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Approximately half the internet exists because of the lack of IPv6. A partial list: * Streaming music - because you can't connect to your music collection a

by sliken 9y ago

Approximately half the internet exists because of the lack of IPv6. A partial list: * Streaming music - because you can't connect to your music collection at home * drop box - because neither you or the person you shared with can direct connect * power/solar monitoring - cloud service because you can't connect to your system * IoT/Dropcams/Nest thermostats - require cloud services... because your phone/tablet/desktop can't connect to your clients automatically * security services, garage door control, smart home - another cloud service because you can't monitor/control directly. * netflix - can't connect to your home plex * skype (after they ditched p2p), google hangouts etc - requires cloud because the clients can't connect to each other * pretty much every chat client - central servers because you can't direct connect.

SonOfLilit 9y ago
Sorry, I just can't agree with this. IRC had servers decades before IPv4 address scarcity became a thing. Skype was popular before they had to ditch P2P, and most users aren't aware of the issue. DropBox is first and foremost a backup service, and you always want backup to be off-premise. [..] Cloud services are awesome and we would all use them even if we could accept incoming connections.
- zAy0LfpBZLC8mAC 9y ago
  > IRC had servers decades before IPv4 address scarcity became a thing. Because it's a group chat, where a server is much more natural than for two parties communicating. Plus, it has DCC, so you can actually efectively use IRC without an IRC server.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- the8472 9y ago
  In the 90s anyone could host a multiplayer game at home.
mrkrabo 9y ago
I have like 80 KB/s of upload. Having an external IP (which I do) does not solve anything for me.
- zAy0LfpBZLC8mAC 9y ago
  Everything you upload to a cloud service still has to go through that uplink. As long as you are not transmitting it to more than one party, a cloud service does not change anything about the bandwidth you need.
  - mrkrabo 9y ago
    Well, I don't use cloud services. But that does not mean that the only reason I use Spotify is because I don't have an external IP address at home. That's silly.
    - e12e 9y ago
      Ipv4 (Nat) is the main reason, the use of asymmetric connections rather than a sensible baseline of full duplex 100(0) Mbit is the other.
heavenlyblue 9y ago
The worst thing about some software developers is their natural tendency to assign the success of the businesses to the purely technical decisions, and not political ones: - streaming music - you pay Spotify for it's browsing and discovery services and the fact that you don't pay for every album you would like to listen to. Not to access "my music collection at home". Quite frankly it doesn't seem to me you can even do that on Spotify, but I may be wrong. - power/solar monitoring - you would need a server which would specifically handle the metric collection and make decisions upon this. Obviously cloud is cheaper than a separate box stationed in your house. - IoT/Dropcams/Nest thermostats - Philips Hue doesn't work through cloud since it doesn't have to. Dropcams are usually a separate device which does not provide server capabilities per se - so require a box. - security services, garage door control, smart home - all of that is controllable directly, but I am not going to start on how much you will be overpaying for every of the devices for them to have a separate fully-functional IP stack that is easily connected to a (W)LAN (wi-fi, ethernet, bluetooth - all of that is either expensive, bulky or power-hungry). So a box/cloud is always a solution. - netflix - same points as Spotify. You don't pay them to manage your collection, you pay them to have access to a constantly curated list of newly available items. - skype, google hangouts, etc. - please do show everyone how to create a chat service that would allow me to chat with anyone I would like to without having to resort to a centralised storage of identities and at the same time solve the issue of spam.
- zAy0LfpBZLC8mAC 9y ago
  > - power/solar monitoring - you would need a server which would specifically handle the metric collection and make decisions upon this. Obviously cloud is cheaper than a separate box stationed in your house. Except there is already a box stationed in your house, otherwise no data collection. Whether you might want to be able to use cloud-provided storage for reliability reasons would be a separate issue (which (a) could be completely application agnostic and (b) could just as well use your home server if you preferred that). > Dropcams are usually a separate device which does not provide server capabilities per se - so require a box. Or adding "server capabilities", whatever that is. > but I am not going to start on how much you will be overpaying for every of the devices for them to have a separate fully-functional IP stack that is easily connected to a (W)LAN (wi-fi, ethernet, bluetooth - all of that is either expensive, bulky or power-hungry). So a box/cloud is always a solution. How exactly do any of those connect to "the cloud" without a "fully-functional IP stack"?

