5 ms·

Nah, it's fine. If it gets noisy, put on headphones or go sit in a different place for a few hours. Individual offices can be awful and isolating. Cubes can be

Nah, it's fine. If it gets noisy, put on headphones or go sit in a different place for a few hours. Individual offices can be awful and isolating. Cubes can be an acceptable compromise but it still kills a lot of spontaneous conversations. You gain a lot with open space plans: more interaction with coworkers, cultural gel and socializing. And of course, the company can cram more people in the same place.

jansho 9y ago
Well you can put a team in one room, and a kitchen to cater for several teams - like design studios actually. IMO that's the best balance, but maybe that's a bit luxurious, cattle pen-wise.
stock_toaster 9y ago
I strongly feel the best option (if remote work is not a possibility) is individual offices with team designated collaborative work areas. This allows people to quasi self organize, with the default option being that they have their own space.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
apr 9y ago
You are contradicting yourself. More interaction leads to more noise and now you are advising people to put headphones on or leave the place entirely. How are you supposed to culturally gel and socialize under such conditions?
sidlls 9y ago
And for those that find headphones distracting and for which there isn't a viable "somewhere else?" Such casual dismissal.
georgemcbay 9y ago
"Nah, it's fine." Yeah, I don't see the problem either. In fact, I don't understand why companies don't just install long airplane style seating rows in their open office plans and have everyone work from laptops literally on their laps... that way we'd be able to cram even more people in the same space, and just think about all the useful socializing and spontaneous conversations that would occur as co-workers were climbing over each other to head for the restrooms. /s (just in case)
- sitkack 9y ago
  Just use mothballed planes as offices. A steward could come down the isle every couple hours and give us snacks and drinks. When the build breaks, they can turn off the air as punishment. Hook them into some sort of huge ferris wheel, saves on space and keeps attrition low.
  - dvhh 9y ago
    And have a mandatory seat belt rules, and disallow restroom 45 min after work begin and 45 before end of work time.
inetknght 9y ago
> If it gets noisy, put on headphones Headphones only go so far. If you don't have good headphones (or, gasp can't afford good headphones, or don't have the time or money to shop around for good headphones), then you end up with a band-aid that doesn't really work because... well noise bleed is real. You either still hear what's happening around you or the people around you can hear your music. So they talk louder, because they need to make sure they're heard by whoever they're talking to. They don't stop the distraction of someone walking by. They don't stop someone from trying to start a whimsical conversation just because they walked by you.
majormajor 9y ago
Sadly, I'm still looking for headphones that can be comfortably worn over my ears + glasses for more than an hour at a time. In-ear ones have other comfort issues.
- beaconstudios 9y ago
  I have a set of Razer Krakens that are pretty comfortable even if I wear them all day, and I wear glasses.
- jamie_ca 9y ago
  I expect this will depend a lot on your frames - if the arms on your glasses are thick it'll be more inclined to squish into your head. That said I'm really happy with my Logitech G930s - I usually use them wired to keep the charge (the usb cord length is _very_ generous) but they're just fine wireless too, and do a good job staying put if I'm moving around a bit. My only complaint is that they seem to be sensitive to 2.4ghz interference, which can kick them off the wireless connection. Since there's no wired override (plugging in is purely for battery) this means plugging in can't save you. Once I switched my devices at home to prefer 5ghz wifi, it went from 5-10 times an hour at its worst to once or twice a month (and I can maybe blame that on the neighbours).
- hossbeast 9y ago
  Look up the Sennheiser Bluetooth ones.
- bartvk 9y ago
  Yep, I also have this problem. The only (wired) headphones that are big enough to fully circumvent your ears and thus comfortably sit for an hour or more, is the Sennheiser HD 558. Unfortunately, it's wired. There doesn't seem to be a bluetooth alternative. The newer Sennheiser models like the 4.50 are not as big as the HD 558. There's a dongle-based wireless headphone, the Logitech G533 which is big enough. It's meant more for gaming, and looks like it. It may only work on Windows, though.
kuschku 9y ago
That's some fine sarcasm you've got there. That said, there are apparently people defending this opinion.
- georgemcbay 9y ago
  Are you sure your parent post is sarcasm? The sad reality of the modern tech industry is that I actually think that is a serious response, though I wouldn't be surprised either way.
- sidlls 9y ago
  I wouldn't be so quick to think of it as sarcasm. "Ask IT for headphones" and "find a quiet spot in one of the lounges" are almost direct quotes from the CEO of the company I work for. In the few years I've been working here I have seen the CEO at his reserved seat in our open office area once, and the CFO twice. Not one other C-suite have I seen at their reserved seat in the open office area to do work.
  - borplk 9y ago
    "Keep collaborating you peasants."
pilsetnieks 9y ago
You should be more wary of Poe's law (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law) in the future.
WatchDog 9y ago
As someone who has never worked from a private office or classical cubicle I tend to agree, but maybe I just haven’t had a chance to experience the productivity explosion that comes with those options. I think open office is fine so long as the density is not too high. Ive seen conditions where you are shoulder to shoulder with your co-workers, which seems awful. I have always had around ~8 square meters of space in my open office layouts. I value being able to casually converse with my nearby colleagues.
- Spooky23 9y ago
  IMO it depends on the job. Open floor plans are good for ops roles and some front end roles where teams of people are engaged in substantially similar work driven, especially event driven work. Lower density low cubes are ok. Offices are great for managers, PMs or professionals like attorneys, engineers or accountants. From my perspective, remote works if the culture is friendly to remote or conditions like traffic make commuting a misery for everyone. As a manager of managers, we historically have had a lot of problems with remote employees compared with people in the office.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
Hnrobert42 9y ago
I don't want to gel or socialize with my colleagues. I want to work with them. If we become friends, we can socialize outside of work. I'm not paid to chitchat or stand around eating birthday cake. I don't need to love people to work with them. For the most part, even as a systems architect, I don't even need to talk to them. A few emails, echats, and meetings are sufficient. This may sound harsh, when I heard they were pulling down the cube walls, I threatened to walk. I got to keep my high walled cube, but everyone else was surprised one Monday with low walls. A week later, after the whole office rioted, everyone got their walls back. If you need/want company, go sit in a common area. But don't take away my isolation. And tell those kids to get the fuck off my lawn.
- vacri 9y ago
  > A few emails, echats, and meetings are sufficient. As a sysadmin, I overhear a ton of stuff that people don't put into chats. I like being in the office and being able to hear what people are talking about in the workplace; it helps me do my job better.
danielharrison 9y ago
So I'm supposed to pack up my computer, a couple of monitors, my notebooks and stationary and move it all whenever the noise levels are distracting me from focussing? Sounds efficient.
imron 9y ago
> but it still kills a lot of spontaneous conversations. Yes, I think that's the point.
Raynak 9y ago
If it gets noisy, put more noise into your ears? > more interaction with coworkers, cultural gel and socializing. Yeah, I like wasting time as much as anyone else. It's still bad. Good work interactions either happen better in offices, or are meetings.

