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This assume Google can't do anything about it. But it can. It can deny the use of it's services to people using ad-blockers. It's possible that we see a migra

This assume Google can't do anything about it. But it can. It can deny the use of it's services to people using ad-blockers. It's possible that we see a migration from youtube. Maybe some people will be ok with migrating from gmail (probably not the majority though. I did it and it was HARD). But very few people will stop using the search engine or google map, because it has absolutely zero decent competitor. I tried them all for months, fairly. Their are not even on the same planet. So apart from a few geeks, people will just disable the ad blocking software if google decide to force their hand. Besides, wait for the W3C DRM standard + webassembly to be used to hack very hard to block ads...

jstanley 9y ago
Google Maps is good and I haven't found a replacement, but DuckDuckGo is now so good you don't even realise you're using it.
- sametmax 9y ago
  Search a place in google: you get time table, phone numbers, a map to go and if it's opened right now. Search anything in another language than english, and it works. Search something in a very specific area of expertise that is not computing, and google will find it. Search for something with a very weird, contextual explanation with terrible typos, still works. Ddg, as much as I like it, is very far away from delivering this experience. I used ddg for a year, but realized I ended up typing !g for most of my queries. Besides, the HN crowd is very tech saavy, they can do without the Google magic. Most people don't even know what a URL is.
  - atupis 9y ago
    But google search has gotten lot worse to find reputable information. Eg try find that is sugar bad for you. I at least get tons of sensational click bait articles instead actual reputable information.
    - matt4077 9y ago
      I'm getting an infobox summarising https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/eating-too-much-added-sugar-increases-the-risk-of-dying-with-heart-disease-201402067021 https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/eating-too-much-added-su... when searching for [sugar health]. Then, the first result is the decidedly non-hypolically titled "Is Sugar Really Bad for You? It Depends" from The New York Times Meanwhile, Bing gives me "10 reasons why sugar is bad for you" and "Sweet Poison: Why Sugar is Ruining our Health". It's not even close.
      - pferde 9y ago
        And this here is exactly why I don't like Google Search. It will return 100 different results for 100 different people all searching for the same string.
        wentoodeep 9y ago
        Yup.. It giving me this infobox http://www.healthline.com/nutrition/10-disturbing-reasons-why-sugar-is-bad http://www.healthline.com/nutrition/10-disturbing-reasons-wh...
    - c3833174 9y ago
      The only thing that seems to have worsened is image search, when search by image was first added it was easy to get other copies of an image, now with AI magic it seems to find results in the same category better but not the exact image you're looking for.
  - fauigerzigerk 9y ago
    It's true that Google search has some fancy features that DDG doesn't have, but I have found that the core search results are very similar. DDG has become a solid search engine with some of its own more specialised fancy features. Sometimes DDG feels less convoluted. Not just because of Google's excessive ad overload, but also because Google guesses too much for my taste. They think they know me better than I do and that turns out to be incorrect often enough to be annoying. Where Google does have an unassailable lead is in maps. Their "explore" feature is extremely useful for finding places to eat & drink. Directions are great. Google maps is simply excellent.
- fooker 9y ago
  DuckDuckGo uses Google and Bing as backends though..
  - drtillberg 9y ago
    "In fact, DuckDuckGo gets its results from over four hundred sources. These include hundreds of vertical sources delivering niche Instant Answers, DuckDuckBot (our crawler) and crowd-sourced sites (like Wikipedia, stored in our answer indexes). We also of course have more traditional links in the search results, which we source from Bing, Yahoo, and Yandex."[1] [1] https://duck.co/help/results/sources https://duck.co/help/results/sources
- staticelf 9y ago
  The issue with DDG is that it isn't really friendly towards non-americans. This is not good.
sniglom 9y ago
I started using apple maps a few months ago. This far I haven't had a single reason to look back. Search engine wise they are clearly on top. On the other hand, do enough social engineering and people will start using a worse product regardless. Youtube could of course force ads on its users, but that would also make those users less interested in youtube compared to competing platforms. This is not overly simple.
- sametmax 9y ago
  As I said, youtube is possible. Apple map ? Outside of the US, not even close. Google search, just forget about it.
  - dchesterton 9y ago
    I've been using Apple Maps in the UK for the past year after buying a car with CarPlay. I also used it in hire cars in a couple of other European countries. It's pretty good. Traffic is accurate, although it is be a little slower to update than Google Maps (it seems to be ~5 mins behind). Directions are spot on and the UI (at least in CarPlay) is clear and detailed. The only thing that's poor compared to Google Maps is the search but it's certainly a decent alternative and it's come a long way since it was first released.
    - Angostura 9y ago
