5 ms·

Not judging you but it could just be that you might come across as """creepy""" (notice the three pairs of quotes here). The issue is that you're in a hyper sen

by zabana 9y ago

Not judging you but it could just be that you might come across as """creepy""" (notice the three pairs of quotes here). The issue is that you're in a hyper sensitive environment with hyper sensitive people. If you try and initiate a conversation with certain women (even to be polite because you dgaf about them) that dislike you, it can be considered """pushy""" and/or """creepy""" (even though there's no objective proof that you were trying to force their hand) but if you're the tall, confident, handsome guy from marketing then you're "such a player". So yeah, my advice to you is stay extremely professional for the remainder of your time there, try not to burn bridges with the company, stay courteous, work hard and most importantly find a job somewhere else. Also, learn about social dynamics. If you're socially awkward you'll be more at risk of being accused of rape (whatever its definition of the day is). Not to mention the increasing pressure that lies on HR and management as a result of the fear of being labeled the next Uber.

fjfkdjfjfjd 9y ago
Thanks for your commend and advice! Definitely looking forward to keeping my head low and seeing how much more I can accomplish in these next few months I have left. I believe I fall into the socially-awkward/inexperienced category. Are there any resources you could suggest to learn more about social dynamics?
- dajohnson89 9y ago
  Practice, practice, practice. But not on the female co-workers that you like.
  - zabana 9y ago
    yeah that. Also try and engage in social activites outside of work (could be charity or whatever you're into). The goal is that you get used to human interactions with low stakes and that you get out of your own head. For example, go to a gym and be a regular member there, you'll eventually get to know the staff and be more optimistic about speaking to others (not to mention the immense benefits on health / body image and the effects it has on your level of confidence). Talk to the ugly barista at starbucks (joke about how she's spelt your name wrong, after a while ask her how she's doing, then ask her name), smile more if you don't already. And just work your way up from there. Being a software engineer is actually a massive advantage in the social field because you have an analytical mind so you can develop the best judgement on what to do and calibrate your behaviour to others. If you share offices with other companies, talk to them during their break if they're having a quick smoke outside (that's what I used to do) eventually they'll start to invite you to bars and coffee shops and other events. You'll then expand your social circles, you'll go out more, speak to more women (attractive or not) and you'll soon realise that the sad person who accused you is actually not worth speaking to. (I was going to say something else, but I wanna keep my karma init </south london accent>)
    - fjfkdjfjfjd 9y ago
      I'm bookmarking your comment! Thanks for your advice! I definitely could use a gym membership. And when I meet such new people, I'll try to find conversation topics that would be very unlikely to be taken the wrong way (as I have now learned, It's better not to ask people about their weekend plans as this could be viewed as hitting on them).
      - ilikeeverything 9y ago
        Asking about weekend plans (or about the previous weekend) is a pretty standard office smalltalk in the UK, but I think it's considered quite intrusive in the US.. so also depends on where you are
- peoplewindow 9y ago
