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Four-year professional visas get green light in Thailand
- sremani 9y agoI am mystified probably coming from South Asia, what makes Thailand so attractive? when you can do similar cost arbitrage with many places in Carib and Latin America, while being in the same time zones and probably better way to get in touch with US based clients.
- nandreev 9y agoFood, safety, proximity to other Asian destinations, low cost, fast Internet, everything close by (e.g. one can take a break from Bangkok with a quick flight to the south)... it goes on.
- zdkl 9y agoEverything you listed bar the connection to asian countries you can find in latin america
- nso 9y agoSure, but it has a completely different culture in pretty much all ways you can think of, and for some the asian way resonates more.
- taurath 9y agoWe get deluged in the west about crime in Latin America all day every day. It seems like a much less safe place than in Thailand.
- teej 9y agoIt's not media exposure. Thailand has a similar crime rate to the US. Latin America on average is much much worse. https://www.numbeo.com/crime/rankings_by_country.jsp https://www.numbeo.com/crime/rankings_by_country.jsp
- tabacof 9y agoLatin America is very unsafe. The list of top 50 cities by murder rate is very telling: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_murder_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_murder_rate I have lived most of my life in Brazil, and even though I am very privileged, the following has happened to me: 1) Watch stolen by drug addict with a syringe when I was 12 years old 2) Cellphone stolen by a thug with a glass shard when I was 16 3) Also when I was 16, three thugs tried to steal my cellphone, they said they would blow my brains if I didn't comply and faked having a gun (I didn't). 4) Two thugs invaded my frat house, held us hostages with handguns, and stole all we had (I will never forget the cold metal of the gun touching my head, while I was threatened). 5) My car was jacked right in front of my house. 6) Another cellphone stealing incident that I'd rather not share in details. 7) My spare tire was stolen while I was in a bar for a couple of hours. This is just what has happened to me in less than 30 years. Stories like those abound. My girlfriend also went through (4) and (7), independently of me. Pretty much everyone I know has had a cellhphone stolen at some point in their lives. If you want to actually experience the dread that is living in Brazil, search for "brazil" in reddit's /r/watchpeopledie.
- ddebernardy 9y agoWhen you're living in Latin America as an expat, the odds are pretty strong that you're in or near a tourist resort with very little (observable) crime. I say observable because, yeah, of course a mafia is operating in the area, but it's not an all out war like in Tijuana or Juarez because it's not lucrative for the mafia to scare tourists off. Tourists go to the mafia's bars and restaurants at the end of the day, which is part of how they launder money.
- enraged_camel 9y agoIt's not like you're gonna spend your whole time in the resort. Otherwise why bother going to Latin America? We have resorts here in the US too. Indeed, most people who travel to Latin America want to travel and do sight-seeing. And that can be dangerous, especially for "gringos" (Anglo-Saxon whites) because they are perceived as wealth targets by kidnappers. You don't really have that problem in a place like Thailand.
- xiaoma 9y agoThe internet in Latin America sucks compared to east Asia. It's not even remotely close. I say this having used 130 gigs of high speed mobile data over the past month, tethering wherever I felt like it, and spending under $30 USD for the privilege.
- hackerboos 9y agoSouth East Asia != East Asia
- seanmcdirmid 9y agoHey, have you been to china? Internet isn't really great there especially if you venture outside of the Chinese net. Heck, some websites won't even work without a vpn....
- nnd 9y agoFlight connections in SA are significantly more expensive, there are virtually no low-costers.
- seanmcdirmid 9y ago5 hour flight from Beijing always made it convenient for a long weekend.
- nso 9y agoSense of security? Everyone knows of the potential security issues in latin america, but thailand "we" don't know a lot about. A sense of the exotic? For americans it is all the way over in asia. Being in the middle of the huge asian market? The girls? The food? The cost? I myself have relocated to latin america (oaxaca, mexico) and enjoy the lifestyle here, but being from Europe which is in the middle of the two I can easily see myself having ended up in thailand or that general neighbourhood had I not planted seeds here with a job and family =)
- coldtea 9y ago>Sense of security? Everyone knows of the potential security issues in latin america, but thailand "we" don't know a lot about. It's not just ignorance, since some of us do know a lot about, and still consider SEA safer.
- fulafel 9y agoMost people are not coming from the US.
- peteretep 9y agoIt's dramatically safer than most of South America and the Caribbean. Having lived for the better part of a decade in both Thailand and the Caribbean, the people in Thailand seem much friendlier.
- dmix 9y agoAnd most of their economies are on an upward trajectory in SE Asia. While the caribbean and many parts of latin America are mostly spinning their wheels in position.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- swampthinker 9y agoTo most white Americans that want to work in Thailand, Hispanic people are scarier than southeast asians.