      The only thing I dislike about Apple Maps is its screwed up hierarchy of importance. Local trains stations, leisure centres, schools etc seem to be afforded the same level of importance as the local nail bar. It's horribly cluttered.
  - arethuza 9y ago
    "Outside of the US, not even close." I'm in the UK I use both Apple maps, Google maps, OpenStreetMap and Bing maps regularly (in addition to the built in nav system in my car) and for me the only noticeable strength that Google has is streetview. The "satellite" view in Google Maps where I live is actually so old (12+ years) that it's actually becoming useful for researching historical stuff...
phicoh 9y ago
One way to look at it: consumers don't spend any money on Google products. So they can continue to use youtube, gmail, search, maps, etc. Maybe just less if ads get too annoying. At the same time, Google's real customers (advertisers) are not tied to any of Google's products. They can place ads where it has most effect.
- perlpimp 9y ago
  most ads on youtube really annoying,sometime extra loud to get your attention. There are some creative ads i do enjoy watching. All this means that you can't pepper people wish shit visuals and expect respect. google text adverts - good thing, everything else tries to goad me into acting - feels cheap dirty. I gather they have to tone down their ads and respect their audience? After all and they vying for our attention
  - fauigerzigerk 9y ago
    >most ads on youtube really annoying,sometime extra loud to get your attention. True. The insane loudness of youtube ads got my girlfriend to install an ad-blocker for the very first time even though she is not opposed to relevant ads at all.
fghtr 9y ago
> google map, because it has absolutely zero decent competitor. I am using https://openstreetmap.org https://openstreetmap.org and have no problems with it.
- sametmax 9y ago
  Open street map don't tell you to go to the left ride of the lane so you can take a better right turn in 100m in real time, then inform you that you have to alternatives to your current trip given the current traffic spike if you wish.
  - phicoh 9y ago
    If there is a choice between having to watch annoying ads and not having those details, then I go for the more basic system that is ad free. (I do use openstreetmap for 99% for my navigation, mostly because I care about open navigation systems) No doubt, real time traffic information can be developed for openstreetmap. But if and when it happens depends on where others drop the ball. For example, current navigation systems built into cars tend to be completely out of date and mostly unsupported long before the car itself is end of life. So this is an area where openstreetmap might take over.
    - icebraining 9y ago
      OSM actually had ads way before Google Maps: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mappam http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mappam
      - rmc 9y ago
        I don't think you can compare the ad tracking that Google does now, and what the OSM website used to do years ago. That wiki page is almost 10 years old, with the website mentioned (mappam.com) no longer working. Though since OSM predates Google Maps, it makes sense that OSM would have another first :P
    - saiya-jin 9y ago
eleitl 9y ago
> It can deny the use of it's services to people using ad-blockers. This would be a good way to finish off Google search and Gmail, and Calendar, and Drive. > google map, because it has absolutely zero decent competitor Dedicated navigation device from Garmin in the car and Openstreetmap for everything else.
- sametmax 9y ago
  Most people will not pay hundreds of euros for a device that can get them the same service they have for free on their phone, ads or not. As Openstreetmap, the debate is already active in other comments.
naibafo 9y ago
> But very few people will stop using the search engine or google map, because it has absolutely zero decent competitor. I have been using DuckDuckGo as my search engine for a couple of years now, and I don't miss Google at all. bang! and instant answers are fantastic.
- sametmax 9y ago
  Yeah, but you are on HN. A very poor representative sample.
taylodl 9y ago
"It's possible that we see a migration from youtube." Funny you say that because I don't use any of Google's services save for YouTube. I'm a musician and that's simply where the musicians are. Other than that I don't use any other Google products or services - no search, no maps, no docs - nothing. Only YouTube.
- fghtr 9y ago
  Check out https://www.bitchute.com/ https://www.bitchute.com/, peer to peer content sharing platform.
- sametmax 9y ago
  I suppose you don't use Chrome, or Android either, nor the iphone search button ? Because that would make it a seriously small minority.
kamaal 9y ago
>>It can deny the use of it's services to people using ad-blockers. Many news websites in India did this recently. Of which many have rolled back. Why? There is always a competitor to which your customers can go. And when they do, you lose users to them, may be even permanently. Sooner or later you realize its better they come to you, instead of going to competition. Isn't this the whole point behind Android? You want your OS to run on most of the worlds mobile devices, even if you give it away for free, you still get traffic in return.
- sametmax 9y ago
  I don't buy it. iTune or netflow are very popular despite pirating even while being bloated, buggy expensive services. Pirating is free, instant, with no DRM and no waiting time. But when a service offer a tremendous value, it can't be quited easily.
madmax96 9y ago
>But very few people will stop using the search engine or google map Bing now controls 33% of the search engine space, and Google's share of the market is in decline. Google has a monetization issue, not a product issue. People love their products, but they hate their ads.