by sliken 9y ago

SonOfLilit 9y ago

Sorry, I just can't agree with this. IRC had servers decades before IPv4 address scarcity became a thing. Skype was popular before they had to ditch P2P, and most users aren't aware of the issue. DropBox is first and foremost a backup service, and you always want backup to be off-premise. [..] Cloud services are awesome and we would all use them even if we could accept incoming connections.

zAy0LfpBZLC8mAC 9y ago
> IRC had servers decades before IPv4 address scarcity became a thing. Because it's a group chat, where a server is much more natural than for two parties communicating. Plus, it has DCC, so you can actually efectively use IRC without an IRC server.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
the8472 9y ago
In the 90s anyone could host a multiplayer game at home.

mrkrabo 9y ago

I have like 80 KB/s of upload. Having an external IP (which I do) does not solve anything for me.

zAy0LfpBZLC8mAC 9y ago
Everything you upload to a cloud service still has to go through that uplink. As long as you are not transmitting it to more than one party, a cloud service does not change anything about the bandwidth you need.
- mrkrabo 9y ago
  Well, I don't use cloud services. But that does not mean that the only reason I use Spotify is because I don't have an external IP address at home. That's silly.
  - e12e 9y ago
    Ipv4 (Nat) is the main reason, the use of asymmetric connections rather than a sensible baseline of full duplex 100(0) Mbit is the other.

heavenlyblue 9y ago

The worst thing about some software developers is their natural tendency to assign the success of the businesses to the purely technical decisions, and not political ones: - streaming music - you pay Spotify for it's browsing and discovery services and the fact that you don't pay for every album you would like to listen to. Not to access "my music collection at home". Quite frankly it doesn't seem to me you can even do that on Spotify, but I may be wrong. - power/solar monitoring - you would need a server which would specifically handle the metric collection and make decisions upon this. Obviously cloud is cheaper than a separate box stationed in your house. - IoT/Dropcams/Nest thermostats - Philips Hue doesn't work through cloud since it doesn't have to. Dropcams are usually a separate device which does not provide server capabilities per se - so require a box. - security services, garage door control, smart home - all of that is controllable directly, but I am not going to start on how much you will be overpaying for every of the devices for them to have a separate fully-functional IP stack that is easily connected to a (W)LAN (wi-fi, ethernet, bluetooth - all of that is either expensive, bulky or power-hungry). So a box/cloud is always a solution. - netflix - same points as Spotify. You don't pay them to manage your collection, you pay them to have access to a constantly curated list of newly available items. - skype, google hangouts, etc. - please do show everyone how to create a chat service that would allow me to chat with anyone I would like to without having to resort to a centralised storage of identities and at the same time solve the issue of spam.

zAy0LfpBZLC8mAC 9y ago
> - power/solar monitoring - you would need a server which would specifically handle the metric collection and make decisions upon this. Obviously cloud is cheaper than a separate box stationed in your house. Except there is already a box stationed in your house, otherwise no data collection. Whether you might want to be able to use cloud-provided storage for reliability reasons would be a separate issue (which (a) could be completely application agnostic and (b) could just as well use your home server if you preferred that). > Dropcams are usually a separate device which does not provide server capabilities per se - so require a box. Or adding "server capabilities", whatever that is. > but I am not going to start on how much you will be overpaying for every of the devices for them to have a separate fully-functional IP stack that is easily connected to a (W)LAN (wi-fi, ethernet, bluetooth - all of that is either expensive, bulky or power-hungry). So a box/cloud is always a solution. How exactly do any of those connect to "the cloud" without a "fully-functional IP stack"?