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If your politics, or the beliefs of those who share your politics, make your coworkers feel hurt, scared, and angry, then I see absolutely no reason to bring th

If your politics, or the beliefs of those who share your politics, make your coworkers feel hurt, scared, and angry, then I see absolutely no reason to bring them to your workplace. It's basic human interaction 101. And sorry, but insisting that people grow a thicker skin won't work, because that's not how people operate. I discuss controversial topics in person with my close friends, and I don't feel any poorer for it.

Banthum 9y ago
Let's imagine we work together. I say your politics, whatever they are, make me feel hurt, scared, and angry. Obviously you can't argue with this; my feelings are my feelings and are thus inarguable. Therefore, by your basic rule, you are no longer allowed to even state any of your political beliefs, because such would make me feel hurt, scared, and angry. And it doesn't matter what your beliefs are or how you arrived at them or what reasoning is behind them. Because according to you, maintaining my feelings, no matter how fragile or hypersensitive or unreasonable they may be, is an absolute imperative and all other values must be sacrificed to achieve that goal. Now I've got total control over the speech of anyone around me. I can shut down anyone, making any statement on any topic. I need only declare that I feel hurt, scared, or angered by that statement - and such inarguable declarations have absolute unappealable power to silence. See the problem here? It's obvious you can't run a society this way. It just becomes a race to the bottom of people being more and more hypersensitive to gain power. At a certain point, people do need to be told to grow a thicker skin.
- archagon 9y ago
  > Now I've got total control over the speech of anyone around me. I can shut down anyone, making any statement on any topic. Not really. This only works if your opinions are part of the current zeitgeist. If not, then nobody will really care what some loner is hurt by, and will probably just avoid talking to you, period. > At a certain point, people do need to be told to grow a thicker skin. OK, but that doesn't work. It only makes people angrier and even more determined to exclude you.
- thedz 9y ago
  > Now I've got total control over the speech of anyone around me. I can shut down anyone, making any statement on any topic. I need only declare that I feel hurt, scared, or angered by that statement - and such inarguable declarations have absolute unappealable power to silence. If someone, in your place of business, says "what you just said was hurtful and offensive", then yes, I think maybe you shouldn't say it. Or at least take pause and consider why what you said may be hurtful. None of that prevents your ability to say what you want outside the office.
  - peoplewindow 9y ago
    You can stop and consider it, and then say "actually, you shouldn't be offended by that. It is immature to be offended by that. Please grow up" That will offend them even more of course, which is why companies that don't have tough management will all be wrecked by this social strategy in the coming years. Google is already clearly far gone. At some point employees that constantly claim to be offended need to be told they'll be fired if they don't toughen up.
LyndsySimon 9y ago
> If your politics, or the beliefs of those who share your politics, make your coworkers feel hurt, scared, and angry, then I see absolutely no reason to bring them to the workplace. On one hand, I would argue that getting angry because someone doesn't share your views is unprofessional. On the other, I would like to point out that the point of this article is that this is a one-way street: If Progressives experience any of these emotions in reaction to your political views, those views are unwelcome. If conservatives/libertarians/etc. experience those emotions in reaction to your views, then that's just too bad for them.
- archagon 9y ago
  Well — yeah, that's how it works when most people around you share certain opinions. You can't change human nature all by your lonesome. You certainly wouldn't find me chatting about the Clintons, universal healthcare, etc. in a conservative office. (Or any office, for that matter.)
  - peoplewindow 9y ago
    It's not even clear that "most" people in tech firms are liberal. Rather, liberals feel it's OK to talk about their personal political views in public all the time and to throw massive tantrums / try and get opposing voices fired. Even if just 10% of a company was like that, unless management intervened to stop it, that'd be enough to ensure they were the only voices that got heard regardless of the true balances.
ubertaco 9y ago
This is a two-way street. As a Christian, I get upset when I hear my employer promote Bhuddist values (inviting Bhuddist monks on-site to otherwise-nonreligious corporate events) while also parading their role in defeating legislation to protect religious clergy who hold traditionally-Christian beliefs from being sued over their beliefs. This communicates to me both "you're the enemy, and we are working hard to make you vulnerable" and "these others who are directly opposite you are our favorites." The CEO has brought his religion to the workplace to the detriment of many of his employees, and as a result I am both hurt (by being "enemied") and scared (for the long-term existence of 1st-Amendment protection for my religious practice, given the company's legal activism). Is it still true in this case that "insisting that people grow a thicker skin won't work"?
- archagon 9y ago
  I actually think that's a perfectly reasonable thing to be uncomfortable with, and probably warrants a chat with a higher-up or an anonymous complaint.
  - jimbokun 9y ago
    Probably just as likely to get ubertaco fired as to make any change.
    - ubertaco 9y ago
      Indeed; several months ago I used an anonymous-at-the-time internal feedback mechanism to submit a note about how the CEO's top-down religious decisions affect me. Since then, the only thing that's happened is that the internal feedback mechanism was made no-longer-anonymous. I'm one worker bee among thousands, sitting on the opposite coast in a different office from the CEO, with (last I counted) 8 layers of management between me and the CEO. If any change is going to happen, it's much more likely that the change will be delivered to my employment status, so I keep my head down and learn to tactfully avoid subjects that could get me in hot water for simply being different from the folks in power. A kind of "script switching", if you will.
- 9y ago

