3 ms·

I kinda think what literature enthusiasts really enjoy are simply words and the creative use of language and so on. There could be some interesting ideas in th

I kinda think what literature enthusiasts really enjoy are simply words and the creative use of language and so on. There could be some interesting ideas in there too, but that is not the main meat of literature. I think its important for the sake of intellectual rigour not to confuse the two.

arca_vorago 9y ago
I don't understand what that has to do with this very article and the meaty ideas it does indeed contain. I for one disagree with this ivory tower view of literature. Words and ideas therein contain power, and have, however "creative", changed the course of history by their influence of mankind.
ashark 9y ago
There are a lot of things that need to come together for great literature to happen. Qualities of the author's use of language are some of them, but not all. It is true that if a piece's language is poor, or simply unremarkable, it's probably not going to gain many fans from the lit crowd. If there's nothing going on but good/interesting language, though, that's also not going to get it much lasting interest, typically. I'd say expression coupled with insight and excellent taste is the sweet spot for the really good stuff. Putting together a great novel, say, is a lot more than knowing how to make yer words purty and fancy. It's also more than just telling a well-structured story. It's more than lifelike characters. It's more than prompting sharp and lasting emotions on the reader. It's more than atmosphere. Than having the confidence to let an amazing, beautiful idea slip by like a passing stranger's hint of perfume in a crowd. More than honesty. And so on. It's all of those things, continuously, for a few hundred pages. [EDIT] though I'm not defending this letter as any kind of top-notch literature (is it supposed to be?). The parts I've read so far seem obviously too thin to qualify.
- timr 9y ago
  "I'd say expression coupled with insight and excellent taste is the sweet spot for the really good stuff. Putting together a great novel, say, is a lot more than knowing how to make yer words purty and fancy." Yes. It's fashionable right now to be florid, but writers like Hemingway can punch you in the gut using simple, declarative sentences: "This book contains material from the remises of my memory and of my heart. Even if the one has been tampered with and the other does not exist."
  - crooked-v 9y ago
    I'm reminded of the distinctly short and punchy urban myth attributed to Hemingway: > For sale: baby shoes, never worn.
jfoutz 9y ago
The language needs to support the idea in the story. To kill a mockingbird has a southern folksy feel that draws you in. Hemingway couldn't write that story. It would be something very different. Harper Lee couldn't make you feel sympathetic to a pedophile. It's a whole jigsaw puzzle. the ideas, the story, and the words all fit together to make something extraordinary.
greenwhite 9y ago
I mean, that's just wrong lol. Obviously that's apart of it, but to imply that it's not so much about ideas is profoundly wrong. In my opinion, anyway.
draw_down 9y ago
Really? :/

arca_vorago 9y ago

I don't understand what that has to do with this very article and the meaty ideas it does indeed contain. I for one disagree with this ivory tower view of literature. Words and ideas therein contain power, and have, however "creative", changed the course of history by their influence of mankind.

ashark 9y ago

There are a lot of things that need to come together for great literature to happen. Qualities of the author's use of language are some of them, but not all. It is true that if a piece's language is poor, or simply unremarkable, it's probably not going to gain many fans from the lit crowd. If there's nothing going on but good/interesting language, though, that's also not going to get it much lasting interest, typically. I'd say expression coupled with insight and excellent taste is the sweet spot for the really good stuff. Putting together a great novel, say, is a lot more than knowing how to make yer words purty and fancy. It's also more than just telling a well-structured story. It's more than lifelike characters. It's more than prompting sharp and lasting emotions on the reader. It's more than atmosphere. Than having the confidence to let an amazing, beautiful idea slip by like a passing stranger's hint of perfume in a crowd. More than honesty. And so on. It's all of those things, continuously, for a few hundred pages. [EDIT] though I'm not defending this letter as any kind of top-notch literature (is it supposed to be?). The parts I've read so far seem obviously too thin to qualify.

timr 9y ago
"I'd say expression coupled with insight and excellent taste is the sweet spot for the really good stuff. Putting together a great novel, say, is a lot more than knowing how to make yer words purty and fancy." Yes. It's fashionable right now to be florid, but writers like Hemingway can punch you in the gut using simple, declarative sentences: "This book contains material from the remises of my memory and of my heart. Even if the one has been tampered with and the other does not exist."
- crooked-v 9y ago
  I'm reminded of the distinctly short and punchy urban myth attributed to Hemingway: > For sale: baby shoes, never worn.

jfoutz 9y ago

The language needs to support the idea in the story. To kill a mockingbird has a southern folksy feel that draws you in. Hemingway couldn't write that story. It would be something very different. Harper Lee couldn't make you feel sympathetic to a pedophile. It's a whole jigsaw puzzle. the ideas, the story, and the words all fit together to make something extraordinary.

greenwhite 9y ago

I mean, that's just wrong lol. Obviously that's apart of it, but to imply that it's not so much about ideas is profoundly wrong. In my opinion, anyway.

draw_down 9y ago

Really? :/