  Observe, watch. And be aware that these things aren't really fair or systematic. Like the guy says, exactly the same behaviour can be interpreted as creepy or giggle-inducing depending on whether the guy doing it is attractive, confident, successful etc. You sound like you're not confident and as you're an intern, you're not financially successful either. So the bar for you to be not """creepy""" to use ops phrasing is a sadly a lot higher. Frankly I'd suggest watching a lot of comedy shows and soaps. Your issue probably isn't anything you specifically did, it sounds like you just need to get better at small talk so attempts to be sociable come off as suitably casual. Women like guys who are relaxed, confident, funny and whose conversations are a little bit surprising (but in a good way). Nobody can teach you that with conventional methods but watching how well scripted characters do it on TV can help you get into the groove.
  - tom_mellior 9y ago
    > I'd suggest watching a lot of comedy shows and soaps Those (at least the ones I watch) are full of sexual innuendo. Not exactly the kind of humor you would want to "learn" if you come off as a creepy sexual predator.
hal9000xp 9y ago
You have described exact reason why I completely disrespect third-wave feminism, political correctness culture and other derivatives of left-wing politics.
- zabana 9y ago
  I hear that. I've had to deal with self centered / entitled people on numerous occasions and if I wasn't socially equipped to deal with that kind of BS, I honestly don't know where I'd be right now.
le-mark 9y ago
I've concluded over the years that I must give off some sort of creepy vibe at tmes. It's wierd, it seems to be situational or based on the other party, because it's only happens about 95% of the time. I've found that I just seem to make some women uncomfortable. Sometimes it's been justified, and I've learned what not to do, like sitting to close to a lab partner in college. But then other times, I'm still mystified to this day; like why was asking a co-worker if she was still running half marathons a reason for her to respond "how do you know that? why do you care?" in an an accusatory manner. I concluded, maybe I'm not the only wierd one, in that case. At the end of the day, you only control yourself. I figured out early on to concentrate on conducting myself in a professional manner, and keep small talk to a minimum. Work isn't for making friends. Friendships will arise, but I'm always very cautious at work.
- fjfkdjfjfjd 9y ago
  Well said! I will definitely keep the workplace for working especially during the rest of this internship.
- Inconel 9y ago
  I'm going to expand on your comment a bit with regards to the whole "creepiness" thing. I think it's very important to realize just how difficult it can sometimes be to manage professional and personal relationships. I think one of the ways we tend to learn social interaction is by observing others and emulating what we see. This doesn't always lead to good outcomes. I think most people like to imagine that rules, and I don't necessarily mean rules laid out by corporate HR, but social rules, are applied equally to everyone. I don't believe this to be the case at all. Social norms can be very subjectively applied based on the people interacting. I'll be perfectly blunt, there are a number of things about me(I'm short, skinny, not particularly attractive, definitely not smart, not exactly charismatic, a long list of other things I'm sure) that make me a rather low status person, at least if we are basing it on somewhat superficial standards. I've worked with people before who were all the things that I'm not, and had I emulated their behavior, I'm quite certain it would have come across as creepy or harassing rather fun-loving or joking. This doesn't mean that you should try to get away with as much as you can based on your perceived status, but instead that you should always be aware that very different rules may apply to you based on how others view you. It's not exactly fair, but there isn't really much that can be done aside from trying your best to be a good person. Also, for clarity that "you" wasn't you specifically, just a general "you".