Banthum 9y ago

Let's imagine we work together. I say your politics, whatever they are, make me feel hurt, scared, and angry. Obviously you can't argue with this; my feelings are my feelings and are thus inarguable. Therefore, by your basic rule, you are no longer allowed to even state any of your political beliefs, because such would make me feel hurt, scared, and angry. And it doesn't matter what your beliefs are or how you arrived at them or what reasoning is behind them. Because according to you, maintaining my feelings, no matter how fragile or hypersensitive or unreasonable they may be, is an absolute imperative and all other values must be sacrificed to achieve that goal. Now I've got total control over the speech of anyone around me. I can shut down anyone, making any statement on any topic. I need only declare that I feel hurt, scared, or angered by that statement - and such inarguable declarations have absolute unappealable power to silence. See the problem here? It's obvious you can't run a society this way. It just becomes a race to the bottom of people being more and more hypersensitive to gain power. At a certain point, people do need to be told to grow a thicker skin.

archagon 9y ago
> Now I've got total control over the speech of anyone around me. I can shut down anyone, making any statement on any topic. Not really. This only works if your opinions are part of the current zeitgeist. If not, then nobody will really care what some loner is hurt by, and will probably just avoid talking to you, period. > At a certain point, people do need to be told to grow a thicker skin. OK, but that doesn't work. It only makes people angrier and even more determined to exclude you.
thedz 9y ago
> Now I've got total control over the speech of anyone around me. I can shut down anyone, making any statement on any topic. I need only declare that I feel hurt, scared, or angered by that statement - and such inarguable declarations have absolute unappealable power to silence. If someone, in your place of business, says "what you just said was hurtful and offensive", then yes, I think maybe you shouldn't say it. Or at least take pause and consider why what you said may be hurtful. None of that prevents your ability to say what you want outside the office.
- peoplewindow 9y ago
  You can stop and consider it, and then say "actually, you shouldn't be offended by that. It is immature to be offended by that. Please grow up" That will offend them even more of course, which is why companies that don't have tough management will all be wrecked by this social strategy in the coming years. Google is already clearly far gone. At some point employees that constantly claim to be offended need to be told they'll be fired if they don't toughen up.

LyndsySimon 9y ago

> If your politics, or the beliefs of those who share your politics, make your coworkers feel hurt, scared, and angry, then I see absolutely no reason to bring them to the workplace. On one hand, I would argue that getting angry because someone doesn't share your views is unprofessional. On the other, I would like to point out that the point of this article is that this is a one-way street: If Progressives experience any of these emotions in reaction to your political views, those views are unwelcome. If conservatives/libertarians/etc. experience those emotions in reaction to your views, then that's just too bad for them.

archagon 9y ago
Well — yeah, that's how it works when most people around you share certain opinions. You can't change human nature all by your lonesome. You certainly wouldn't find me chatting about the Clintons, universal healthcare, etc. in a conservative office. (Or any office, for that matter.)
- peoplewindow 9y ago
  It's not even clear that "most" people in tech firms are liberal. Rather, liberals feel it's OK to talk about their personal political views in public all the time and to throw massive tantrums / try and get opposing voices fired. Even if just 10% of a company was like that, unless management intervened to stop it, that'd be enough to ensure they were the only voices that got heard regardless of the true balances.

ubertaco 9y ago

This is a two-way street. As a Christian, I get upset when I hear my employer promote Bhuddist values (inviting Bhuddist monks on-site to otherwise-nonreligious corporate events) while also parading their role in defeating legislation to protect religious clergy who hold traditionally-Christian beliefs from being sued over their beliefs. This communicates to me both "you're the enemy, and we are working hard to make you vulnerable" and "these others who are directly opposite you are our favorites." The CEO has brought his religion to the workplace to the detriment of many of his employees, and as a result I am both hurt (by being "enemied") and scared (for the long-term existence of 1st-Amendment protection for my religious practice, given the company's legal activism). Is it still true in this case that "insisting that people grow a thicker skin won't work"?

archagon 9y ago
I actually think that's a perfectly reasonable thing to be uncomfortable with, and probably warrants a chat with a higher-up or an anonymous complaint.
- jimbokun 9y ago
  Probably just as likely to get ubertaco fired as to make any change.
  - ubertaco 9y ago
    Indeed; several months ago I used an anonymous-at-the-time internal feedback mechanism to submit a note about how the CEO's top-down religious decisions affect me. Since then, the only thing that's happened is that the internal feedback mechanism was made no-longer-anonymous. I'm one worker bee among thousands, sitting on the opposite coast in a different office from the CEO, with (last I counted) 8 layers of management between me and the CEO. If any change is going to happen, it's much more likely that the change will be delivered to my employment status, so I keep my head down and learn to tactfully avoid subjects that could get me in hot water for simply being different from the folks in power. A kind of "script switching", if you will.
9y ago