4 ms·

I'm no fan of Uber, but if there are LEOs trying to use your product fraudulently (e.g. fake data, ordering an Uber not for a ride but to impound cars), doesn't

by sushid 10y ago

I'm no fan of Uber, but if there are LEOs trying to use your product fraudulently (e.g. fake data, ordering an Uber not for a ride but to impound cars), doesn't it make sense to try and stop this sort of operation? If you had LEOs peering into your office windows (legal, but undesirable), wouldn't you want to at least have a blind to try and stop them from peeking?

pvg 10y ago
ordering an Uber not for a ride but to impound cars Enforcement is not 'fraudulent use'. These analogies are very strained while the thing that took place is very simple.
princeb 10y ago
no, doesn't really make sense. that'll be like arthur andersen shredding enron's financial accounts. can't investigate if there's nothing to investigate!
dragonwriter 10y ago
> I'm no fan of Uber, but if there are LEOs trying to use your product fraudulently (e.g. fake data, ordering an Uber not for a ride but to impound cars), doesn't it make sense to try and stop this sort of operation? If it's actually fraudulent, then, yes, you should stop it by suing and getting an injunction against the illegal government action. If it's just enforcing the law that you are breaking, maybe you should quit breaking the law rather than engaging in elaborate technical means to conceal the violation, and expecting that won't cause additional problems when it is discovered.
johncolanduoni 10y ago
A blind != a hologram projecting a false image while you do something illegal inside.
- MichaelGG 10y ago
  But even that would be OK wouldn't it? Writing "Flour" on a bag before putting contraband powder in it shouldn't be illegal.
  - npizzolato 10y ago
    If you do that with the intention of passing through a checkpoint to hide your contraband, why shouldn't that be a crime?
    - Dylan16807 10y ago
      Why should a bag of drugs labeled "drugs" be less illegal than a bag of drugs labeled "not drugs"? The labeling can serve as evidence toward the smuggling case without needing to be its own crime.
pyre 10y ago
> use your product fraudulently If a LEO lies to you during the course of an investigation, do you think that you will be able to successfully claim that as fraud?
JustSomeNobody 10y ago
If you have committed a crime and they are peering into the windows to see if you are still committing the crime, putting up blinds with the intent to block their view would be obstruction and you'd now be committing another crime.

by sushid 10y ago

pvg 10y ago

ordering an Uber not for a ride but to impound cars Enforcement is not 'fraudulent use'. These analogies are very strained while the thing that took place is very simple.

princeb 10y ago

no, doesn't really make sense. that'll be like arthur andersen shredding enron's financial accounts. can't investigate if there's nothing to investigate!

dragonwriter 10y ago

> I'm no fan of Uber, but if there are LEOs trying to use your product fraudulently (e.g. fake data, ordering an Uber not for a ride but to impound cars), doesn't it make sense to try and stop this sort of operation? If it's actually fraudulent, then, yes, you should stop it by suing and getting an injunction against the illegal government action. If it's just enforcing the law that you are breaking, maybe you should quit breaking the law rather than engaging in elaborate technical means to conceal the violation, and expecting that won't cause additional problems when it is discovered.

johncolanduoni 10y ago

A blind != a hologram projecting a false image while you do something illegal inside.

MichaelGG 10y ago
But even that would be OK wouldn't it? Writing "Flour" on a bag before putting contraband powder in it shouldn't be illegal.
- npizzolato 10y ago
  If you do that with the intention of passing through a checkpoint to hide your contraband, why shouldn't that be a crime?
  - Dylan16807 10y ago
    Why should a bag of drugs labeled "drugs" be less illegal than a bag of drugs labeled "not drugs"? The labeling can serve as evidence toward the smuggling case without needing to be its own crime.

pyre 10y ago

> use your product fraudulently If a LEO lies to you during the course of an investigation, do you think that you will be able to successfully claim that as fraud?

JustSomeNobody 10y ago

If you have committed a crime and they are peering into the windows to see if you are still committing the crime, putting up blinds with the intent to block their view would be obstruction and you'd now be committing another crime.