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"As the Americans learned so painfully in Earth's final century, free flow of information is the only safeguard against tyranny. The once-chained people whose l
by hd4 9y ago
"As the Americans learned so painfully in Earth's final century, free flow of information is the only safeguard against tyranny. The once-chained people whose leaders at last lose their grip on information flow will soon burst with freedom and vitality, but the free nation gradually constricting its grip on public discourse has begun its rapid slide into despotism. Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master" - Pravin Lal, Alpha Centauri.
The difference here being that the CCP don't only dream themselves the masters of the Chinese people.
- rm_-rf_slash 9y agoHistorically, China wants what is good for China, and the rest of the world may as well be a sideshow. If being a global leader and running global industries is what it takes for China to remain stable and controllable by the Comminist Party, then that's how they'll go. China simply does not have the consistent history of far-reaching imperialism that other historic empires like Britain or America have. There is also an absence of an enlightened ideology of imperialism, which the aforementioned British and American empires used to justify mass conquest and genocide. Compared to British/American conquests and subversion in East Asia, Latin America, the Middle East, and so on, the far out (from the rich coast/interior) Chinese provinces of Tibet and Xinjiang are practically in China's back yard.
- kazagistar 9y agoThis comment is unrelated to both the parent comment and the article. Wtf are you even on about?
- adventured 9y agoIt was an out-of-left-field effort to redirect the China criticism back on the US (and Britain).
- plehoux 9y agoImperialism is not rooted in history. Before having imperialist ambitions, Japan was an isolated island, same for Britain. One could also say Britain started from its own backyard. China could as well go from isolated to imperialist.
- fweespeech 9y ago> China simply does not have the consistent history of far-reaching imperialism that other historic empires like Britain or America have. There is also an absence of an enlightened ideology of imperialism, which the aforementioned British and American empires used to justify mass conquest and genocide. China invaded its neighbors on multiple occasions. It was the failure of its imperial ambitions that resulted in it turning inward. Or does the likes of Korea and such simply not count in your mind? China also became "China" after invading neighboring kingdoms. China simply was never in a position to expand substantially beyond its current borders due to technological limitations and the superiority of its neighbors' military. Pretending it is some virtuous position is categorically false and you can see that in the way they look the other way when working with African dictators, etc. and making all the "moral compromises" the American Empire has.
- smilekzs 9y ago> China also became "China" after invading neighboring kingdoms. More like what has always been considered "China" got taken over by the Kidan, then the Monguls, then the Manchus, each time forcefully, but then slowly emerging as a "More Unified China", rinse and repeat.
- fweespeech 9y ago> More like what has always been considered "China" got taken over by the Kidan, then the Monguls, then the Manchus, each time forcefully, but then slowly emerging as a "More Unified China", rinse and repeat. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warring_States_period https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warring_States_period > The Warring States period (Chinese: 戰國時代; pinyin: Zhànguó shídài) was an era in ancient Chinese history following the Spring and Autumn period and concluding with the Qin wars of conquest that saw the annexation of all other contender states, which ultimately led to the Qin state's victory in 221 BC as the first unified Chinese empire known as the Qin dynasty. What historical event created the first unified Chinese empire in your alternate view of world history?
- thaumasiotes 9y ago
- saiya-jin 9y agoyou are so wrong, mister. maybe you're from china and got fed only by state media and this is the effect? Chinese are not the biggest aggressors of all times, true, but their invasion of sovereign Tibet country and their brutal behavior there is good enough warning. Or invasion & annexation of pars of India in 1962 started by Chinese (because India dared to offer asylum to dalailama, how horrible). Chinese party leaders are same as Russian oligarchs, they just have to be more discrete. Life and well being of common citizens is of no concern for them, only money and power and games associated with those. Thinking otherwise (about any system in fact) is naive on child level.
- Nomentatus 9y agoEverybody was already Han and Han-dominated thousands of years ago? Really? Tibet was never invaded in the fifties? Cool! There never was an attempted invasion of Japan, foiled by disastrous weather? Wow. This is a whole alternative reality. Fact is, China's history is very similar to everyone else's history.
- thaumasiotes 9y agoThere was never an attempted invasion of Japan by the Han. Nor was there an invasion of Tibet. Tibet, and Xinjiang, were invaded by the Manchus (who ruled China as the Qing dynasty at the same time they ruled several other jurisdictions under different names. Everything was later relabeled "China" as essentially an accounting gimmick). Japan was invaded by the Mongols (who, similarly, ruled China as the Yuan dynasty). Han aggression has been pretty much limited to Vietnam (and ineffective there). Blaming China for the invasion of Tibet is slightly less ridiculous than blaming Nazi-occupied France for the invasion of Poland.
- kgwgk 9y agoI don't get the last analogy. Blaming Nazi-occupied France for the invasion of Poland in September 1939 is quite ridiculous, given that France was occupied in June 1940. I don't know much about the China/Nepal case, but a quick google search got me https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Chamdo https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Chamdo
- thaumasiotes 9y agoYes, the chronology of that analogy is wrong, which is why I said that claim would be slightly more ridiculous. But the agency part of it is correct. The Manchus had no more interest in Chinese opinions of what they should and shouldn't attack than the Germans had in French opinions.
- kgwgk 9y agoDid the Manchus invaded Tibet in 1950?
- justicezyx 9y ago> free flow of information is the only safeguard against tyranny More important is the enlightened citizens. You can name all sorts of intelligent ways to be the only safeguard against tyranny. In the end of day, if you are less intelligent and knowledgeable than the privileged few, no matter what you do, you'll be managed.
- hd4 9y ago>intelligent and knowledgeable than the privileged few the only way to become intelligent and knowledgeable is to have free and easy access to information.
- mperham 9y ago> is to have free and easy access to __accurate__ information. As we've learned recently, politicized or partisan info ("fake news") can flood and disrupt our decision-making.
- LiweiZ 9y agoBut the GP's comment is still valid since that's the foundation of everything to build upon. Or things will go way worse.
- cinquemb 9y agoIf history is any example, it often takes things getting way worse in order to even build a foundation for better things to come.
- LiweiZ 9y agoRight, but you only mentioned half of the story. Eventually, the foundation is something you simply have to have for all wanted things above it. The way worse is a potential part of the process, not the final outcome. So it seems we all agree on what is the foundation that can not be ignored here;)
- rjzzleep 9y agoWell, Germany just now massively expanded their surveillance laws. The ones that did do that were the "socialist party" and "democratic union" http://www.zdnet.com/article/police-get-broad-phone-and-computer-hacking-powers-in-germany/ http://www.zdnet.com/article/police-get-broad-phone-and-comp...