4 ms·

> If you absolutely can't stand systemd or SMF, there is BSD, which doesn't use them. You should probably talk to someone who knows systemd very well first, bec

> If you absolutely can't stand systemd or SMF, there is BSD, which doesn't use them. You should probably talk to someone who knows systemd very well first, because they can explain in detail why you should like it. I can't imagine trying to sell anything with the phrase "why you should like it". SMF certainly doesn't need that kind of condescending pitch--it just fucking works and doesn't get in your way.

scott_karana 9y ago
It helps that SMF doesn't include reimplementations of DNS resolvers and NTP clients, both of which have caused security flaws in systemd. :/
- bonzini 9y ago
  You certainly can only use systemd's pid1 together with ntpd (systemd only does SNTP, not full-blown NTP) and no caching resolver. In fact it's the default in most Linux distributions. The only mandatory pieces if you use systemd as pid1 are udevd and journald. Misinformation like this is exactly why Brendan said you should ask an actual user of systemd.
  - scott_karana 9y ago
    I actually like systemd as an init system, and use it that way on all my current machines. (I'm a fan of journald so far too.) However, the mere fact that (s)NTP and DNS are re-implemented in the same codebase is still unsettling to me. Nor is it misinformation to mention their existence, or the bugs/limitations caused by the duplication of effort. http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/2017/CVE-2017-9445.html http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/2017/CVE-20... https://github.com/coreos/bugs/issues/391 https://github.com/coreos/bugs/issues/391 (Looks like the sNTP client hasn't caused security flaws, though. I was wrong there.)
    - bonzini 9y ago
      They are independent, you can use one without the other. They are just residing in the same repository and build system.
  - ConfucianNardin 9y ago
    At least Ubuntu ships with both resolved and timesyncd enabled by default.
brendangregg 9y ago
It'd be a waste of my time, but I could document the times I've seen Solaris SMF break a system so bad it was almost undebuggable, even with the help of many Sun staff. If you never had crippling registry issues, you were lucky. Other than those unlucky moments, it worked great!

scott_karana 9y ago

It helps that SMF doesn't include reimplementations of DNS resolvers and NTP clients, both of which have caused security flaws in systemd. :/

bonzini 9y ago
You certainly can only use systemd's pid1 together with ntpd (systemd only does SNTP, not full-blown NTP) and no caching resolver. In fact it's the default in most Linux distributions. The only mandatory pieces if you use systemd as pid1 are udevd and journald. Misinformation like this is exactly why Brendan said you should ask an actual user of systemd.
- scott_karana 9y ago
  I actually like systemd as an init system, and use it that way on all my current machines. (I'm a fan of journald so far too.) However, the mere fact that (s)NTP and DNS are re-implemented in the same codebase is still unsettling to me. Nor is it misinformation to mention their existence, or the bugs/limitations caused by the duplication of effort. http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/2017/CVE-2017-9445.html http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/2017/CVE-20... https://github.com/coreos/bugs/issues/391 https://github.com/coreos/bugs/issues/391 (Looks like the sNTP client hasn't caused security flaws, though. I was wrong there.)
  - bonzini 9y ago
    They are independent, you can use one without the other. They are just residing in the same repository and build system.
- ConfucianNardin 9y ago
  At least Ubuntu ships with both resolved and timesyncd enabled by default.

brendangregg 9y ago

It'd be a waste of my time, but I could document the times I've seen Solaris SMF break a system so bad it was almost undebuggable, even with the help of many Sun staff. If you never had crippling registry issues, you were lucky. Other than those unlucky moments, it worked great!