5 ms·

Kind of interesting that this article is coming from the WP, given their acquisition by Bezos. Note: Didn't read due to Pay Wall

marcosscriven 9y ago
Easy to get around with a bookmarklet. javascript:window.location=%22https://m.facebook.com/l.php?u=%22+encodeURIComponent(window.location.href); https://m.facebook.com/l.php?u=%22+encodeURIComponent(window... E.g: https://m.facebook.com/flx/warn/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.washingtonpost.com%2Fbusiness%2Fis-amazon-getting-too-big%2F2017%2F07%2F28%2Fff38b9ca-722e-11e7-9eac-d56bd5568db8_story.html%3Futm_term%3D.747bae2f68e1&h=ATN8yYRiRkuJiV_hMf339wgPMgcr0fYJfo6oP_odrLCO3YBW6PHED4ZJlaSYYdRqPMEpoYAjl_L6vmNO4PvcSqLWBNwX&_rdr https://m.facebook.com/flx/warn/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.washing...
- legohead 9y ago
  Your link didn't work for me, still paywalled.
manigandham 9y ago
> Note: Didn't read due to Pay Wall Do you use an adblocker?
myth_drannon 9y ago
open it in Incognito Tab
lostlogin 9y ago
If you are on iOS, hitting reader mode solves this for many sites (WoPo, NYT).
jawns 9y ago
This is what HN readers and Paul Graham enthusiasts might call a reverse submarine or an insider submarine. A traditional submarine is when a PR firm supplies journalists with stories that are true, but just happens to favor their clients. It tries to give biased information a patina of unbiased objectivity (to the extent that the newspaper is considered to be less biased than a press release). This reverse submarine -- a critique of Amazon published by Jeff Bezos' paper -- tries to give what appears to be a biased news source a patina of unbiased objectivity by running what appears to be a piece that's critical of the thing it's thought to be biased toward. Bezos can now say, "Hey, look at this Post piece that's critical of Amazon. Clearly, I'm not pulling the strings or censoring articles that make my company look bad." But bear in mind that we don't know what's under the surface. We know what articles critical of Amazon he has let through, but we don't know what articles critical of Amazon he hasn't let through.
- Pyxl101 9y ago
  This article is in the "Perspectives" section of WaPo, which means the "Opinion" section, in case you are not aware. > Discussion of news topics with a point of view, including narratives by individuals regarding their own experiences
  - jawns 9y ago
    I think you might be missing the point. I'm not saying that the piece itself is unbiased. Opinion pieces are not supposed to be unbiased. I'm saying that the fact that the piece was run gives Bezos the ability to say that he does not exert editorial control over the paper, because if he did, he wouldn't have let such a piece run at all.
    - throwaway5752 9y ago
      In your logic, is their any way Bezos can demonstrated the editorial independence of the Washington Post?
      - mintplant 9y ago
        Even if the answer is "no", that doesn't mean we should fall back to assuming WaPo is fully editorially independent. Just as our (current) inability to prove P != NP doesn't mean we should assume P = NP.
      - adrianratnapala 9y ago
        There isn't and there doesn't need to be, because newspapers should be read as evidence rather than as authority. Like any publication, the WP is what it is. It has particular staff, history, reputaiton etc, all of which make it strong in some ways but weak in others, including bias. Bezos' ownership of the paper is yet one more layer on all that. There is, and never was, any alternative to reading stuff with your bullshit detector turned on.
  - trendia 9y ago
    Opinion pieces are still subject to approval by the editor and reflect the broader narrative of the news organization. Simply compare the opinion pieces in the NYT (more left leaning) to those in the WSJ (more right leaning) -- there is a clear and obvious bias toward the overall publication's bias.
dhimes 9y ago
This is OT but another peeve of mine since Bezo's bought the WP. The iOS app blocks articles. I grew up reading it and have even subscribed digitally since being in Boston. I have a login for the site, etc. But the iOS app is blocking. Grrrrr.
mulmen 9y ago
Why would this be interesting? Are you suggesting Bezos has an editorial influence at WP?
- mintplant 9y ago
  Yes, that is the obvious implication.
- cylinder 9y ago
  Of course he does, even if it's passive. That's why disclosures about common ownership are mandatory in journalism. If you don't believe me, you should go write a negative blog post about your company's CEO right now.

