8 ms·

The European Union is often made fun of with "the Americans innovate, the EU regulates", but in the meantime GDPR[1] is coming into force in 2018 > The primary

by vmarsy 9y ago

The European Union is often made fun of with "the Americans innovate, the EU regulates", but in the meantime GDPR[1] is coming into force in 2018 > The primary objectives of the GDPR are to give citizens and residents back control of their personal data [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Data_Protection_Regulation https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Data_Protection_Regu...

akavel 9y ago
I've read the Wikipedia summary, and it appears to me, that GDPR only requires encryption, not anonymisation, of personal data! Or did I miss something?
- nsebban 9y ago
  It also requires trivial opt-out and readability of the opt-ins. And it gives enough power to really control what companies are doing with people's data. And the fines are huge (up to 3% of the company's global gross amount) compared to what exists today.
  - amelius 9y ago
    Can users still be manipulated to opt-in to a service X if they want a service Y badly enough? I.e., you can only use Y if you also take X? How many people would opt-out of (or not opt-in to) a service like Google search?
    - bonzini 9y ago
      There are some things that must have a separate opt-in from the bare minimum that's necessary to provide the service. Typically, there are three bullets on European privacy forms: handling personal data to provide the service, handling personal data for commercial and advertising purposes, sharing personal data with third parties (usually for commercial and advertising purposes). Pre-printed forms can only have the first ticked to yes, the other two must be filled in by the customer.
      - tskaiser 9y ago
        But can ticking those boxes be mandatory for using a service? ie. "if you don't tick all three boxes you won't have access to Google Search"?
        bonzini 9y ago
        No. Anything not strictly necessary must be opt-in. See also: https://www.google.it/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/technology/2017/jan/10/whatsapp-facebook-google-privacy-rules-ec-european-directive https://www.google.it/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/technology/2...
  - kevsim 9y ago
    Think it's actually 4%. Seriously huge fines
    - cobbzilla 9y ago
      Just wait to see how the lawyers game these. my bet is no major corp ever pays a penalty that high, ever. there may be some egregious offender that gets caught with this, but not one of the big boys.
      - ddalex 9y ago
        If I'm in debt to somebody 10.000, he owns me. If I'm in debt 10.000.000, I own him. Huge fines for behemoths will always be negotiated. Nevertheless, it's a strong incentive for even the biggest companies to follow the law. EU has the capability and desire to enforce huge fines to make sure data protection laws are obeyed.
      - dx034 9y ago
        Fines in antitrust cases can already be huge so I would doubt that those fines could be gamed if regulators take it seriously. The alternative to paying a fine is being banned from the market, which for the EU is a big deal.
      - ddalex 9y ago
        If I'm in debt to somebody 10.000, he owns me. If I'm in debt 10.000.000, I own him. Huge fines for behemoths will always be negotiated. Nevertheless, it's a strong incentive for even the biggest companies to follow the law. EU has the capability and desire to enforce huge fines to make sure data protection laws are obeyed.
      - Freak_NL 9y ago
        They actually do get fined huge sums, and they do pay up. To them it is just the cost of doing business. Facebook getting fined for privacy violations: http://www.bbc.com/news/business-39958630 http://www.bbc.com/news/business-39958630
    - rama_dan 9y ago
hueving 9y ago
Doesn't this fall squarely into "the Americans innovate, the EU regulates"? Whether that saying is derogatory or not obviously depends on your point of view, but this new regulation isn't contradictory to the saying.
- omginternets 9y ago
  The point was that it's usually said in a derogatory fashion, insinuating that European innovation suffers as a result of this.
  - LamaOfRuin 9y ago
    Those also aren't strictly tied together. I absolutely believe that EU's internet regulations make it less desirable to start interesting new internet companies there. In many cases, I would also gladly trade that for the benefits of being an individual living under such a system.
    - omginternets 9y ago
      Indeed, but again the point is that it's usually said, so as to imply that the EU suffers from these policies. Whether or not that's actually the case is a different question. To your point, it's a much less cut-and-dry question as well.

by vmarsy 9y ago

akavel 9y ago

I've read the Wikipedia summary, and it appears to me, that GDPR only requires encryption, not anonymisation, of personal data! Or did I miss something?

nsebban 9y ago
It also requires trivial opt-out and readability of the opt-ins. And it gives enough power to really control what companies are doing with people's data. And the fines are huge (up to 3% of the company's global gross amount) compared to what exists today.
- amelius 9y ago
  Can users still be manipulated to opt-in to a service X if they want a service Y badly enough? I.e., you can only use Y if you also take X? How many people would opt-out of (or not opt-in to) a service like Google search?
  - bonzini 9y ago
    There are some things that must have a separate opt-in from the bare minimum that's necessary to provide the service. Typically, there are three bullets on European privacy forms: handling personal data to provide the service, handling personal data for commercial and advertising purposes, sharing personal data with third parties (usually for commercial and advertising purposes). Pre-printed forms can only have the first ticked to yes, the other two must be filled in by the customer.
    - tskaiser 9y ago
      But can ticking those boxes be mandatory for using a service? ie. "if you don't tick all three boxes you won't have access to Google Search"?
      - bonzini 9y ago
        No. Anything not strictly necessary must be opt-in. See also: https://www.google.it/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/technology/2017/jan/10/whatsapp-facebook-google-privacy-rules-ec-european-directive https://www.google.it/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/technology/2...
- kevsim 9y ago
  Think it's actually 4%. Seriously huge fines
  - cobbzilla 9y ago
    Just wait to see how the lawyers game these. my bet is no major corp ever pays a penalty that high, ever. there may be some egregious offender that gets caught with this, but not one of the big boys.
    - ddalex 9y ago
      If I'm in debt to somebody 10.000, he owns me. If I'm in debt 10.000.000, I own him. Huge fines for behemoths will always be negotiated. Nevertheless, it's a strong incentive for even the biggest companies to follow the law. EU has the capability and desire to enforce huge fines to make sure data protection laws are obeyed.
    - dx034 9y ago
      Fines in antitrust cases can already be huge so I would doubt that those fines could be gamed if regulators take it seriously. The alternative to paying a fine is being banned from the market, which for the EU is a big deal.
    - ddalex 9y ago
      If I'm in debt to somebody 10.000, he owns me. If I'm in debt 10.000.000, I own him. Huge fines for behemoths will always be negotiated. Nevertheless, it's a strong incentive for even the biggest companies to follow the law. EU has the capability and desire to enforce huge fines to make sure data protection laws are obeyed.
    - Freak_NL 9y ago
      They actually do get fined huge sums, and they do pay up. To them it is just the cost of doing business. Facebook getting fined for privacy violations: http://www.bbc.com/news/business-39958630 http://www.bbc.com/news/business-39958630
  - rama_dan 9y ago

hueving 9y ago

Doesn't this fall squarely into "the Americans innovate, the EU regulates"? Whether that saying is derogatory or not obviously depends on your point of view, but this new regulation isn't contradictory to the saying.

omginternets 9y ago
The point was that it's usually said in a derogatory fashion, insinuating that European innovation suffers as a result of this.
- LamaOfRuin 9y ago
  Those also aren't strictly tied together. I absolutely believe that EU's internet regulations make it less desirable to start interesting new internet companies there. In many cases, I would also gladly trade that for the benefits of being an individual living under such a system.
  - omginternets 9y ago
    Indeed, but again the point is that it's usually said, so as to imply that the EU suffers from these policies. Whether or not that's actually the case is a different question. To your point, it's a much less cut-and-dry question as well.