4 ms·

I found it quite interesting to tour an alt-right newsroom, not what I was expecting at all. Many of their viewers want simple, effective solutions, eg. reject

by posguy 9y ago

I found it quite interesting to tour an alt-right newsroom, not what I was expecting at all. Many of their viewers want simple, effective solutions, eg. reject all Chinese imports until they cease producing Fentanyl despite that it is apt to not work. Ignoring that the working class is badly hurting in this country is what has gotten us to this place. Where Trump and Bernie offered hope of a brighter future, Hillary stated she was out to kill industries[1]. People are being forced to the right as that is all that is on the ballot, you've got the Democrats running Corporatist Republicans, while the Republicans have gone toward Fascism with a strong bootlicker mentality. 1 - http://www.weeklystandard.com/clinton-were-going-to-put-a-lot-of-coal-miners-and-coal-companies-out-of-business/article/2001541 http://www.weeklystandard.com/clinton-were-going-to-put-a-lo...

leggomylibro 9y ago
>eg. reject all Chinese imports until they cease producing Fentanyl Haha, seriously? That'd be the diplomatic equivalent of dropping an atomic bomb on Moscow; our real MAD with China is economic. I guess that's the issue in a nutshell, huh? Insular and stubborn facetiousness on one side, derisive sneering on the other. What d'you do about that? How do you engage in an atmosphere like that? Is it even possible anymore?
- posguy 9y ago
  Pretty much, I thought it was an insane prospect, but that is what sells that audience, action.
ZeroGravitas 9y ago
Hilariously, in a sad way, that speech from Hillary was full of compassion and good ideas for "Trump voters" and it was spun, entirely falsley as the moment of sneering condescension. People repeated all the time that Hillary had no solution for these people, when she did. She literally described it in the paragraph of that speech that that line was taken from. That's why I don't blame the voters, but blame the people who spread the propaganda like that. Even people on HN appear to be stupid enough to fall for it (or cynical enough to spread it). So really, what hope is there for facts and reality to triumph? The missing context: "Look, we have serious economic problems in many parts of our country. And Roland is absolutely right. Instead of dividing people the way Donald Trump does, let's reunite around policies that will bring jobs and opportunities to all these underserved poor communities. So for example, I'm the only candidate which has a policy about how to bring economic opportunity using clean renewable energy as the key into coal country. Because we're going to put a lot of coal miners and coal companies out of business, right? And we're going to make it clear that we don't want to forget those people. Those people labored in those mines for generations, losing their health, often losing their lives to turn on our lights and power our factories. Now we've got to move away from coal and all the other fossil fuels, but I don't want to move away from the people who did the best they could to produce the energy that we relied on. So whether it's coal country or Indian country or poor urban areas, there is a lot of poverty in America. We have gone backwards. We were moving in the right direction. In the '90s, more people were lifted out of poverty than any time in recent history. Because of the terrible economic policies of the Bush administration, President Obama was left with the worst financial crisis since the Great Depression, and people fell back into poverty because they lost jobs, they lost homes, they lost opportunities, and hope. So I am passionate about this, which is why I have put forward specific plans about how we incentivize more jobs, more investment in poor communities, and put people to work." Imagine being so cynical as misrepresent a multi billion dollar offer of help to a struggling community.
- api 9y ago
  No, she didn't. If your house is burning you don't want the fireman to talk about how they are going to work to improve building codes. You want them to put water in it right f'ing now. Her language is that of a building inspector, not a fireman or an EMT. Trump's rhetoric was about specific immediate action to tackle an emergency. Trump won by making such claims. He didn't mean it and his proposals were pretty shallow but at least he acknowledged the crisis and put forward credible sounding specific measures like terminating TPP and renegotiating NAFTA. This "right f'ing now" rhetoric is why he won. The alt-right, while noisy, is not that big. Trump won by carrying traditionally Democratic Midwestern counties because he said he would do something about the liquidation of the middle class, not by appealing to "fashy" nuts and 4chan shitlords.
  - ZeroGravitas 9y ago
    Are you saying Trump's lies were more believable than Clinton's truth? I agree, and I've already said I blame the propagandists that we have instead of a media that actually serves the people. It wasn't me that mentioned the alt-right, and it's the propaganda being piped in by Fox and Sinclair that I had mostly in mind. They've totally screwed their viewers since they hit the air. It's more like mass elder abuse than a news channel.
    - api 9y ago
      Yes, sort of. When you are in a crisis you want specific things to be done right now. Trump promised that while Clinton offered vague wonky rhetoric that sounded like empty platitudes. She is far better qualified to actually do something but she didn't communicate that she really gets the magnitude of the problem. If Clinton had acknowledged the magnitude of the economic and social crisis afflicting the interior and then offered e.g. a 10 point plan of specific actions to help she would have won, possibly by a large margin.
norea-armozel 9y ago
They're targeting production which is wise but they never ask who's the one filling out the orders for the production queue (hint: Wall Street). If they want to do anything to stop the death toll of Fentanyl they should also demand a 90% tax on all sales of Fentanyl at the wholesale level. That way they hit the companies that are making and selling the drug. Mind you, that has about as much chance of happening as their suggestion but it hits the companies who are the culprits of the mass addiction epidemic.