- maehwasu 9y agoThey're mainly scarier because they, you know, kill more people. I say this as someone who strongly prefers Latin America and Hispanic culture to Thailand and Thai culture.
- notdang 9y agoApart from being a lot more dangerous, Latin America is more expensive than South Asia. Not sure about Caribbeans, have never been there.
- sutee 9y agoI think one potential of Latin America is the time zone lines up better with North America. This might not matter, depending on what kind of business you're doing.
- dreamfactored 9y agoThe huge majority of men go there for women, food, weather, in that order. (Not sure why this is getting downmodded - I know a lot of professional expats who live there and after a few drinks they all say those are the big draws.)
- nnd 9y agoYou have a better living cost arbitrage in SEA, specifically in Thailand. With an easy availability of everything you’d need as an expat (simple apartment and car/moto rentals), you get a much better bang for you buck. The barrier of entry is low and you can easily set up a routine in less of a day. SA requires you to learn Spanish and you’ll struggle a lot trying to figure out things in he beginning.
- SeoxyS 9y agoSome people prefer the culture, the food, the party scene, the girls. Also, it's pretty safe and comfortable for expats. Also, English is widely spoken in Southeast Asia
- homakov 9y agoSecurity. After 2 years in SEA and visiting Medellin or Mexico city all i want is run away to sabai sabai.
- orthoganol 9y agoWell for one, they are now letting you stay for 4 years without needing an actual job at a Thai based company :) I think it's just more exotic. Chile, Colombia, Argentina, Peru, they are pretty US-like in their own ways.
- Matachines 9y agoIt's cheap, safe, and tech nerds love Asian girls for some reason
- pentae 9y agoThis is also based on the assumption you are in a client/service business. However as someone with a startup in Thailand the timezone is always the first point of contention for most of us, So not disagreeing with you on that point. Not having a US number can also work against you when trying to set up meetings with partners, you get put at the bottom of the call sheet always.
- mdekkers 9y agoNot having a US number can also work against you That is solvable in literally 30 minutes, for $10
- curun1r 9y agoNo one has mentioned it, so I'll say that one of the things that I found most pleasant about Thailand was the religious aspect of it. I'm more of an atheist, but spending time in a primarily Buddhist country has a very different feel from a primarily Catholic or Muslim country. Also: - There are still cost differences between Latin America and Thailand. - The weather is awesome. Wearing shorts and short sleeves 24/7/365 is great. - I love Thai food and it's easier to eat vegetarian there than in Latin America. - There's no expectation that foreigners need to learn Thai. Beyond 'hello' and 'thank you' they basically expect to be speaking English (or Chinese). - I've always liked hanging out with Australians and New Zealanders and there's a lot of them in Thailand. - The internet is much better. Not only than Latin America, but also better than I get in the US. On the negative side, foreigners are looked at as sources of money and not everyone is good at pretending they're interested in something else. It's very easy to feel dehumanized and that you're only interesting to them because you have money. Also, while many people are listing girls as a positive, in Bangkok the assumptions they make about white men made it hard for me to be there. It gets depressing to be offered sex that often. Considering you get all benefits of Thailand in other locations as well, I strongly recommend potential expats consider Thai destinations other than Bangkok.
- i_am_viet 9y agoIf one spends time integrating into their society (for example, learn their language instead of just using English all the time), then one may be treated a little more positively. They don't expect you to speak Thai because they see you as someone who won't stick around and as a result, like you said, merely a money source.
- mattnumbe 9y agoI agree 100%. I am currently an expat with local language skills. When other expats complain about getting treated differently because they're foreigners, and then you find out they've been here 10 years and have no local language skills, it's easy to understand why.
- alexcnwy 9y agoIf your clients are in Europe then being 5 hours ahead is actually better than being in the same timezone (especially if you're nocturnal and only wake up at 11am ;)
- coop-throwaway 9y agoWhat makes Thailand so attractive? Do you really need to ask? Young white males can easily fuck attractive girls there. That's it.
- sctb 9y agoPlease comment thoughtfully and substantively or not at all.
- dagw 9y agoThailand has a ton of western tourists making it very adapted to their 'needs' and greatly reduces the 'risk' of culture shock. So if you're the sort of person who wants to a warm cheap country, but still want to be able to go to a different pub every night where you can hang out with white native English speakers then Thailand is pretty good bet.
- codingmyway 9y agoFor someone working with UK/West European clients the time zone means you can enjoy the daytime and work in the evening which I prefer. The 9-5 is too engrained from last century workhouses to change but doesn't suit a balanced lifestyle
- justonepost 9y agoSadly, there are no details yet. What constitutes investor or highly skilled?
- charlesdm 9y agoWe're probably not talking crazy money to be qualified as an investor in a developing country. But there might be a requirement to invest a certain amount into the local economy.
