for directly connected devices. Which does really have a place in quality control and not destroying your $1000 rectangle. Not that there aren't fake MFI (or harvested from junk electronics) chips for gas station chargers. [0] https://mfi.apple.com/MFiWeb/getFAQ.action#4-2 https://mfi.apple.com/MFiWeb/getFAQ.action#4-2
- exikyut 9y ago> "$1000 rectangle" Sorry, but - lol :D
- rasz 9y ago>Bluetooth audio is an open standard isn't it? not if you care about quality, non crappy codecs require aptX with patent fees owed to Qualcomm.
- voltagex_ 9y agoIsn't it possible to send AAC over Bluetooth these days?
- xattt 9y agoWhere's the anti-trust investigation over this?
- chrisseaton 9y agoBut Apple has a minority share in this market.
- rplnt 9y agoBut they are a major player in smartphone market that they use to leverage themselves into this market. Similar to Microsoft (majority in OS) bundling browsers and media players.
- coldtea 9y ago>But they are a major player in smartphone market that they use to leverage themselves into this market They have less than 50% of market share, so no. MS had almost 98% of desktop/work OS share (Linux was in its infancy then -- and is not used much for desktop even now--, and OS 8/9 had dropped to insignificant share).
- rplnt 9y ago> They have less than 50% of market share, so no. They have the 2nd/3rd biggest share (and not like the first one has over 50% either). Sounds major to me.
- Tepix 9y agoAnti-trust "prohibits a variety of practices that restrain trade". I don't see how it does that, especially given that they bundle a headphone adapter with the phone.
- coldtea 9y agoWhere's the anti-trust case in this?
- Ensorceled 9y ago
- philliphaydon 9y agoI thought I would miss the headphone jack but in reality I haven't missed it at all.
- intoverflow2 9y agoI thought I'd get used to it but after struggling with the dongle at first to use my preferred headphones (Cheapish Sony earbuds that I've found sound better than apple and last 2 years), then losing the dongle and resorting to earpods. I now just carry two pairs of headphones everywhere, one for my Apple laptop and one for my Apple iPhone. Even tried the Beats X, W1 chip was all hype it's barely any different from regular bluetooth and juggling with then UI to turn headphones on and off is more tedious than just plugging something in and living with a cable, so those are collecting dust now. Didn't want to buy another dongle because that would just prove to Apple that people are happy with the dongle.
- vlunkr 9y agoAren't all headphones better than the Apple ones? I certainly hope the airpods aren't as awful as they ones they pack in with the phone.
- macintux 9y agoObviously the shape of your ear matters a great deal, and the lack of wires makes the comparison a bit harder, but I've found the AirPods much more comfortable than the cheap wired headsets Apple ships (shipped?).
- welly 9y agoBeats. The only use they have are as a fashion accessory you hang around your neck. You don't play audio through them, not if you value your ears and your music.
- tobyhinloopen 9y agoThe most annoying experience is not being able to use the apple headphones that came with my phone on my macbook anymore
- madeofpalk 9y agoI always thought it was fairly evident that removing the headphone jack in the iPhone 7 was a 'long play' for the next iPhone (8/Pro/Edition/Whatever) that had more of a harder requirement to scrap it.
- sundvor 9y agoI don't understand the whole problem. If everyone who actually cared about it bought e.g. the S8 from Samsung instead, I'm sure Apple would get the message - and bring it back. Since people are still buying it in droves it must not be a real clincher to most people. The S8+ has a great DAC (as tested on my range of Audio Technica headphones), still supports Bluetooth audio - latest spec, and is a fantastic phone overall, with a design far surpassing the headphone-less iPhone 7. IMO, Apple engineers have gotten lazy. They removed the port without adding value.
- coldtea 9y ago>IMO, Apple engineers have gotten lazy. They removed the port without adding value. Or you know, they have rather good reasons for it. Like better waterproofing (Samsung always fails behind iPhone in waterproof tests, and doesn't support fully even the nominal waterproof levels they say they do), thinner feature phones in the roadmap, smarter headphones, etc.
- DSMan195276 9y agoMind giving a source for that claim? The S7 is IP68 rated, the iPhone 7 is only IP67. Are you saying those ratings are false?
- pwinnski 9y agoI'll say it, and provide a source[0]. In that video, both phones are subjected to ever-increasing water depths until the S7 dies (very respectably) after five minutes at 35 feet, while the iPhone 7 continues to operate. That suggests to me that both phones probably should have been rated IP68. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K05cTPeFfyM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K05cTPeFfyM
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- im3w1l 9y agoI think DRM is the reason - that analog can't support it.
- coldtea 9y agoThey don't have DRM in Apple Music purchases so....