by posguy 9y ago

leggomylibro 9y ago

>eg. reject all Chinese imports until they cease producing Fentanyl Haha, seriously? That'd be the diplomatic equivalent of dropping an atomic bomb on Moscow; our real MAD with China is economic. I guess that's the issue in a nutshell, huh? Insular and stubborn facetiousness on one side, derisive sneering on the other. What d'you do about that? How do you engage in an atmosphere like that? Is it even possible anymore?

posguy 9y ago
Pretty much, I thought it was an insane prospect, but that is what sells that audience, action.

ZeroGravitas 9y ago

Hilariously, in a sad way, that speech from Hillary was full of compassion and good ideas for "Trump voters" and it was spun, entirely falsley as the moment of sneering condescension. People repeated all the time that Hillary had no solution for these people, when she did. She literally described it in the paragraph of that speech that that line was taken from. That's why I don't blame the voters, but blame the people who spread the propaganda like that. Even people on HN appear to be stupid enough to fall for it (or cynical enough to spread it). So really, what hope is there for facts and reality to triumph? The missing context: "Look, we have serious economic problems in many parts of our country. And Roland is absolutely right. Instead of dividing people the way Donald Trump does, let's reunite around policies that will bring jobs and opportunities to all these underserved poor communities. So for example, I'm the only candidate which has a policy about how to bring economic opportunity using clean renewable energy as the key into coal country. Because we're going to put a lot of coal miners and coal companies out of business, right? And we're going to make it clear that we don't want to forget those people. Those people labored in those mines for generations, losing their health, often losing their lives to turn on our lights and power our factories. Now we've got to move away from coal and all the other fossil fuels, but I don't want to move away from the people who did the best they could to produce the energy that we relied on. So whether it's coal country or Indian country or poor urban areas, there is a lot of poverty in America. We have gone backwards. We were moving in the right direction. In the '90s, more people were lifted out of poverty than any time in recent history. Because of the terrible economic policies of the Bush administration, President Obama was left with the worst financial crisis since the Great Depression, and people fell back into poverty because they lost jobs, they lost homes, they lost opportunities, and hope. So I am passionate about this, which is why I have put forward specific plans about how we incentivize more jobs, more investment in poor communities, and put people to work." Imagine being so cynical as misrepresent a multi billion dollar offer of help to a struggling community.

api 9y ago
No, she didn't. If your house is burning you don't want the fireman to talk about how they are going to work to improve building codes. You want them to put water in it right f'ing now. Her language is that of a building inspector, not a fireman or an EMT. Trump's rhetoric was about specific immediate action to tackle an emergency. Trump won by making such claims. He didn't mean it and his proposals were pretty shallow but at least he acknowledged the crisis and put forward credible sounding specific measures like terminating TPP and renegotiating NAFTA. This "right f'ing now" rhetoric is why he won. The alt-right, while noisy, is not that big. Trump won by carrying traditionally Democratic Midwestern counties because he said he would do something about the liquidation of the middle class, not by appealing to "fashy" nuts and 4chan shitlords.
- ZeroGravitas 9y ago
  Are you saying Trump's lies were more believable than Clinton's truth? I agree, and I've already said I blame the propagandists that we have instead of a media that actually serves the people. It wasn't me that mentioned the alt-right, and it's the propaganda being piped in by Fox and Sinclair that I had mostly in mind. They've totally screwed their viewers since they hit the air. It's more like mass elder abuse than a news channel.
  - api 9y ago
    Yes, sort of. When you are in a crisis you want specific things to be done right now. Trump promised that while Clinton offered vague wonky rhetoric that sounded like empty platitudes. She is far better qualified to actually do something but she didn't communicate that she really gets the magnitude of the problem. If Clinton had acknowledged the magnitude of the economic and social crisis afflicting the interior and then offered e.g. a 10 point plan of specific actions to help she would have won, possibly by a large margin.

norea-armozel 9y ago

They're targeting production which is wise but they never ask who's the one filling out the orders for the production queue (hint: Wall Street). If they want to do anything to stop the death toll of Fentanyl they should also demand a 90% tax on all sales of Fentanyl at the wholesale level. That way they hit the companies that are making and selling the drug. Mind you, that has about as much chance of happening as their suggestion but it hits the companies who are the culprits of the mass addiction epidemic.