jansho 9y ago

Well you can put a team in one room, and a kitchen to cater for several teams - like design studios actually. IMO that's the best balance, but maybe that's a bit luxurious, cattle pen-wise.

stock_toaster 9y ago

I strongly feel the best option (if remote work is not a possibility) is individual offices with team designated collaborative work areas. This allows people to quasi self organize, with the default option being that they have their own space.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

apr 9y ago

You are contradicting yourself. More interaction leads to more noise and now you are advising people to put headphones on or leave the place entirely. How are you supposed to culturally gel and socialize under such conditions?

sidlls 9y ago

And for those that find headphones distracting and for which there isn't a viable "somewhere else?" Such casual dismissal.

georgemcbay 9y ago

"Nah, it's fine." Yeah, I don't see the problem either. In fact, I don't understand why companies don't just install long airplane style seating rows in their open office plans and have everyone work from laptops literally on their laps... that way we'd be able to cram even more people in the same space, and just think about all the useful socializing and spontaneous conversations that would occur as co-workers were climbing over each other to head for the restrooms. /s (just in case)

sitkack 9y ago
Just use mothballed planes as offices. A steward could come down the isle every couple hours and give us snacks and drinks. When the build breaks, they can turn off the air as punishment. Hook them into some sort of huge ferris wheel, saves on space and keeps attrition low.
- dvhh 9y ago
  And have a mandatory seat belt rules, and disallow restroom 45 min after work begin and 45 before end of work time.

inetknght 9y ago

> If it gets noisy, put on headphones Headphones only go so far. If you don't have good headphones (or, gasp can't afford good headphones, or don't have the time or money to shop around for good headphones), then you end up with a band-aid that doesn't really work because... well noise bleed is real. You either still hear what's happening around you or the people around you can hear your music. So they talk louder, because they need to make sure they're heard by whoever they're talking to. They don't stop the distraction of someone walking by. They don't stop someone from trying to start a whimsical conversation just because they walked by you.