marcosscriven 9y ago

Easy to get around with a bookmarklet. javascript:window.location=%22https://m.facebook.com/l.php?u=%22+encodeURIComponent(window.location.href); https://m.facebook.com/l.php?u=%22+encodeURIComponent(window... E.g: https://m.facebook.com/flx/warn/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.washingtonpost.com%2Fbusiness%2Fis-amazon-getting-too-big%2F2017%2F07%2F28%2Fff38b9ca-722e-11e7-9eac-d56bd5568db8_story.html%3Futm_term%3D.747bae2f68e1&h=ATN8yYRiRkuJiV_hMf339wgPMgcr0fYJfo6oP_odrLCO3YBW6PHED4ZJlaSYYdRqPMEpoYAjl_L6vmNO4PvcSqLWBNwX&_rdr https://m.facebook.com/flx/warn/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.washing...

legohead 9y ago
Your link didn't work for me, still paywalled.

manigandham 9y ago

> Note: Didn't read due to Pay Wall Do you use an adblocker?

myth_drannon 9y ago

open it in Incognito Tab

lostlogin 9y ago

If you are on iOS, hitting reader mode solves this for many sites (WoPo, NYT).

jawns 9y ago

This is what HN readers and Paul Graham enthusiasts might call a reverse submarine or an insider submarine. A traditional submarine is when a PR firm supplies journalists with stories that are true, but just happens to favor their clients. It tries to give biased information a patina of unbiased objectivity (to the extent that the newspaper is considered to be less biased than a press release). This reverse submarine -- a critique of Amazon published by Jeff Bezos' paper -- tries to give what appears to be a biased news source a patina of unbiased objectivity by running what appears to be a piece that's critical of the thing it's thought to be biased toward. Bezos can now say, "Hey, look at this Post piece that's critical of Amazon. Clearly, I'm not pulling the strings or censoring articles that make my company look bad." But bear in mind that we don't know what's under the surface. We know what articles critical of Amazon he has let through, but we don't know what articles critical of Amazon he hasn't let through.

Pyxl101 9y ago
This article is in the "Perspectives" section of WaPo, which means the "Opinion" section, in case you are not aware. > Discussion of news topics with a point of view, including narratives by individuals regarding their own experiences
- jawns 9y ago
  I think you might be missing the point. I'm not saying that the piece itself is unbiased. Opinion pieces are not supposed to be unbiased. I'm saying that the fact that the piece was run gives Bezos the ability to say that he does not exert editorial control over the paper, because if he did, he wouldn't have let such a piece run at all.
  - throwaway5752 9y ago
    In your logic, is their any way Bezos can demonstrated the editorial independence of the Washington Post?
    - mintplant 9y ago
      Even if the answer is "no", that doesn't mean we should fall back to assuming WaPo is fully editorially independent. Just as our (current) inability to prove P != NP doesn't mean we should assume P = NP.
    - adrianratnapala 9y ago
      There isn't and there doesn't need to be, because newspapers should be read as evidence rather than as authority. Like any publication, the WP is what it is. It has particular staff, history, reputaiton etc, all of which make it strong in some ways but weak in others, including bias. Bezos' ownership of the paper is yet one more layer on all that. There is, and never was, any alternative to reading stuff with your bullshit detector turned on.
- trendia 9y ago
  Opinion pieces are still subject to approval by the editor and reflect the broader narrative of the news organization. Simply compare the opinion pieces in the NYT (more left leaning) to those in the WSJ (more right leaning) -- there is a clear and obvious bias toward the overall publication's bias.

dhimes 9y ago

This is OT but another peeve of mine since Bezo's bought the WP. The iOS app blocks articles. I grew up reading it and have even subscribed digitally since being in Boston. I have a login for the site, etc. But the iOS app is blocking. Grrrrr.

mulmen 9y ago

Why would this be interesting? Are you suggesting Bezos has an editorial influence at WP?

mintplant 9y ago
Yes, that is the obvious implication.
cylinder 9y ago
Of course he does, even if it's passive. That's why disclosures about common ownership are mandatory in journalism. If you don't believe me, you should go write a negative blog post about your company's CEO right now.