jstanley 9y ago

Google Maps is good and I haven't found a replacement, but DuckDuckGo is now so good you don't even realise you're using it.

sametmax 9y ago
Search a place in google: you get time table, phone numbers, a map to go and if it's opened right now. Search anything in another language than english, and it works. Search something in a very specific area of expertise that is not computing, and google will find it. Search for something with a very weird, contextual explanation with terrible typos, still works. Ddg, as much as I like it, is very far away from delivering this experience. I used ddg for a year, but realized I ended up typing !g for most of my queries. Besides, the HN crowd is very tech saavy, they can do without the Google magic. Most people don't even know what a URL is.
- atupis 9y ago
  But google search has gotten lot worse to find reputable information. Eg try find that is sugar bad for you. I at least get tons of sensational click bait articles instead actual reputable information.
  - matt4077 9y ago
    I'm getting an infobox summarising https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/eating-too-much-added-sugar-increases-the-risk-of-dying-with-heart-disease-201402067021 https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/eating-too-much-added-su... when searching for [sugar health]. Then, the first result is the decidedly non-hypolically titled "Is Sugar Really Bad for You? It Depends" from The New York Times Meanwhile, Bing gives me "10 reasons why sugar is bad for you" and "Sweet Poison: Why Sugar is Ruining our Health". It's not even close.
    - pferde 9y ago
      And this here is exactly why I don't like Google Search. It will return 100 different results for 100 different people all searching for the same string.
      - wentoodeep 9y ago
        Yup.. It giving me this infobox http://www.healthline.com/nutrition/10-disturbing-reasons-why-sugar-is-bad http://www.healthline.com/nutrition/10-disturbing-reasons-wh...
  - c3833174 9y ago
    The only thing that seems to have worsened is image search, when search by image was first added it was easy to get other copies of an image, now with AI magic it seems to find results in the same category better but not the exact image you're looking for.
- fauigerzigerk 9y ago
  It's true that Google search has some fancy features that DDG doesn't have, but I have found that the core search results are very similar. DDG has become a solid search engine with some of its own more specialised fancy features. Sometimes DDG feels less convoluted. Not just because of Google's excessive ad overload, but also because Google guesses too much for my taste. They think they know me better than I do and that turns out to be incorrect often enough to be annoying. Where Google does have an unassailable lead is in maps. Their "explore" feature is extremely useful for finding places to eat & drink. Directions are great. Google maps is simply excellent.
fooker 9y ago
DuckDuckGo uses Google and Bing as backends though..
- drtillberg 9y ago
  "In fact, DuckDuckGo gets its results from over four hundred sources. These include hundreds of vertical sources delivering niche Instant Answers, DuckDuckBot (our crawler) and crowd-sourced sites (like Wikipedia, stored in our answer indexes). We also of course have more traditional links in the search results, which we source from Bing, Yahoo, and Yandex."[1] [1] https://duck.co/help/results/sources https://duck.co/help/results/sources
staticelf 9y ago
The issue with DDG is that it isn't really friendly towards non-americans. This is not good.

sniglom 9y ago

I started using apple maps a few months ago. This far I haven't had a single reason to look back. Search engine wise they are clearly on top. On the other hand, do enough social engineering and people will start using a worse product regardless. Youtube could of course force ads on its users, but that would also make those users less interested in youtube compared to competing platforms. This is not overly simple.

sametmax 9y ago
As I said, youtube is possible. Apple map ? Outside of the US, not even close. Google search, just forget about it.
- dchesterton 9y ago
  I've been using Apple Maps in the UK for the past year after buying a car with CarPlay. I also used it in hire cars in a couple of other European countries. It's pretty good. Traffic is accurate, although it is be a little slower to update than Google Maps (it seems to be ~5 mins behind). Directions are spot on and the UI (at least in CarPlay) is clear and detailed. The only thing that's poor compared to Google Maps is the search but it's certainly a decent alternative and it's come a long way since it was first released.
  - Angostura 9y ago
    The only thing I dislike about Apple Maps is its screwed up hierarchy of importance. Local trains stations, leisure centres, schools etc seem to be afforded the same level of importance as the local nail bar. It's horribly cluttered.
- arethuza 9y ago
  "Outside of the US, not even close." I'm in the UK I use both Apple maps, Google maps, OpenStreetMap and Bing maps regularly (in addition to the built in nav system in my car) and for me the only noticeable strength that Google has is streetview. The "satellite" view in Google Maps where I live is actually so old (12+ years) that it's actually becoming useful for researching historical stuff...