- TeMPOraL 9y agoThey don't have DRM there yet. But they've opened a possibility of DRMing iPhone audio now. When other manufacturers follow suit, it'll be only a matter of time before some parties will want to make use of that possibility.
- macintux 9y agoYou realize they had DRM in iTunes music long ago at the insistence of the labels, and have killed it? Why in the world do you think Apple would add it back?
- coldtea 9y ago>The best hypothesis, IMHO from those I've read, to why Apple ditched the jack, was to get a share of the market for headphones - either through their own headphones (Apple-branded and Beats), or through MFI. The "best hypothesis"? That's the classic "lock-in" conspiracy theory. And Apple makes pennies on the headphones compared to what they make from the iPhones (and what they could lose in iPhone sales if the removal of the port proved unpopular) for that to be any great motive. How about: making the phones waterproof with one less difficult to tackle port, less width/height needed for the new port hence thinner phones, envisioning a wireless future (what with AirPods and co). The fact that there are pushing AirPods (which don't care for the jack at all) and that Apple gives a free conversion to mini-jack with each new iPhone, means that the theory "it's all about selling headphones/licenses for lighting headphones" is moot.
- rusk 9y agoI don't get why I need a waterproof iPhone? I'm not in the habit of getting my personal electronics wet? and if I had the choice between a waterproof iPhone (rarely a concern) and being able to use my headphones without charging them and/or a dongle the choice is clear for me. Also, I'd buy into the whole "thinner is better" thing if they weren't actually making the screens bigger and the "wireless future" thing is a just a load of overdreamt baloney.
- garyrob 9y agoWell, I've destroyed two iPhones by means of accidents that resulted in them falling into water.
- rusk 9y agoI think there's a bunch of pretty decent reasons why this makes sense for apple. - smaller devices reduce shipping costs en masse - marketting "thinner" devices (though screen is larger?) - DRM - No need to provide expensive native DAC - Owning the headphones market, similar to how google ended up owning "search" I'm sure there's a bunch more. It makes good business sense for them regardless of what customers (ahem, "consumers") want and with other manufacturers following suit they'll pretty much have no choice. I'm looking forward to a portable DAC being among the collection of crap I have to put in my pocket in the morning.
- bfred_it 9y agoBut, but... the iPhone 7 still comes with a dongle, so they're still providing the DAC. At least for now. The rest sounds about right, unfortunately.
- rusk 9y agoYeah, but I guess once their 3rd parties get up to speed they won't need to any more ... I think it's more of an increment in a longer term plan.
- gruez 9y agoI thought the dac is built into the dongle?
- rusk 9y agoYou are probably correct, but I think that was GP's point - apple are providing the dac .. for now
- lateadopter 9y agoThe iPhone 7 comes with two DACs, there's one in the earphones too now.
- maxerickson 9y agoShipping costs are already basically irrelevant. So that's an irrelevant benefit, not a decent reason. (the cost to ship a medium size box is about $10. $10,000 of iPhones easily fit in a medium size box. Shaving some of 0.1% is pretty irrelevant.) And if they did it in service of "owning the headphones market", that's a really dickish reason.
- fest 9y agoSome Bluetooth profiles can be used on iOS devices without MFI authentication chip on the Bluetooth device. Bluetooth audio/headset devices don't need MFI chip. Devices using Bluetooth serial port profile do need it.
- jen729w 9y agoIt kills me that people like you can't see the long play. Haven't you ever watched a sci-fi movie? Do those guys have 7mm thick phones that they carry around everywhere with a cabling dangling out of it? Nope. They have 1mm thin things that are [printed on their sleeve|hover in the air|do some other ridiculous future nonsense]. Now, is the iPhone "8" going to be like that? Clearly not. iPhone 9? Maybe not. iPhone 10? 11? That's what Apple are pushing towards. Thank god somebody is, or we'd all be carrying around 7mm thick phones for the rest of eternity.
- aloisdg 9y agoThey can look futuristic without being practical. Google Glasses are another example. The future is not a race. Sometimes it need more time to mature.
- jen729w 9y agoNeeds more time to mature away from a 3.5mm jack in to Bluetooth headphones?! Come on. Edit: I'm not saying you have to like this, just that to say that Apple did it to make a few more bucks on a dongle is cynical to the point of absurdity.
- csomar 9y agoI don't buy this. I buy Apple products and Apple accessories. I highly doubt Apple makes significant money through licensing unless you put the numbers. Removing the jack was a good decision and now, a few months only later, I do appreciate it.
- agumonkey 9y agoApple playing such tricks for marketshare is exactly the opposite of why Apple was loved. They used to find better ideas that would make the market look sad (magnet power cable instead of friction socket that would break).
- mikeash 9y agoExcept they ship an adapter with the phone, so you can still plug in regular headphones and they don't get any money from those sales.
