4 ms·

I agree with you. The question then becomes: if you achieved this level of performance, isn't it better to work for yourself rather than work for somebody who a

by GoToRO 9y ago

I agree with you. The question then becomes: if you achieved this level of performance, isn't it better to work for yourself rather than work for somebody who all the time undervalues your performance? Isn't it better in the long run to build a product that might need minimum level of attention once it's done?

pm215 9y ago
That would depend on whether the work you find happy, low stress and fulfilling overlaps much with the work you'd need to be doing to work for yourself. Personally I enjoy the software engineering part of my job, and have no desire to take on the business, sales and marketing work that I think would form a large part of working for myself.
sametmax 9y ago
It is. But after preaching it for a decade, I realized that working for yourself implies to develop a certain skill set and embrace another set of constraints many people don't wish for them-self. There is a lot of comfort in being an employee.
- tonyedgecombe 9y ago
  This is true, you replace one set of problems with some completely different ones. However, it does give you the ability to set your own priorities rather than them being handed down from management.
stult 9y ago
That depends on your risk tolerance, though. Self-employment, especially the entrepreneurial kind, inherently has a higher risk of failure. Sure, you might win big and build a self-sustaining business that earns you a tidy living, but then again you might also go bankrupt and lose everything because you can't pay your bills.
- BjoernKW 9y ago
  Is self-employment really so much riskier than sequential employment? With the latter if you're laid off you instantly lose all your income. As a self-employed consultant / freelancer if you lose a customer who quite likely still have other customers, which mitigates the overall risk.
  - bigmanwalter 9y ago
    Yes it's riskier. If I'm laid off it only takes weeks to find a new position. If my business goes under, I'm likeley burnt out and have just lost not only my income but my life savings as well.
  - Retric 9y ago
    If you get laid off in most western countries you get ~10k over 6 months in unemployment benefits from the government + accrued vacation time and possibly more. Assuming you where ok financially before you started that's a long time to look for the next job especially if your cut down your lifestyle. PS: It's often the case where people get a little warning and end up finding a job before they get laid off. From the companies perspective the trade off is a little more chaos up front for significant savings on unemployment insurance.
    - 9to5isdead 9y ago
      Could you be specific? Are you talking about the US or another country?
      - phyller 9y ago
        It's true about the US, and if you go on unemployment the company that let you go can be on the hook to pay for about half of it. So you definitely want your ex employees to get another job fast.
        cr0sh 9y ago
        > It's true about the US ...except the 10k part. Every time I've went on unemployment, it was waaaay less than 10k - if I managed to get 1000 bucks a month it was a miracle. Last time I did it (years ago) I let the money sit in the bank at Chase because I had lost track of the debit card they (unemployment) sent me. Until at a certain point they had to close out the account. This was years later, and I had (mostly) forgotten all about it. I had to go down to the bank and prove who I was to withdraw it. So - why did I let it sit? Didn't I need it? Well - no, not really. I applied because I could; I was laid off my previous job, so I thought "hey, why not, I earned it, right?". So I applied. Kept my notes and log and such. But before I got the confirmation and debit card, I had a new job. Before that, I just used my savings (actually, I don't even think I had to dip into that - I had more than enough to cover things in my checking, after the severance pay). When I finally did withdraw the money, it was something like $400 or so for a couple of weeks. 10k over 6 months? Right...
koliber 9y ago
If I do X for someone I get paid Y. If I do X for myself, I get paid X*Z. However, I also have to do marketing, sales, and everything else a particular X requires to be a business. These are things that I prefer not doing. I'm on the fence if the Z multiplier is enough. Been there, done that. I don't knock it, but for the time being, I enjoy the stability of a long-term contract and not doing the peripheral work.
- dilemma 9y ago
  >If I do X for someone I get paid Y. If I do X for myself, I get paid X*Z. Note that Z can be less than 1.
caseysoftware 9y ago
I'd say it's not just about risk tolerance but also deciding what pieces to "outsource" in your daily job. When you're running your own firm (even one person), you are in charge of catching billable work, doing the billable work, billing the work, filing the taxes, etc, etc. If you add anyone else, the non-billable efforts get even bigger. I ran my own firm for ~7 years and had a team of 8 at one point. Hunting the next project just got exhausting and I never got to build things. If you work for another firm - consultancy or product - the vast majority is handed off to other people who are probably better at (or at least focused on) many of those things. Yes, you make less money but you're "paying" to have all those things done for you.

