8 ms·

A "small town" ... 7 miles from the center of a major global city and metro area ... even closer to a major international airport. These people are assholes.

getemback 9y ago
There's nothing wrong with small villages 7 miles from a major city or even a capital city, if the principal city is built properly. If you walk 7 miles from the center of Zurich, Switzerland you'll probably find yourself in the middle of a vineyard or pasture.
- aphextron 9y ago
  Zurich is not located on a 7 mile wide peninsula.
  - glibgil 9y ago
    This is some strange SF manifest destiny argument
- greglindahl 9y ago
  Your statement appears to have nothing to do with the area that Brisbane, CA is located in.
  - getemback 9y ago
    I was just objecting to the idea that a small town was inappropriate in this context. With a suitable urban form there's no reason why you couldn't take the entire population of Brisbane and put them all on 640 acres, with 80% open space. But Brisbane, California is not a "small town" it's a disgusting example of exurban sprawl. https://www.google.com/maps/place/Brisbane,+CA/@37.679201,-122.330704,3a,78.3y,90t/data=!3m8!1e2!3m6!1shttps:%2F%2Fthumbs.trulia-cdn.com%2Fpictures%2Fthumbs_6%2Fps.102%2Fe%2F7%2F5%2Fd%2Fpicture-uh%3D9c9ef53f4781e89553177368d022-ps%3De75d7f71be33c23a4e3456941b73ffa7-142-Elderberry-Ln-Brisbane-CA-94005.jpg!2e7!3e27!6s%2F%2Flh5.googleusercontent.com%2Fproxy%2FjFOwihIPa-3H8QgXCGQ-ml2v3OklBa9hKVt3vmtj1YKCdX7sXcJmtp5tXnET_ujA_xFhQZl_IYdtZkrQZ2sh6wI0WGNMQjDnXoM-5_fMEFuHsctScZjCUljHrMmoniDsXhgA0YrAwUgBSS7q-Pif_R1prKxUtAs%3Dw159-h106-k-no!7i1440!8i960!4m5!3m4!1s0x808f78d8f2a30531:0xff55e02fce53ae30!8m2!3d37.6807661!4d-122.3999715 https://www.google.com/maps/place/Brisbane,+CA/@37.679201,-1...
    - vecinu 9y ago
      If you look at your link, you will see the address is (142 Elderberry Ln, Brisbane, CA 94005). Looking at the map (https://goo.gl/maps/7kvttaK8z7F2 https://goo.gl/maps/7kvttaK8z7F2), it's not even in Brisbane proper, so I think you're wrong about your assessment. I have been to Brisbane, the number of large McMansions is very tiny.
      - getemback 9y ago
        This one is. It almost seems designed to trick a machine learning classifier into classifying it as a warehouse or something. Point it the existing built environment of Brisbane, CA is not worth preserving. Its car-dependent nature is a menace to the region. https://www.google.com/maps/@37.6916572,-122.4087356,3a,90y,158.86h,83.53t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sq3KQrB3PRqpeBO0i7a38lQ!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3Dq3KQrB3PRqpeBO0i7a38lQ%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D167.12732%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656 https://www.google.com/maps/@37.6916572,-122.4087356,3a,90y,...
        vecinu 9y ago
        Your link still points to a house outside of Brisbane proper... how transit efficient is San Francisco outside of downtown? BART doesn't reach most of SF, MUNI is abysmal and buses...well, Brisbane has buses too. I think your assessment is a bit heavy handed considering how bad public transit is in the area in general.
        getemback 9y ago
        You seem to be defining "Brisbane proper" as the area between San Francisco Ave. and Firth Park. But Brisbane is much more extensive. The majority of its land area is taken up by empty land, single-story material handling facilities, and ludicrous sprawl at "The Ridge".
        rbanffy 9y ago
        I wonder how many self-driving cars live in that house...
  - drspacemonkey 9y ago
    I think that was part of the point. IE: "if the principal city is built properly" implies the principal city isn't built properly.
    - greglindahl 9y ago
      Oh, that makes sense. Instead of talking about what we could actually do -- build high-density by an existing and underused transit hub -- let's complain about the way the entire Bay Area is laid out!
- vecinu 9y ago
  Brisbane is 6.5 miles from downtown SF (https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=distance+downtown+san+francisco+to+Brisbane,+CA https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=distance+downtown+san+...) The entire peninsula is tiny, it's not fair to compare it to Zurich.
- microtherion 9y ago
  You can find both grazing cows and vineyards WITHIN the city limits of Zurich, less than 3 miles from the center.
kafkaesq 9y ago