- torgoguys 9y agoI just re-watched the "courage" part of the iPhone 7 keynote where Apple gave their reasons for removing the headphone jack. There were three: 1) Lightning is a great connector for audio. 2) The headphone jack takes a lot of space and they want to use that space for other stuff. 3) Apple has a "vision of how audio should work" on phones and they want to "get there as soon as possible." That was a lead-in to talking about Airpods Note that they underscored that #3 was the "most important" reason they made the move. #2 always made sense to me and I gave Apple a bit of a pass on removing the jack for that reason, but this thread's article shows that it was bogus, at least for the iphone 7. That leaves #1 and #3, both of which involve Apple taking a a bigger cut of headphone sales. While #1 is true, it's not where the rest of the audio market is. And #3 (remember their "most important" reason) basically can be translated to "We want to sell you Airpods." So it seems it really could have been all about Apple making more money, not about their users. Possible exception being long-term benefits created by moving the market in a particular direction. (disclaimer: Android user, who prefers using bluetooth headphones anyway, but at least that means I don't have a horse in this particular race... :) )
- epmaybe 9y ago#2 really isn't bogus, at least in the way you described it. In the video, he mentions that he broke the screen two or three times in trying to get everything to fit. Now that everything fits, what happens if he drops it? Could Apple engineer up a way to prevent a high failure rate on the LCD display? Maybe, but there's no way to know. On top of this, the author had to remove the "barometric vent". I don't find a lot of use in having an altimeter or barometer in my smartphone, but I do know that some apps take advantage of it (Dark Sky). Apple probably wants it to push some activity tracking feature, like the number of steps you've taken.
- torgoguys 9y agoSure, those objections are fair, but we are talking about someone who had to work with what Apple gave him as a starting point. Apple itself would have had a lot more latitude in design since they specify the layout, and because of that, I think it is also fair to say that the article still provides strong evidence that if Apple were doing it, they probably could have included a headphone jack without compromises.
- copperred 9y agoThe jack is legacy technology. It's that simple.
- archagon 9y agoI'd have given Apple the benefit of the doubt if they opened up the W1 chip to other Bluetooth headphone vendors. So far... nothing. Just the AirPods and Beats, along with proprietary Lightning garbage. This was very clearly a user-hostile power grab, and yet people like Gruber keep rolling their eyes at the notion that the headphone jack might still be useful to many people. And what about the things you can no longer do with any dongle, such as headphone use with simultaneous data transfer? My Apogee JAM sits gathering dust because I simply can't use it with my iPhone 7. I'm not exactly mad at Apple, but I'm starting to think that maybe Android will be the way to go for my next upgrade cycle. It's been a while since I played around with a new OS!
- djrogers 9y ago> I'd have given Apple the benefit of the doubt if they opened up the W1 chip to other Bluetooth headphone vendors. Why??? Why on earth would Apple do that, and why should they need to? The iPhone 7 works just as well or better with regular BT headsets as any other phone does (iow it mostly works, most of the time, but sometimes BT is just kinda crappy). What possible reason would Apple have to develop a clearly superior BT chipset and then just give it away?
- sbarre 9y ago> What possible reason would Apple have to develop a clearly superior BT chipset and then just give it away? I dunno, maybe for the benefit it would bring to their consumers? Or do they really need to add a few more billions to their existing pile of money?
- archagon 9y agoOn stage, Apple clearly implied that the future of audio was something along the lines of the W1: easy to pair, high quality, low latency. (With this, who needs wires anymore?) It was billed as a forward-looking, pro-consumer move. But the future of audio won't be proprietary. It can't be, simply because most people don't use iPhones. The way I see it, the fact that Apple won't even license their tech spells out the true intent behind the removal of the headphone jack. They don't want to move technology forward; they just want to lock in their users for expensive audio equipment.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- orbitur 9y agoThe best hypothesis is that they removed the headphone jack when they didn't need to, so people would lose their minds in 2016. Notice how there's still space for the jack in the 7. So in 2017, when they actually need to remove the headphone jack (probably because the phone is more thin than is actually useful), it won't be as big of a deal. They're not going to say that in their keynote.
- mark-r 9y agoWhen growth is slowing in your main product, you have to find ways to take up the slack. It's going to be consumer hostile almost by definition, since the goal is to take more money from the consumer. I don't ever intend to own a phone without a headphone jack. If enough people agreed with me their plan would backfire, but I suspect that's not the case.
- michrassena 9y agoI'm surprised I've not seen the phrase "close the analog hole", which was a popular one in the early days of MP3s, used to describe the end-goal of this design. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analog_hole https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analog_hole
- shmerl 9y agoI hope it will cost them some market share. People should not tolerate this nonsense.