by GoToRO 9y ago

pm215 9y ago

That would depend on whether the work you find happy, low stress and fulfilling overlaps much with the work you'd need to be doing to work for yourself. Personally I enjoy the software engineering part of my job, and have no desire to take on the business, sales and marketing work that I think would form a large part of working for myself.

sametmax 9y ago

It is. But after preaching it for a decade, I realized that working for yourself implies to develop a certain skill set and embrace another set of constraints many people don't wish for them-self. There is a lot of comfort in being an employee.

tonyedgecombe 9y ago
This is true, you replace one set of problems with some completely different ones. However, it does give you the ability to set your own priorities rather than them being handed down from management.

stult 9y ago

That depends on your risk tolerance, though. Self-employment, especially the entrepreneurial kind, inherently has a higher risk of failure. Sure, you might win big and build a self-sustaining business that earns you a tidy living, but then again you might also go bankrupt and lose everything because you can't pay your bills.

BjoernKW 9y ago
Is self-employment really so much riskier than sequential employment? With the latter if you're laid off you instantly lose all your income. As a self-employed consultant / freelancer if you lose a customer who quite likely still have other customers, which mitigates the overall risk.
- bigmanwalter 9y ago
  Yes it's riskier. If I'm laid off it only takes weeks to find a new position. If my business goes under, I'm likeley burnt out and have just lost not only my income but my life savings as well.
- Retric 9y ago
  If you get laid off in most western countries you get ~10k over 6 months in unemployment benefits from the government + accrued vacation time and possibly more. Assuming you where ok financially before you started that's a long time to look for the next job especially if your cut down your lifestyle. PS: It's often the case where people get a little warning and end up finding a job before they get laid off. From the companies perspective the trade off is a little more chaos up front for significant savings on unemployment insurance.
  - 9to5isdead 9y ago
    Could you be specific? Are you talking about the US or another country?
    - phyller 9y ago
      It's true about the US, and if you go on unemployment the company that let you go can be on the hook to pay for about half of it. So you definitely want your ex employees to get another job fast.
      - cr0sh 9y ago
        > It's true about the US ...except the 10k part. Every time I've went on unemployment, it was waaaay less than 10k - if I managed to get 1000 bucks a month it was a miracle. Last time I did it (years ago) I let the money sit in the bank at Chase because I had lost track of the debit card they (unemployment) sent me. Until at a certain point they had to close out the account. This was years later, and I had (mostly) forgotten all about it. I had to go down to the bank and prove who I was to withdraw it. So - why did I let it sit? Didn't I need it? Well - no, not really. I applied because I could; I was laid off my previous job, so I thought "hey, why not, I earned it, right?". So I applied. Kept my notes and log and such. But before I got the confirmation and debit card, I had a new job. Before that, I just used my savings (actually, I don't even think I had to dip into that - I had more than enough to cover things in my checking, after the severance pay). When I finally did withdraw the money, it was something like $400 or so for a couple of weeks. 10k over 6 months? Right...

koliber 9y ago

If I do X for someone I get paid Y. If I do X for myself, I get paid X*Z. However, I also have to do marketing, sales, and everything else a particular X requires to be a business. These are things that I prefer not doing. I'm on the fence if the Z multiplier is enough. Been there, done that. I don't knock it, but for the time being, I enjoy the stability of a long-term contract and not doing the peripheral work.

dilemma 9y ago
>If I do X for someone I get paid Y. If I do X for myself, I get paid X*Z. Note that Z can be less than 1.

caseysoftware 9y ago

I'd say it's not just about risk tolerance but also deciding what pieces to "outsource" in your daily job. When you're running your own firm (even one person), you are in charge of catching billable work, doing the billable work, billing the work, filing the taxes, etc, etc. If you add anyone else, the non-billable efforts get even bigger. I ran my own firm for ~7 years and had a team of 8 at one point. Hunting the next project just got exhausting and I never got to build things. If you work for another firm - consultancy or product - the vast majority is handed off to other people who are probably better at (or at least focused on) many of those things. Yes, you make less money but you're "paying" to have all those things done for you.