6 ms·

Does anyone have any insight into working at Zenefits at the current moment? I'm about to interview with them for a data position.

ben174 9y ago
Just left there after a year. I had a great time and built some very fun stuff. Alcohol-free office is a bit of a bummer, but there's a nice little joint downstairs you can buy an overpriced beer.
- tdb7893 9y ago
  Are most offices not alcohol-free?
  - phamilton 9y ago
    In SF? Zenefits wasn't alone in crazy alcohol shenanigans. Most offices have a decently stocked supply of alcohol.
    - Inconel 9y ago
      I work in aerospace and we have a ton of machinery around that can cause serious injuries so this kind of environment would never work here, but what's the attraction of a workplace that allows alcohol? Don't get me wrong, I like the occasional drink, and maybe I'm just a lightweight, but I imagine my work productivity/reliability would tank after even a few beers. Hell, I don't even drink coffee on work days, even though I quite enjoy the taste, because I feel like it makes me too jittery. Now I will admit that I'm a technician so I work with my hands but is coding/programming more immune to this kind of thing? Also, from my experience alcohol seems like one of the best guaranteed ways to get people to act in ways they normally wouldn't. I certainly act more relaxed, maybe even unprofessional or crude, after I've had a few drinks. Which is of course why I don't drink in a professional setting. After all the things I've read about toxic work environments at places like Uber, if I was running a company, the last thing I would want is my employees drinking at work. I want to make clear I've never worked in an environment that allowed drinking, certainly not one that had employee areas stocked with alcohol, so I'm not judging here, I'm just trying to figure out the attraction. And how companies that allow or support it mitigate the potential negative effects.
      - timr 9y ago
        It's something that started as a sign that "we're cool and edgy and different", and gradually become a cultural shibboleth for startup people. Having worked at dry offices, offices that had alcohol available at all times, and ones that did weekly TGIFs or whatever, I can't say I favor the trend. Invariably, it becomes a problem, and then people start moaning about how the culture is changing because the alcohol is disappearing. It's also alienating for a lot of otherwise good people (some people are alcoholics!) It's a workplace, not a frat house. If you need a drink, finish your work, and go out and enjoy your life. But then, I feel the same way about office meals (I'd prefer you just paid me a higher salary, and I'll buy my own food, thanks), so I'm not a "team player".
        hkmurakami 9y ago
        It's a reflection of the workplace as an extension of the frat house environment that many workers at these places cherished. So if you enjoyed that kind of college environment (recall that the average age of such places tend to be very young), then such a company will feel natural.
        timr 9y ago
        Yes, I believe that there's an element of implicit bias to it. It's one of those murky things that gets bundled up with "culture fit" as spurious reasons to reject candidates who don't look and act like you do. Hence the "shibboleth" comment. It's a complicated question. What's innocent, non-coercive fun for a small group of responsible people can get wildly out of control with one bad hire. And we don't do interviews for "angry drunk"....
        deathanatos 9y ago
