4 ms·

Don't believe everything you hear from talking heads on TV. We could put the earth into an ice age for under 1% of global GDP. Discussing geo-engineering is ge

by xiaoma 9y ago

Don't believe everything you hear from talking heads on TV. We could put the earth into an ice age for under 1% of global GDP. Discussing geo-engineering is generally seen as a moral hazard, though, so western commentators act like no such possibility exists. The real threat is ecosystem collapse.

vixen99 9y ago
"We could put ...". And your basis for that confident assertion?
- xiaoma 9y ago
  Honestly? It's from voracious reading over many years, and including both pop and more academic sources. Books almost always go deeper than what you'll find in video format. That said, if you try googling geo-engineering and climate change for a few minutes, you'll almost certainly find some of the techniques people have evaluated, their trade-offs and how the issue of moral hazard adds a cost to discussing them.
saiya-jin 9y ago
> Don't believe everything you hear from talking heads on TV. don't believe everything you read on some anonymous internet forums, especially some random wild claims with 0 solid data backup
Symmetry 9y ago
The only way to do it that cheap is with sulfate aerosols. We don't have the data to use the right amount yet but that's fixable. A larger problem is it would make ocean acidification even worse. That might end up being better than the alternative but its not a step to take casually.
- phreeza 9y ago
  What about marine cloud brightening? Wikipedia claims that could be done for a couple of billion $/year. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marine_cloud_brightening#Costs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marine_cloud_brightening#Costs
- xiaoma 9y ago
  Thus the moral hazard. If geo-engineering were a major point in climate change discussions, some would feel a false sense of security. Ultimately, this could increase the odds of such drastic measures would be needed. The other thing is that we just can't know how much acidity it would take to cause an ecosystem collapse until it's too late. That said, sulfate aerosols are one of the oldest proposed plans and our technology has advanced considerably since then. Perhaps some people working on or funding work on a better solution are on reading this thread. I sure hope someone is quietly tackling it because the political efforts around CO2 emmissions agreements of the past 50 years are not working very well despite a great deal of activism.
- marcosdumay 9y ago
  What are the news on ocean iron releases? It's something that does not cause acidification, and seems to be very easy to start or interrupt if a problem arises. It's also toward economical gains, as it can be done around ocean farming to increase yelds.
zaro 9y ago
Talking heads giving lectures on current state of climate in universities , taking really critical look at it. Maybe not the most optimistic crowd, though :) > We could put the earth into an ice age for under 1% of global GDP. Discussing geo-engineering is generally seen as a moral hazard, though, so western commentators act like no such possibility exists. Yes it exists, but taking this road is the same road that took is to the point where we are right now. I am not very certain it will help at all.

by xiaoma 9y ago

vixen99 9y ago

"We could put ...". And your basis for that confident assertion?

xiaoma 9y ago
Honestly? It's from voracious reading over many years, and including both pop and more academic sources. Books almost always go deeper than what you'll find in video format. That said, if you try googling geo-engineering and climate change for a few minutes, you'll almost certainly find some of the techniques people have evaluated, their trade-offs and how the issue of moral hazard adds a cost to discussing them.

saiya-jin 9y ago

> Don't believe everything you hear from talking heads on TV. don't believe everything you read on some anonymous internet forums, especially some random wild claims with 0 solid data backup

Symmetry 9y ago

The only way to do it that cheap is with sulfate aerosols. We don't have the data to use the right amount yet but that's fixable. A larger problem is it would make ocean acidification even worse. That might end up being better than the alternative but its not a step to take casually.

phreeza 9y ago
What about marine cloud brightening? Wikipedia claims that could be done for a couple of billion $/year. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marine_cloud_brightening#Costs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marine_cloud_brightening#Costs
xiaoma 9y ago
Thus the moral hazard. If geo-engineering were a major point in climate change discussions, some would feel a false sense of security. Ultimately, this could increase the odds of such drastic measures would be needed. The other thing is that we just can't know how much acidity it would take to cause an ecosystem collapse until it's too late. That said, sulfate aerosols are one of the oldest proposed plans and our technology has advanced considerably since then. Perhaps some people working on or funding work on a better solution are on reading this thread. I sure hope someone is quietly tackling it because the political efforts around CO2 emmissions agreements of the past 50 years are not working very well despite a great deal of activism.
marcosdumay 9y ago
What are the news on ocean iron releases? It's something that does not cause acidification, and seems to be very easy to start or interrupt if a problem arises. It's also toward economical gains, as it can be done around ocean farming to increase yelds.

zaro 9y ago

Talking heads giving lectures on current state of climate in universities , taking really critical look at it. Maybe not the most optimistic crowd, though :) > We could put the earth into an ice age for under 1% of global GDP. Discussing geo-engineering is generally seen as a moral hazard, though, so western commentators act like no such possibility exists. Yes it exists, but taking this road is the same road that took is to the point where we are right now. I am not very certain it will help at all.