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Which is cool in itself. What is deeply regrettable is the fact that they ended up selling to Facebook and thereby contributing to Facebook's aggressive and re

Which is cool in itself. What is deeply regrettable is the fact that they ended up selling to Facebook and thereby contributing to Facebook's aggressive and relentless mass surveillance system.

inciampati 9y ago
I wonder if they also cut themselves a raw deal in selling. They could have built a whole platform on top of WhatsApp without any innovation more subtle than copying WeChat.
- charlesdm 9y ago
  Nobody is going to complain about selling for $19bn. Sometimes you just need to take the money.
  - njarboe 9y ago
    And sometimes you don't. Zuckerburg famously had the chance to sell out for billions quite a few times [1], and basically said, "I'm doing what I want to be doing. If I sold out I would just start another social network company and I already own the best/biggest one." [1] http://www.businessinsider.com/all-the-companies-that-ever-tried-to-buy-facebook-2010-5/#in-june-2004-an-unnamed-financier-offered-10-million-1 http://www.businessinsider.com/all-the-companies-that-ever-t... edit: Closer and better quote. Thiel's paraphrase of Zuckerburg, "I don't know what I could do with the money. I'd just start another social networking site. I kind of like the one I already have." [2] https://www.inc.com/allison-fass/peter-thiel-mark-zuckerberg-luck-day-facebook-turned-down-billion-dollars.html https://www.inc.com/allison-fass/peter-thiel-mark-zuckerberg...
    - eecks 9y ago
      Did anyone offer him 19 billion?
      - Mahn 9y ago
        Are you suggesting they never had a chance to sell for 19 billion? Because I'm pretty sure all Zuckerberg had to do was pick up the phone in 2009, or even earlier.
        1123581321 9y ago
        It's plausible. They crossed $20BB valuation roughly at the end of 2009. At that time they had 400MM users. This is about the same growth rate as WhatsApp since founding. However, Facebook had 400MM largely North American and European users and had $1-1.5BB revenue with obvious potential for much more. WhatsApp's revenue was a couple orders of magnitude less after five years, with lower potential on its own to grow since it lacked Facebook's ability to collect and exploit data. So, it seems like WhatsApp should be valued less than Facebook, i.e. less than $20BB, at the same stage in its life. That doesn't mean Facebook overpaid; WhatsApp's users were nearly a perfect complement to Facebook's geographically and Facebook, unlike a company like Google, had the organizational ability to allow WhatsApp to grow while benefitting from Facebook resources. https://dealbook.nytimes.com/2012/02/01/tracking-facebooks-valuation/ https://dealbook.nytimes.com/2012/02/01/tracking-facebooks-v...
- sumedh 9y ago
  > They could have built a whole platform on top of WhatsApp What if it failed? A bird in the hand is worth more than 2 in the bush.
  - Markoff 9y ago
    then just platform would be ignored, but it would have no impact on messaging

Which is cool in itself. What is deeply regrettable is the fact that they ended up selling to Facebook and thereby contributing to Facebook's aggressive and relentless mass surveillance system.

inciampati 9y ago

I wonder if they also cut themselves a raw deal in selling. They could have built a whole platform on top of WhatsApp without any innovation more subtle than copying WeChat.

charlesdm 9y ago
Nobody is going to complain about selling for $19bn. Sometimes you just need to take the money.
- njarboe 9y ago
  And sometimes you don't. Zuckerburg famously had the chance to sell out for billions quite a few times [1], and basically said, "I'm doing what I want to be doing. If I sold out I would just start another social network company and I already own the best/biggest one." [1] http://www.businessinsider.com/all-the-companies-that-ever-tried-to-buy-facebook-2010-5/#in-june-2004-an-unnamed-financier-offered-10-million-1 http://www.businessinsider.com/all-the-companies-that-ever-t... edit: Closer and better quote. Thiel's paraphrase of Zuckerburg, "I don't know what I could do with the money. I'd just start another social networking site. I kind of like the one I already have." [2] https://www.inc.com/allison-fass/peter-thiel-mark-zuckerberg-luck-day-facebook-turned-down-billion-dollars.html https://www.inc.com/allison-fass/peter-thiel-mark-zuckerberg...
  - eecks 9y ago
    Did anyone offer him 19 billion?
    - Mahn 9y ago
      Are you suggesting they never had a chance to sell for 19 billion? Because I'm pretty sure all Zuckerberg had to do was pick up the phone in 2009, or even earlier.
      - 1123581321 9y ago
        It's plausible. They crossed $20BB valuation roughly at the end of 2009. At that time they had 400MM users. This is about the same growth rate as WhatsApp since founding. However, Facebook had 400MM largely North American and European users and had $1-1.5BB revenue with obvious potential for much more. WhatsApp's revenue was a couple orders of magnitude less after five years, with lower potential on its own to grow since it lacked Facebook's ability to collect and exploit data. So, it seems like WhatsApp should be valued less than Facebook, i.e. less than $20BB, at the same stage in its life. That doesn't mean Facebook overpaid; WhatsApp's users were nearly a perfect complement to Facebook's geographically and Facebook, unlike a company like Google, had the organizational ability to allow WhatsApp to grow while benefitting from Facebook resources. https://dealbook.nytimes.com/2012/02/01/tracking-facebooks-valuation/ https://dealbook.nytimes.com/2012/02/01/tracking-facebooks-v...
sumedh 9y ago
> They could have built a whole platform on top of WhatsApp What if it failed? A bird in the hand is worth more than 2 in the bush.
- Markoff 9y ago
  then just platform would be ignored, but it would have no impact on messaging