majormajor 9y ago

Sadly, I'm still looking for headphones that can be comfortably worn over my ears + glasses for more than an hour at a time. In-ear ones have other comfort issues.

beaconstudios 9y ago
I have a set of Razer Krakens that are pretty comfortable even if I wear them all day, and I wear glasses.
jamie_ca 9y ago
I expect this will depend a lot on your frames - if the arms on your glasses are thick it'll be more inclined to squish into your head. That said I'm really happy with my Logitech G930s - I usually use them wired to keep the charge (the usb cord length is _very_ generous) but they're just fine wireless too, and do a good job staying put if I'm moving around a bit. My only complaint is that they seem to be sensitive to 2.4ghz interference, which can kick them off the wireless connection. Since there's no wired override (plugging in is purely for battery) this means plugging in can't save you. Once I switched my devices at home to prefer 5ghz wifi, it went from 5-10 times an hour at its worst to once or twice a month (and I can maybe blame that on the neighbours).
hossbeast 9y ago
Look up the Sennheiser Bluetooth ones.
bartvk 9y ago
Yep, I also have this problem. The only (wired) headphones that are big enough to fully circumvent your ears and thus comfortably sit for an hour or more, is the Sennheiser HD 558. Unfortunately, it's wired. There doesn't seem to be a bluetooth alternative. The newer Sennheiser models like the 4.50 are not as big as the HD 558. There's a dongle-based wireless headphone, the Logitech G533 which is big enough. It's meant more for gaming, and looks like it. It may only work on Windows, though.

kuschku 9y ago

That's some fine sarcasm you've got there. That said, there are apparently people defending this opinion.

georgemcbay 9y ago
Are you sure your parent post is sarcasm? The sad reality of the modern tech industry is that I actually think that is a serious response, though I wouldn't be surprised either way.
sidlls 9y ago
I wouldn't be so quick to think of it as sarcasm. "Ask IT for headphones" and "find a quiet spot in one of the lounges" are almost direct quotes from the CEO of the company I work for. In the few years I've been working here I have seen the CEO at his reserved seat in our open office area once, and the CFO twice. Not one other C-suite have I seen at their reserved seat in the open office area to do work.
- borplk 9y ago
  "Keep collaborating you peasants."

pilsetnieks 9y ago

You should be more wary of Poe's law (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law) in the future.

WatchDog 9y ago

As someone who has never worked from a private office or classical cubicle I tend to agree, but maybe I just haven’t had a chance to experience the productivity explosion that comes with those options. I think open office is fine so long as the density is not too high. Ive seen conditions where you are shoulder to shoulder with your co-workers, which seems awful. I have always had around ~8 square meters of space in my open office layouts. I value being able to casually converse with my nearby colleagues.

Spooky23 9y ago
IMO it depends on the job. Open floor plans are good for ops roles and some front end roles where teams of people are engaged in substantially similar work driven, especially event driven work. Lower density low cubes are ok. Offices are great for managers, PMs or professionals like attorneys, engineers or accountants. From my perspective, remote works if the culture is friendly to remote or conditions like traffic make commuting a misery for everyone. As a manager of managers, we historically have had a lot of problems with remote employees compared with people in the office.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

Hnrobert42 9y ago

I don't want to gel or socialize with my colleagues. I want to work with them. If we become friends, we can socialize outside of work. I'm not paid to chitchat or stand around eating birthday cake. I don't need to love people to work with them. For the most part, even as a systems architect, I don't even need to talk to them. A few emails, echats, and meetings are sufficient. This may sound harsh, when I heard they were pulling down the cube walls, I threatened to walk. I got to keep my high walled cube, but everyone else was surprised one Monday with low walls. A week later, after the whole office rioted, everyone got their walls back. If you need/want company, go sit in a common area. But don't take away my isolation. And tell those kids to get the fuck off my lawn.

vacri 9y ago
> A few emails, echats, and meetings are sufficient. As a sysadmin, I overhear a ton of stuff that people don't put into chats. I like being in the office and being able to hear what people are talking about in the workplace; it helps me do my job better.

danielharrison 9y ago

So I'm supposed to pack up my computer, a couple of monitors, my notebooks and stationary and move it all whenever the noise levels are distracting me from focussing? Sounds efficient.

imron 9y ago

> but it still kills a lot of spontaneous conversations. Yes, I think that's the point.

Raynak 9y ago

If it gets noisy, put more noise into your ears? > more interaction with coworkers, cultural gel and socializing. Yeah, I like wasting time as much as anyone else. It's still bad. Good work interactions either happen better in offices, or are meetings.