A "small town" ... 7 miles from the center of a major global city and metro area ... even closer to a major international airport. Nothing weird about that situation at all. In fact it's the way much of planet is organized. These people are assholes. Nothing of the sort. They're long-term residents looking out for what's best for their community. And it's exactly the kind of completely gratuitous negativity (project by outsiders, who otherwise couldn't begin to care what goes on in their town), exemplified above, which shores up this instinct that many of them have to protect what they have. Because they know that you're definitely not concerned about what impact projects like these will have on their quality of life and long-term fiscal interests.
- epistasis 9y ago
  >They're long-term residents looking out for what's best for their community. No, they're just looking out for themselves. The community is hurt by their greed for massively inflated property values, low taxes, and keeping the younger generation from living the lives they want. If that makes me negative, fine. But if they are white-washing their behavior by pretending to be concerned for "the community" when really they only care about themselves, yes, that is the very definition of asshole.
  - kafkaesq 9y ago
    The community is hurt by their greed for massively inflated property values, low taxes, Or maybe they see positive tradeoffs. Either way it's for them to assess, not you. Keeping the younger generation from living the lives they want. As if they have some inalienable right to live in places like Brisbane. If that makes me negative, fine. I doubt they care what you think, actually.
    - rbanffy 9y ago
      > Either way it's for them to assess, not you. Until the state decides to apply eminent domain so more people can better use the space available. > As if they have some inalienable right to live in places like Brisbane. As if anyone had an inalienable right not to have neighbors.
oneshot908 9y ago
The residents of Brisbane get to inhale deeply of the fumes generated by nearby enormous mountains of garbage from SF and the bay area on a daily basis. I understand completely why they'd oppose development. Now I suspect if there were a deal in play to remove the awful stench once and for all, there'd be something in it for them. Right now, they should drag this out as long and as hard as they can IMO lest they get screwed again. Because if the place didn't smell like a$$ on a daily basis, it would have been discovered and gentrified long ago (I remember checking the place out myself in 2007). It could be a fantastic suburb of SF in a world where win/win usually triumphed over I got mine so @#$% you. But that's not how this area works in my experience.
pizzetta 9y ago
But why put the onus on a small village when the city of SF itself is unwilling to allow normal city development & construction. If anyone are assholes, it's the city of SF itself --who, by the way, typically rally behind "we don't want to Manhattanize SF." If SF is unwilling to do their part, why would we expect a small village compensate ofr the city's unwillingness to support development?
- deathanatos 9y ago
  I (as someone who supports building more in the Bay Area) don't want the onus to be just on Brisbane. I want it to be on the whole Bay Area, and all of its townships. That one of the major issues I think the Bay Area faces: each township passes the buck to the next: "Why should we build housing, when township X is completely unwilling to do so?" Yes, and they say the same thing about you! With this attitude, nothing will ever get built, anywhere.
  - pizzetta 9y ago
    I think we should recognize that SF and Brisbane are not in the same league. Anything Brisbane would build would be a drop in the bucket. SF can potentially add a hundred thousand units --two hundred thousand units, no problem without changing the character from village to full-blown city. 4,00 units more than doubles the pop of Brisbane. If we added 200,000 units to _only_ SF, that would add 25% to their pop. Another 200,000 would add 20% to SJ. The Problem is SF, Oakland and SJ --localities which can/could build if they wanted to but simply don't.
    - wbl 9y ago
      It also increases the built area of Brisbane.
    - closeparen 9y ago
      Oakland seems to be approving residential towers at a decent clip. I'm not sure it belongs in the same breath as SF and SJ.
maxscam 9y ago
I grew up here, it was a very ideal place for families. More suburban than sf (population of less than 5k) but didnt feel like sprawl either. We played in the streets, can't do that in most of sf. Although to be fair this area theyre talking about isnt really in brisbane anyway, its on a industrial stretch.