        > It's a workplace, not a frat house. If you need a drink, finish your work, and go out and enjoy your life. They're not mutually exclusive. My office has alcohol, but people only tend to drink around or after 5, and typically quietly at their desk while working on something. Occasionally there will be a few people having a conversation in the kitchen over beers in the late afternoon. I wouldn't describe it as a frat house though, and I think if you need to use that to describe an office, that's your problem; the alcohol is just a symptom. I'd be okay with removing the alcohol if my employer also stopped driving me to drink[1]. [1]: https://www.stilldrinking.org/programming-sucks https://www.stilldrinking.org/programming-sucks
    - bactrian 9y ago
      But you spark up one marijuana cigarette on the patio and everyone loses their shit...
  - acchow 9y ago
    Alcohol is rampant in offices throughout the bay area. Especially in smaller companies.
    - tintor 9y ago
      Drop "smaller". It is cleaner.
    - jongledongle 9y ago
      But you spark up one marijuana cigarette on the patio and everyone loses their minds.
      - RickS 9y ago
        Anecdotally, that's not accurate. The bay area companies with an outsized interest in drinking are typically pot friendly. Though with both, it's not cool to be intoxicated during real work.
      - acchow 9y ago
        Where?
  - deleted 9y ago
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  - deleted 9y ago
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- zitterbewegung 9y ago
  To be honest I wish I could find a listing of alcohol free offices and offices that don't have a drinking culture. I can't drink and being dragged to the bar which usually has overpriced and or tasteless food is a real pain for the cost of socialization.
  - potatolicious 9y ago
    Ditto, I moved from startup-landia to Google about 2 years ago and have really enjoyed the decreased focus on alcohol. Alcohol isn't banned, but the company in general does not pay for booze in the office outside of company events, so there aren't fridges or kegerators free-flowing with booze, unlike most of the startups I've worked at before. Some teams keep celebratory stashes that they pay for themselves, which IMO strikes a good balance between letting people drink but discouraging a heavily alcohol-focused work culture. I didn't find startup drinking culture tiresome until I left it, and I'm glad I did.
    - gogopuppygogo 9y ago
      I really liked the drinking culture in my early to mid 20's but by my late 20's I got a stomach condition that put an end to that. Now I am in my early 30's I have lost any inclination to even want to partake. There are many things I now enjoy more being sober. I've never been more productive and my mind has never been so clear.
      - mrisoli 9y ago
        I miss it now(mid 20's I guess), I used to work at a company with a big drinking culture and I made a big social circle around that, then I moved to a different country where I don't know anyone outside the office and the lack of this type of activities make it much harder for me to socialize, I feel very lonely sometimes.
  - ben174 9y ago
    I totally get this. I have many non-drinking coworkers and I always see a little pain in their eyes when the team suggests we go out and grab drinks.
- Pxtl 9y ago
  Seriously, is that a thing? Not drinking in the office is an aberration in California? Because I'm in Ontario and if I was drinking at the office I'd probably get sent home for the day and have a nice talking to on the next one.