phicoh 9y ago

One way to look at it: consumers don't spend any money on Google products. So they can continue to use youtube, gmail, search, maps, etc. Maybe just less if ads get too annoying. At the same time, Google's real customers (advertisers) are not tied to any of Google's products. They can place ads where it has most effect.

perlpimp 9y ago
most ads on youtube really annoying,sometime extra loud to get your attention. There are some creative ads i do enjoy watching. All this means that you can't pepper people wish shit visuals and expect respect. google text adverts - good thing, everything else tries to goad me into acting - feels cheap dirty. I gather they have to tone down their ads and respect their audience? After all and they vying for our attention
- fauigerzigerk 9y ago
  >most ads on youtube really annoying,sometime extra loud to get your attention. True. The insane loudness of youtube ads got my girlfriend to install an ad-blocker for the very first time even though she is not opposed to relevant ads at all.

fghtr 9y ago

> google map, because it has absolutely zero decent competitor. I am using https://openstreetmap.org https://openstreetmap.org and have no problems with it.

sametmax 9y ago
Open street map don't tell you to go to the left ride of the lane so you can take a better right turn in 100m in real time, then inform you that you have to alternatives to your current trip given the current traffic spike if you wish.
- phicoh 9y ago
  If there is a choice between having to watch annoying ads and not having those details, then I go for the more basic system that is ad free. (I do use openstreetmap for 99% for my navigation, mostly because I care about open navigation systems) No doubt, real time traffic information can be developed for openstreetmap. But if and when it happens depends on where others drop the ball. For example, current navigation systems built into cars tend to be completely out of date and mostly unsupported long before the car itself is end of life. So this is an area where openstreetmap might take over.
  - icebraining 9y ago
    OSM actually had ads way before Google Maps: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mappam http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mappam
    - rmc 9y ago
      I don't think you can compare the ad tracking that Google does now, and what the OSM website used to do years ago. That wiki page is almost 10 years old, with the website mentioned (mappam.com) no longer working. Though since OSM predates Google Maps, it makes sense that OSM would have another first :P
  - saiya-jin 9y ago

eleitl 9y ago

> It can deny the use of it's services to people using ad-blockers. This would be a good way to finish off Google search and Gmail, and Calendar, and Drive. > google map, because it has absolutely zero decent competitor Dedicated navigation device from Garmin in the car and Openstreetmap for everything else.

sametmax 9y ago
Most people will not pay hundreds of euros for a device that can get them the same service they have for free on their phone, ads or not. As Openstreetmap, the debate is already active in other comments.

naibafo 9y ago

> But very few people will stop using the search engine or google map, because it has absolutely zero decent competitor. I have been using DuckDuckGo as my search engine for a couple of years now, and I don't miss Google at all. bang! and instant answers are fantastic.

sametmax 9y ago
Yeah, but you are on HN. A very poor representative sample.

taylodl 9y ago

"It's possible that we see a migration from youtube." Funny you say that because I don't use any of Google's services save for YouTube. I'm a musician and that's simply where the musicians are. Other than that I don't use any other Google products or services - no search, no maps, no docs - nothing. Only YouTube.

fghtr 9y ago
Check out https://www.bitchute.com/ https://www.bitchute.com/, peer to peer content sharing platform.
sametmax 9y ago
I suppose you don't use Chrome, or Android either, nor the iphone search button ? Because that would make it a seriously small minority.

kamaal 9y ago

>>It can deny the use of it's services to people using ad-blockers. Many news websites in India did this recently. Of which many have rolled back. Why? There is always a competitor to which your customers can go. And when they do, you lose users to them, may be even permanently. Sooner or later you realize its better they come to you, instead of going to competition. Isn't this the whole point behind Android? You want your OS to run on most of the worlds mobile devices, even if you give it away for free, you still get traffic in return.

sametmax 9y ago
I don't buy it. iTune or netflow are very popular despite pirating even while being bloated, buggy expensive services. Pirating is free, instant, with no DRM and no waiting time. But when a service offer a tremendous value, it can't be quited easily.

madmax96 9y ago

>But very few people will stop using the search engine or google map Bing now controls 33% of the search engine space, and Google's share of the market is in decline. Google has a monetization issue, not a product issue. People love their products, but they hate their ads.