getemback 9y ago

There's nothing wrong with small villages 7 miles from a major city or even a capital city, if the principal city is built properly. If you walk 7 miles from the center of Zurich, Switzerland you'll probably find yourself in the middle of a vineyard or pasture.

aphextron 9y ago
Zurich is not located on a 7 mile wide peninsula.
- glibgil 9y ago
  This is some strange SF manifest destiny argument
greglindahl 9y ago
Your statement appears to have nothing to do with the area that Brisbane, CA is located in.
- getemback 9y ago
  I was just objecting to the idea that a small town was inappropriate in this context. With a suitable urban form there's no reason why you couldn't take the entire population of Brisbane and put them all on 640 acres, with 80% open space. But Brisbane, California is not a "small town" it's a disgusting example of exurban sprawl. https://www.google.com/maps/place/Brisbane,+CA/@37.679201,-122.330704,3a,78.3y,90t/data=!3m8!1e2!3m6!1shttps:%2F%2Fthumbs.trulia-cdn.com%2Fpictures%2Fthumbs_6%2Fps.102%2Fe%2F7%2F5%2Fd%2Fpicture-uh%3D9c9ef53f4781e89553177368d022-ps%3De75d7f71be33c23a4e3456941b73ffa7-142-Elderberry-Ln-Brisbane-CA-94005.jpg!2e7!3e27!6s%2F%2Flh5.googleusercontent.com%2Fproxy%2FjFOwihIPa-3H8QgXCGQ-ml2v3OklBa9hKVt3vmtj1YKCdX7sXcJmtp5tXnET_ujA_xFhQZl_IYdtZkrQZ2sh6wI0WGNMQjDnXoM-5_fMEFuHsctScZjCUljHrMmoniDsXhgA0YrAwUgBSS7q-Pif_R1prKxUtAs%3Dw159-h106-k-no!7i1440!8i960!4m5!3m4!1s0x808f78d8f2a30531:0xff55e02fce53ae30!8m2!3d37.6807661!4d-122.3999715 https://www.google.com/maps/place/Brisbane,+CA/@37.679201,-1...
  - vecinu 9y ago
    If you look at your link, you will see the address is (142 Elderberry Ln, Brisbane, CA 94005). Looking at the map (https://goo.gl/maps/7kvttaK8z7F2 https://goo.gl/maps/7kvttaK8z7F2), it's not even in Brisbane proper, so I think you're wrong about your assessment. I have been to Brisbane, the number of large McMansions is very tiny.
    - getemback 9y ago
      This one is. It almost seems designed to trick a machine learning classifier into classifying it as a warehouse or something. Point it the existing built environment of Brisbane, CA is not worth preserving. Its car-dependent nature is a menace to the region. https://www.google.com/maps/@37.6916572,-122.4087356,3a,90y,158.86h,83.53t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sq3KQrB3PRqpeBO0i7a38lQ!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3Dq3KQrB3PRqpeBO0i7a38lQ%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D167.12732%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656 https://www.google.com/maps/@37.6916572,-122.4087356,3a,90y,...
      - vecinu 9y ago
        Your link still points to a house outside of Brisbane proper... how transit efficient is San Francisco outside of downtown? BART doesn't reach most of SF, MUNI is abysmal and buses...well, Brisbane has buses too. I think your assessment is a bit heavy handed considering how bad public transit is in the area in general.
        getemback 9y ago
        You seem to be defining "Brisbane proper" as the area between San Francisco Ave. and Firth Park. But Brisbane is much more extensive. The majority of its land area is taken up by empty land, single-story material handling facilities, and ludicrous sprawl at "The Ridge".
      - rbanffy 9y ago
        I wonder how many self-driving cars live in that house...
- drspacemonkey 9y ago
  I think that was part of the point. IE: "if the principal city is built properly" implies the principal city isn't built properly.
  - greglindahl 9y ago
    Oh, that makes sense. Instead of talking about what we could actually do -- build high-density by an existing and underused transit hub -- let's complain about the way the entire Bay Area is laid out!
vecinu 9y ago
Brisbane is 6.5 miles from downtown SF (https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=distance+downtown+san+francisco+to+Brisbane,+CA https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=distance+downtown+san+...) The entire peninsula is tiny, it's not fair to compare it to Zurich.
microtherion 9y ago
You can find both grazing cows and vineyards WITHIN the city limits of Zurich, less than 3 miles from the center.