ben174 9y ago

Just left there after a year. I had a great time and built some very fun stuff. Alcohol-free office is a bit of a bummer, but there's a nice little joint downstairs you can buy an overpriced beer.

tdb7893 9y ago
Are most offices not alcohol-free?
- phamilton 9y ago
  In SF? Zenefits wasn't alone in crazy alcohol shenanigans. Most offices have a decently stocked supply of alcohol.
  - Inconel 9y ago
    I work in aerospace and we have a ton of machinery around that can cause serious injuries so this kind of environment would never work here, but what's the attraction of a workplace that allows alcohol? Don't get me wrong, I like the occasional drink, and maybe I'm just a lightweight, but I imagine my work productivity/reliability would tank after even a few beers. Hell, I don't even drink coffee on work days, even though I quite enjoy the taste, because I feel like it makes me too jittery. Now I will admit that I'm a technician so I work with my hands but is coding/programming more immune to this kind of thing? Also, from my experience alcohol seems like one of the best guaranteed ways to get people to act in ways they normally wouldn't. I certainly act more relaxed, maybe even unprofessional or crude, after I've had a few drinks. Which is of course why I don't drink in a professional setting. After all the things I've read about toxic work environments at places like Uber, if I was running a company, the last thing I would want is my employees drinking at work. I want to make clear I've never worked in an environment that allowed drinking, certainly not one that had employee areas stocked with alcohol, so I'm not judging here, I'm just trying to figure out the attraction. And how companies that allow or support it mitigate the potential negative effects.
    - timr 9y ago
      It's something that started as a sign that "we're cool and edgy and different", and gradually become a cultural shibboleth for startup people. Having worked at dry offices, offices that had alcohol available at all times, and ones that did weekly TGIFs or whatever, I can't say I favor the trend. Invariably, it becomes a problem, and then people start moaning about how the culture is changing because the alcohol is disappearing. It's also alienating for a lot of otherwise good people (some people are alcoholics!) It's a workplace, not a frat house. If you need a drink, finish your work, and go out and enjoy your life. But then, I feel the same way about office meals (I'd prefer you just paid me a higher salary, and I'll buy my own food, thanks), so I'm not a "team player".
      - hkmurakami 9y ago
        It's a reflection of the workplace as an extension of the frat house environment that many workers at these places cherished. So if you enjoyed that kind of college environment (recall that the average age of such places tend to be very young), then such a company will feel natural.
        timr 9y ago
        Yes, I believe that there's an element of implicit bias to it. It's one of those murky things that gets bundled up with "culture fit" as spurious reasons to reject candidates who don't look and act like you do. Hence the "shibboleth" comment. It's a complicated question. What's innocent, non-coercive fun for a small group of responsible people can get wildly out of control with one bad hire. And we don't do interviews for "angry drunk"....
      - deathanatos 9y ago
        > It's a workplace, not a frat house. If you need a drink, finish your work, and go out and enjoy your life. They're not mutually exclusive. My office has alcohol, but people only tend to drink around or after 5, and typically quietly at their desk while working on something. Occasionally there will be a few people having a conversation in the kitchen over beers in the late afternoon. I wouldn't describe it as a frat house though, and I think if you need to use that to describe an office, that's your problem; the alcohol is just a symptom. I'd be okay with removing the alcohol if my employer also stopped driving me to drink[1]. [1]: https://www.stilldrinking.org/programming-sucks https://www.stilldrinking.org/programming-sucks
  - bactrian 9y ago
    But you spark up one marijuana cigarette on the patio and everyone loses their shit...
- acchow 9y ago
  Alcohol is rampant in offices throughout the bay area. Especially in smaller companies.
  - tintor 9y ago
    Drop "smaller". It is cleaner.
  - jongledongle 9y ago
    But you spark up one marijuana cigarette on the patio and everyone loses their minds.
    - RickS 9y ago
      Anecdotally, that's not accurate. The bay area companies with an outsized interest in drinking are typically pot friendly. Though with both, it's not cool to be intoxicated during real work.
    - acchow 9y ago
      Where?
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
zitterbewegung 9y ago
To be honest I wish I could find a listing of alcohol free offices and offices that don't have a drinking culture. I can't drink and being dragged to the bar which usually has overpriced and or tasteless food is a real pain for the cost of socialization.
- potatolicious 9y ago
  Ditto, I moved from startup-landia to Google about 2 years ago and have really enjoyed the decreased focus on alcohol. Alcohol isn't banned, but the company in general does not pay for booze in the office outside of company events, so there aren't fridges or kegerators free-flowing with booze, unlike most of the startups I've worked at before. Some teams keep celebratory stashes that they pay for themselves, which IMO strikes a good balance between letting people drink but discouraging a heavily alcohol-focused work culture. I didn't find startup drinking culture tiresome until I left it, and I'm glad I did.
  - gogopuppygogo 9y ago
    I really liked the drinking culture in my early to mid 20's but by my late 20's I got a stomach condition that put an end to that. Now I am in my early 30's I have lost any inclination to even want to partake. There are many things I now enjoy more being sober. I've never been more productive and my mind has never been so clear.
    - mrisoli 9y ago
      I miss it now(mid 20's I guess), I used to work at a company with a big drinking culture and I made a big social circle around that, then I moved to a different country where I don't know anyone outside the office and the lack of this type of activities make it much harder for me to socialize, I feel very lonely sometimes.
- ben174 9y ago
  I totally get this. I have many non-drinking coworkers and I always see a little pain in their eyes when the team suggests we go out and grab drinks.
Pxtl 9y ago
Seriously, is that a thing? Not drinking in the office is an aberration in California? Because I'm in Ontario and if I was drinking at the office I'd probably get sent home for the day and have a nice talking to on the next one.