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Then the package manager is broken on your OS of choice, the package manager (or another related utility) should ensure whatever it updates or installs actually

Then the package manager is broken on your OS of choice, the package manager (or another related utility) should ensure whatever it updates or installs actually works.

dsr_ 9y ago
Please tell me about this method of writing bug-free software and building bug-free hardware that you have; I am very interested. Can you also detect whether a program will loop forever?
- still_grokking 9y ago
  > Can you also detect whether a program will loop forever? Assumed the current state of knowledge about our universe no program will loop forever. But maybe our universe is a kind of infinite loop by itself. Who knows.
- fooker 9y ago
  I have an oracle machine that I'd like to sell you! ;)
- nwmcsween 9y ago
  I know you're just being an ass but I'll entertain you. You write post-install scripts to ensure basic functionality.
- banku_brougham 9y ago
  Hey i wonder if such an app would be a great startup idea? The 'predict if program will terminate' one.
  - still_grokking 9y ago
    For a long time now many people are already working on this topic. This apps are called static program analyzers and some can prove totality of code.
tzs 9y ago
Suppose I use program foo as part of some enterprise application on a server. I am inadvertently relying on undocumented or undefined behavior of foo. An update to foo changes what happens in that undocumented or undefined case, and with the new behavior my application does not start correctly. There is nothing the package manager can do to ensure that this does not happen because there is nothing wrong with anything the package manager is managing. The bug is entirely in my code. All the update did was expose it. The question them is when will that now exposed bug actually get hit, so that I become aware of it and fix it. The purpose of the reboot is to make sure that exposure happens at a time when it will not cause much harm and I will not have a lot of trouble finding it.
- nwmcsween 9y ago
  You assess basic functionality, e.g install a httpd and before install the package manager spins it up on localhost and ensures it can http.

Then the package manager is broken on your OS of choice, the package manager (or another related utility) should ensure whatever it updates or installs actually works.

dsr_ 9y ago

Please tell me about this method of writing bug-free software and building bug-free hardware that you have; I am very interested. Can you also detect whether a program will loop forever?

still_grokking 9y ago
> Can you also detect whether a program will loop forever? Assumed the current state of knowledge about our universe no program will loop forever. But maybe our universe is a kind of infinite loop by itself. Who knows.
fooker 9y ago
I have an oracle machine that I'd like to sell you! ;)
nwmcsween 9y ago
I know you're just being an ass but I'll entertain you. You write post-install scripts to ensure basic functionality.
banku_brougham 9y ago
Hey i wonder if such an app would be a great startup idea? The 'predict if program will terminate' one.
- still_grokking 9y ago
  For a long time now many people are already working on this topic. This apps are called static program analyzers and some can prove totality of code.

tzs 9y ago

Suppose I use program foo as part of some enterprise application on a server. I am inadvertently relying on undocumented or undefined behavior of foo. An update to foo changes what happens in that undocumented or undefined case, and with the new behavior my application does not start correctly. There is nothing the package manager can do to ensure that this does not happen because there is nothing wrong with anything the package manager is managing. The bug is entirely in my code. All the update did was expose it. The question them is when will that now exposed bug actually get hit, so that I become aware of it and fix it. The purpose of the reboot is to make sure that exposure happens at a time when it will not cause much harm and I will not have a lot of trouble finding it.

nwmcsween 9y ago
You assess basic functionality, e.g install a httpd and before install the package manager spins it up on localhost and ensures it can http.