- mikekchar 9y agoAs a point of reference, you can get a business visa in Japan by starting a company with about $50K in capital. The idea is that the company has enough money to pay your salary for a year or so (the $50K is a minimum and depends on whether or not they think the company can look after you as an employee). I have heard that similar kinds of visas can be obtained in some SE Asian countries, so I'm guessing that Thailand will introduce something similar -- so a few tens of thousands of dollars (I'm not entirely sure what the cost of living is like there, but it's probably lower than Japan).
- kawera 9y agoVery interesting. Where did you find the $50K figure for Japan?
- ranebo 9y agoIt's 5 million yen. I actually did this back in 2012. It's a complicated procedure but plenty of Japan based lawyers can help you out. I did it myself, without lawyer help but you will absolutely need someone fluent in Japanese. The paperwork is suffocating. In retrospect I should have just married my then girlfriend, now wife.
- kawera 9y agoThank you! I will investigate this possibility as a third of my clients are in Japan so... ( btw, my daughter loves EasyBeats! )
- shokasg 9y agoWould be great if you're eligible - no more visa runs or "self-defense" ED visas, but not that much info is provided at this moment. The visa should roll-out in January 2018 according to FB page...
- Canada 9y agoGreat move Thailand! I expect the kingdom will be loose with these as it has been in allowing this class of foreigner use tourist, ed and extensions when they know full well what's really going on. The previous system was essentially a checkpoint to allow for the removal of party goer types who have become more trouble than they're worth.
- EternalData 9y agoSoutheast Asia is a really interesting case study for me when it comes to political ideals vs. optimizing for life situations. There's a growing creep of authoritarianism in different nations -- given what we know of the military regime in Thailand and their propensity to arrest people for expression, it would be somewhat ironic to preach for the "open Internet" while living there. The tradeoff, of course, is much lower costs, higher security as others have pointed out. But I do wonder about the greater costs involved -- those perhaps not weighed on foreign workers, of accepting that this is the way things happen to be there.
- kawera 9y agoRelated: http://thediplomat.com/2017/08/beware-the-war-against-aseans-atheists/ http://thediplomat.com/2017/08/beware-the-war-against-aseans...
- drawnwren 9y agoThis is certainly a very real part of living in Thailand. There are certain subjects (i.e. the monarchy and Buddhism) that you can not be negative about. It's possible that you could be arrested if you are overheard speaking negatively about these things. Practically, this isn't an issue. You are as likely to talk about the Thai Monarchy and Buddhism as you are here in America. That said, it is certainly surreal when a conversation veers that direction and it the group collectively realizes they need to stop talking about that for fear of imprisonment.
- dmix 9y ago> There's a growing creep of authoritarianism in different nations This seems to be a phenomenon in the vast majority of modern states... the only solace is finding the one's where they are so dysfunctional that in practice they aren't as all consuming to as their mandate allows. Which seems to be more the case in China/SE Asia than most western states.
- nnd 9y agoAny idea how would they evaluate highly skilled professionals? Most importantly, a lot of people living in Thailand have an offshore source of income (a business or a freelancing contract), those people don’t need a regular work visa as they are don’t participate in the Thai Labor market. Is this law somehow applicable to those people?
- stephenr 9y ago> those people don’t need a regular work visa as they are don’t participate in the Thai Labor market Sorry that isn't how the law works. Unless those people travel out of the country to conduct their work, they're breaking Thai law - it doesn't matter where the company is, what matters is that they're doing work in Thailand.
- spraak 9y agoCan you please cite sources for that? I really don't think that's the case.
- stephenr 9y agoMy business lawyer in Thailand?
- avip 9y agoIt makes more sense that you'll cite something, as what he described is the de-facto standard of work permits pretty much anywhere. You'll be usually violating a law if you live and work somewhere without the legal framework - be it US, India or Japan. I don't see a reason Thailand would be any different.
- rtpg 9y agoNot sure for Thailand but I've heard the same for Japan. The counterfactual would be that if this were possible, every foreigner in Thailand would be made an employee of a company in Ireland or something to avoid dealing with visa issues (or tax issues )
- thinbeige 9y agoSlightly OT: Everytime there's a discussion about living in SE Asia or Thailand people give many good reasons to go. Very rarely to never one dares to mention girls there as a reason. In this thread there's one person only who does mention girls. Since I have never been to Thailand or SE Asia I am just wondering how much weight does this factor have in decisions to live in SE Asia (this is a serious question). Edit: Fyi, this post got so many downvotes and I just don't understand why. People try to hide the truth and want us to believe that everybody goes to Thailand because of all these amenities, good Internet but not the one reason I mentioned? If downvoters keep on this hypocrisis I will delete the post again. This is ridiculous. I would like to see one downvoter replying and explaining why he downvoted. Guys, keep on downvoting. I think the downvoters are exactly those who visit Thailand just because of this one reason.