by zabana 9y ago

fjfkdjfjfjd 9y ago

Thanks for your commend and advice! Definitely looking forward to keeping my head low and seeing how much more I can accomplish in these next few months I have left. I believe I fall into the socially-awkward/inexperienced category. Are there any resources you could suggest to learn more about social dynamics?

dajohnson89 9y ago
Practice, practice, practice. But not on the female co-workers that you like.
- zabana 9y ago
  yeah that. Also try and engage in social activites outside of work (could be charity or whatever you're into). The goal is that you get used to human interactions with low stakes and that you get out of your own head. For example, go to a gym and be a regular member there, you'll eventually get to know the staff and be more optimistic about speaking to others (not to mention the immense benefits on health / body image and the effects it has on your level of confidence). Talk to the ugly barista at starbucks (joke about how she's spelt your name wrong, after a while ask her how she's doing, then ask her name), smile more if you don't already. And just work your way up from there. Being a software engineer is actually a massive advantage in the social field because you have an analytical mind so you can develop the best judgement on what to do and calibrate your behaviour to others. If you share offices with other companies, talk to them during their break if they're having a quick smoke outside (that's what I used to do) eventually they'll start to invite you to bars and coffee shops and other events. You'll then expand your social circles, you'll go out more, speak to more women (attractive or not) and you'll soon realise that the sad person who accused you is actually not worth speaking to. (I was going to say something else, but I wanna keep my karma init </south london accent>)
  - fjfkdjfjfjd 9y ago
    I'm bookmarking your comment! Thanks for your advice! I definitely could use a gym membership. And when I meet such new people, I'll try to find conversation topics that would be very unlikely to be taken the wrong way (as I have now learned, It's better not to ask people about their weekend plans as this could be viewed as hitting on them).
    - ilikeeverything 9y ago
      Asking about weekend plans (or about the previous weekend) is a pretty standard office smalltalk in the UK, but I think it's considered quite intrusive in the US.. so also depends on where you are
peoplewindow 9y ago
Observe, watch. And be aware that these things aren't really fair or systematic. Like the guy says, exactly the same behaviour can be interpreted as creepy or giggle-inducing depending on whether the guy doing it is attractive, confident, successful etc. You sound like you're not confident and as you're an intern, you're not financially successful either. So the bar for you to be not """creepy""" to use ops phrasing is a sadly a lot higher. Frankly I'd suggest watching a lot of comedy shows and soaps. Your issue probably isn't anything you specifically did, it sounds like you just need to get better at small talk so attempts to be sociable come off as suitably casual. Women like guys who are relaxed, confident, funny and whose conversations are a little bit surprising (but in a good way). Nobody can teach you that with conventional methods but watching how well scripted characters do it on TV can help you get into the groove.
- tom_mellior 9y ago
  > I'd suggest watching a lot of comedy shows and soaps Those (at least the ones I watch) are full of sexual innuendo. Not exactly the kind of humor you would want to "learn" if you come off as a creepy sexual predator.

hal9000xp 9y ago

You have described exact reason why I completely disrespect third-wave feminism, political correctness culture and other derivatives of left-wing politics.

zabana 9y ago
I hear that. I've had to deal with self centered / entitled people on numerous occasions and if I wasn't socially equipped to deal with that kind of BS, I honestly don't know where I'd be right now.

le-mark 9y ago

I've concluded over the years that I must give off some sort of creepy vibe at tmes. It's wierd, it seems to be situational or based on the other party, because it's only happens about 95% of the time. I've found that I just seem to make some women uncomfortable. Sometimes it's been justified, and I've learned what not to do, like sitting to close to a lab partner in college. But then other times, I'm still mystified to this day; like why was asking a co-worker if she was still running half marathons a reason for her to respond "how do you know that? why do you care?" in an an accusatory manner. I concluded, maybe I'm not the only wierd one, in that case. At the end of the day, you only control yourself. I figured out early on to concentrate on conducting myself in a professional manner, and keep small talk to a minimum. Work isn't for making friends. Friendships will arise, but I'm always very cautious at work.

fjfkdjfjfjd 9y ago
Well said! I will definitely keep the workplace for working especially during the rest of this internship.
Inconel 9y ago
I'm going to expand on your comment a bit with regards to the whole "creepiness" thing. I think it's very important to realize just how difficult it can sometimes be to manage professional and personal relationships. I think one of the ways we tend to learn social interaction is by observing others and emulating what we see. This doesn't always lead to good outcomes. I think most people like to imagine that rules, and I don't necessarily mean rules laid out by corporate HR, but social rules, are applied equally to everyone. I don't believe this to be the case at all. Social norms can be very subjectively applied based on the people interacting. I'll be perfectly blunt, there are a number of things about me(I'm short, skinny, not particularly attractive, definitely not smart, not exactly charismatic, a long list of other things I'm sure) that make me a rather low status person, at least if we are basing it on somewhat superficial standards. I've worked with people before who were all the things that I'm not, and had I emulated their behavior, I'm quite certain it would have come across as creepy or harassing rather fun-loving or joking. This doesn't mean that you should try to get away with as much as you can based on your perceived status, but instead that you should always be aware that very different rules may apply to you based on how others view you. It's not exactly fair, but there isn't really much that can be done aside from trying your best to be a good person. Also, for clarity that "you" wasn't you specifically, just a general "you".