kafkaesq 9y ago

A "small town" ... 7 miles from the center of a major global city and metro area ... even closer to a major international airport. Nothing weird about that situation at all. In fact it's the way much of planet is organized. These people are assholes. Nothing of the sort. They're long-term residents looking out for what's best for their community. And it's exactly the kind of completely gratuitous negativity (project by outsiders, who otherwise couldn't begin to care what goes on in their town), exemplified above, which shores up this instinct that many of them have to protect what they have. Because they know that you're definitely not concerned about what impact projects like these will have on their quality of life and long-term fiscal interests.

epistasis 9y ago
>They're long-term residents looking out for what's best for their community. No, they're just looking out for themselves. The community is hurt by their greed for massively inflated property values, low taxes, and keeping the younger generation from living the lives they want. If that makes me negative, fine. But if they are white-washing their behavior by pretending to be concerned for "the community" when really they only care about themselves, yes, that is the very definition of asshole.
- kafkaesq 9y ago
  The community is hurt by their greed for massively inflated property values, low taxes, Or maybe they see positive tradeoffs. Either way it's for them to assess, not you. Keeping the younger generation from living the lives they want. As if they have some inalienable right to live in places like Brisbane. If that makes me negative, fine. I doubt they care what you think, actually.
  - rbanffy 9y ago
    > Either way it's for them to assess, not you. Until the state decides to apply eminent domain so more people can better use the space available. > As if they have some inalienable right to live in places like Brisbane. As if anyone had an inalienable right not to have neighbors.

oneshot908 9y ago

The residents of Brisbane get to inhale deeply of the fumes generated by nearby enormous mountains of garbage from SF and the bay area on a daily basis. I understand completely why they'd oppose development. Now I suspect if there were a deal in play to remove the awful stench once and for all, there'd be something in it for them. Right now, they should drag this out as long and as hard as they can IMO lest they get screwed again. Because if the place didn't smell like a$$ on a daily basis, it would have been discovered and gentrified long ago (I remember checking the place out myself in 2007). It could be a fantastic suburb of SF in a world where win/win usually triumphed over I got mine so @#$% you. But that's not how this area works in my experience.

pizzetta 9y ago

But why put the onus on a small village when the city of SF itself is unwilling to allow normal city development & construction. If anyone are assholes, it's the city of SF itself --who, by the way, typically rally behind "we don't want to Manhattanize SF." If SF is unwilling to do their part, why would we expect a small village compensate ofr the city's unwillingness to support development?

deathanatos 9y ago
I (as someone who supports building more in the Bay Area) don't want the onus to be just on Brisbane. I want it to be on the whole Bay Area, and all of its townships. That one of the major issues I think the Bay Area faces: each township passes the buck to the next: "Why should we build housing, when township X is completely unwilling to do so?" Yes, and they say the same thing about you! With this attitude, nothing will ever get built, anywhere.
- pizzetta 9y ago
  I think we should recognize that SF and Brisbane are not in the same league. Anything Brisbane would build would be a drop in the bucket. SF can potentially add a hundred thousand units --two hundred thousand units, no problem without changing the character from village to full-blown city. 4,00 units more than doubles the pop of Brisbane. If we added 200,000 units to _only_ SF, that would add 25% to their pop. Another 200,000 would add 20% to SJ. The Problem is SF, Oakland and SJ --localities which can/could build if they wanted to but simply don't.
  - wbl 9y ago
    It also increases the built area of Brisbane.
  - closeparen 9y ago
    Oakland seems to be approving residential towers at a decent clip. I'm not sure it belongs in the same breath as SF and SJ.

maxscam 9y ago

I grew up here, it was a very ideal place for families. More suburban than sf (population of less than 5k) but didnt feel like sprawl either. We played in the streets, can't do that in most of sf. Although to be fair this area theyre talking about isnt really in brisbane anyway, its on a industrial stretch.