- aianus 9y agoFwiw I lived in Vietnam for 6 months and had girls stop me in the streets to take a picture with me and give me their numbers.
- SXX 9y agoI think you should at least mention province you were visiting since people behavior is really different depend if how close the place to usual tourist routes. I spent just 3 months in Vietnam and didn't traveled that much, but there is huge difference in people reaction to foreigners. In the South as soon as I moved away to the places that tourists rarely visit I always get attention from all sort of people because you can literally be the only European guy who was around in past week. Also I was surprised how many kids of school age have a good English skills. In same time in SGN nobody ever spent time on me with no reason.
- robocat 9y agoMy very limited experience is that girls in Vietnam are mostly interested in a relationship. I remember talking to one 19 year old couple that seemed taken aback that I had had a few girlfriends and never been married...
- justonepost 9y agoThe biggest problem is the weather. It gets brutal hot march to June.
- stephenr 9y agoHigh 30s, not that different than Australian summer temperature wise, but more humidity. After a few years I've definitely acclimated to the weather. I feel it, and I still sweat a lot more than my in-laws but I don't get the same "what the shit is this" feeling because of the humidity and temp change eg when you go through the a/c blowers at the doors out into the world at Suvarnabhumi
- peller 9y agoCan you comment on the air quality? Is it as big an issue as some people make it out to be?
- WordSkill 9y agoChiang Mai is the nicest city but all of Northern Thailand is affected by terrible air pollution in March and April, you simply get out of town during those months. The confusion about whether or not it is "as big an issue as some people make it out to people" is because influential members in the various forums and Facebook groups have a vested interest in down-playing it, their business in some way benefits from having a steady stream of nomad newbies arriving throughout the year. They try to shout down any mention of it, and will outright lie when someone asks a question such as yours. Do real research on particulate pollution and look at the stats. The haze is genuinely bad for your health long before it becomes as visually obvious as it does in those months. A year in which the smoke season is considered to be "not so bad" can actually do more damage, because people are inclined to spend more time outdoors. My opinion is that, although Chiang Mai is relatively cheap, no-one should move here unless they can also afford to spend those two months elsewhere in Thailand or South East Asia. Most Westerners on tourist visas have to spend stretches of time away from Thailand anyway, so, I treat the smoke season as an opportunity to spend time in Vietnam or The Philippines.
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- thinbeige 9y agoI am not sure if this is ao good for your personality and character devlopment. Just compare two guys: One lives in a country where his personal purchasing power is much much higher than in his home country and his ethnicity signals a high status and value to locals as well (e.g. American in Thailand). The other guy lives in a super expensive hub with high competition and just finding a flat and paying the rent ia already a huge challenge (eg some guy in New York or SF). I could imagine that the first guy will degenerate over time (like animals in the zoo) while the other one has to fight night and day for everything and gets thougher.
- mars4rp 9y agohigh level of stress will kill you young, it doesn't matter how much you think your character developed when you are dead!
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- SXX 9y agoEven without factor of stress lifestyle of many people in IT is not too healthy to begin with. And it's certainly easier to remain healthy while live in SEA countries.
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- AOsborn 9y ago> paying the rent ia already a huge challenge Or the alternative: you have the freedom to focus on improving yourself, your health and fitness, your social connections and your business, as opposed to stressing over just maintaining your employment.
- WordSkill 9y agoThis article is a good example of the primary form of click-bait used by websites catering to the Thai expat / digital nomad market. No new visa has been introduced, and it is unlikely that anything along these lines ever will be, no matter how many times it is suggested in expat forums or Facebook groups for digital nomads. All the expat websites know this, but they keep pumping out these articles because they are, by far, their most reliable source of traffic. Every foreigner who spends time in Thailand indulges in the fantasy that their bizarre visa system will, somehow, be fixed to allow "good" visitors to spend longer there. It seems obvious that this _should_ happen, that the Thai people would benefit financially, but it would not be in the interests of the Thai elite, and that is the only things that currently matters.
- vram22 9y ago> but it would not be in the interests of the Thai elite Why not?
- johansch 9y agoDisruption is bad for business.
- dreamfactored 9y ago"was endorsed Friday by the Cabinet"
- WordSkill 9y agoIt was not endorsed in the legal sense, the writer is using that word to justify his claim, in the title, that the plan has the "green light". Endorsed, in this context, means that it was mentioned in cabinet, and the soldiers present agreed that it sounded like a fine idea. This is no different from all the other times it has been discussed, but nothing has actually been drafted, given the go-ahead or any sort of actual green light. This is just the usual spit-balling and bullshit. The best way to tell when a Thai expat website is trying to magic up a story out of nothing is that none of the other major expat websites have bothered to mention it. When a real new visa is introduced, such as the current 10-year visa for retirees, you will see it being discussed on all the sites.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]