5 ms·

Sydney’s solar-powered e-paper traffic signs report zero failures since 2013

173 points by Ursa83 9y ago

rprevolsek 9y ago
Are there any calculations made regarding life expectancy in comparison to LCD technologies?
- Ursa83 9y ago
  Hi, Ursa from Visionect here, the company powering the Sydney traffic signs. To answer your question: electronic paper technology is 99% more power efficient than LCD (uses energy only when changing content). In many applications, it can also prove to be as much as four times more reliable than LCD.
  - askvictor 9y ago
    This doesn't actually answer the question of lifespan.
    - agumonkey 9y ago
      At least you can use all the money saved from electricity to pay for replacement .. hum
  - JeremyCa 9y ago
    Love the 500..
  - dragonmum 9y ago
    > Hi, Ursa from Visionect here, the company powering the Sydney traffic signs. You're also the poster of the article which is an ad from your company. > In many applications, it can also prove to be as much as four times more reliable than LCD. That's a really vague answer. Are you saying your solar powered road side display panels are 4 times more reliable than the LCD panels used with everything else? Could you share some data with us?
    - luka-birsa 9y ago
      Life expectancy of LCD/LEDs depends greatly on the type (consumer would die fairly quickly in outdoor scenarios) and I'm sure one could build an LCD/LED display that will last 4 years outdoors. It's hard to deploy such LCD/LED sign (you require power and lots of it to be visible in sunlight) but it's possible. The important thing here is that this first production outdoor deployment of EPD signs in the world works for for years without any serious problems which confirms that e-paper is a viable technology for outdoor deployments. There was a lot of skepticism back in 2013 if this is at all possible.
      - deleted 9y ago
        [deleted]
      - dragonmum 9y ago
        > It's hard to deploy such LCD/LED sign (you require power and lots of it to be visible in sunlight) but it's possible. What? Most of the signboards you see on the road are LED signboards. You know the ones we have in freezing winter or in blazing summer! So not only is it possible, it's what's commonly done. > The important thing here is that this first production outdoor deployment There's very little data provided in the article, no real accurate data on what kind of environmental conditions were experienced by the devices. Seems like a puff piece.
JohnJamesRambo 9y ago
The contrast on those looks really bad compared to the normal ultra high contrast color schemes used in road signs. I'm not sure that reliability is more important than visibility.
- Xoros 9y ago
  Couldn't read the article (can't access) but I guess if it was dangerous in any way it would not been used for trafic regulation for 4 years, no ?
  - Ursa83 9y ago
    Hi, the article is back up. No worries, you're right, the tech is perfectly safe for the road - in traffic signs and in many other applications (www.visionect.com/blog/electronic-paper-truck-displays). So many exciting projects yet to come!
    - chrisbennet 9y ago
      Do you (also) work for visionect?
- throwasehasdwi 9y ago
  The site was up a few minutes ago, I bet somebody thought they were getting DDoS'ed and took it down. Also normal road signs use retro reflective spheres mixed into the paint to increase brightness at night, not sure if those can be carried over to e-ink displays?
- ornitorrincos 9y ago
  From the page it seems that they have some kind of ilumination when it gets dark, now on foggy or rainy conditions it could be an issue
- luka-birsa 9y ago
  What is really important is the value that is provided to the city and end users - you get up to deliver information to your commuters in real time. This is hard/impossible to do if you need to deploy LCD signs that require massive roadworks to connect to power. The fact that they don't break down is just a further testament to e-paper's versatility - we'll see more and more applications using e-paper in digital signage. There's a lot of examples what our customers are building on our blog, like smart citizen information (https://www.visionect.com/blog/soofa-sign-reinventing-cityscape/ https://www.visionect.com/blog/soofa-sign-reinventing-citysc...) or trucks equipped with digital signs (https://www.visionect.com/blog/electronic-paper-truck-displays/ https://www.visionect.com/blog/electronic-paper-truck-displa...).
askvictor 9y ago
Site seems to be down?
- esteradezelak 9y ago
  site back up
  - chrisbennet 9y ago
    How many HN id's do you have dude? I'm counting at least 3 on this thread alone; luka-birsa, Ursa83 and esteradezelak. I get that you want to put your ad on HN but atroturfing us isn't going to help you.
    - napsy 9y ago
      please stop deducting things, you're terrible.
noir_lord 9y ago
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:cURJPVAVfbwJ:blog.parknews.biz/2017/05/visionect-powered-electronic-paper-reports-zero-failures/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk&client=ubuntu http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:cURJPVA...
Quequau 9y ago
I would love to have an unadorned A3 or larger e-Ink device to mount on the wall next to my front door for a smart calendar/weather/to-do. I also really, really want an A4 sized eReader but for reasons completely beyond me the only manufacturer of such a device is Sony and not only are they ridiculously overpriced they've got bizarre anti-consumer constraint to basic functionality as well.
- slackingoff2017 9y ago
  Big e-ink displays are not happening any time soon. There's so many patents on the technology that it only makes sense to use on devices with huge margins. It's much like 3D printing where our wonderful patent system kept the ecosystem nice and chilly for 15 years.
- Ursa83 9y ago
  https://www.visionect.com/shop/ https://www.visionect.com/shop/ <- Have you tried e-paper development kits or signs? :)
  - igk 9y ago
    Damn, I want those now...but the price is kinda hefty for a toy right now (4k for 32"?) Anyone know any cheaper competitors?
    - samch 9y ago
      Straight from the source: http://shopkits.eink.com/product/signage-evaluation-kit-v3-with-31-2-epaper-display-ed312tt2/ http://shopkits.eink.com/product/signage-evaluation-kit-v3-w...
      - dalanmiller 9y ago
        Would you happen to know why these are so expensive per inch in size versus say a color screen?
  - Quequau 9y ago
kbart 9y ago
This article is jut an ad. What I'd really like to know: - What is total cost and what maintenance is required (annually) and how does it compare to the traditional road signs? - What about visibility (I assume, it doesn't have reflective property as traditional road sign paint)? At night? At rain? At other extreme weather conditions? - What connection is used and how secure is it (I assume, it's controlled remotely)? - What protections does it have against vandalism and theft?
- Ursa83 9y ago
  This might explain things a bit more: www.visionect.com/blog/worlds-first-epaper-traffic-signs In short, the signs are paperlike, with a 180-degree viewing angle and no glare, but they do have a frontlight. They connect via 3G and have tamper detection.
  - the8472 9y ago
    I think he meant retro-reflective properties of normal roadsigns. Merely being paper-like is not the same.
- bostonpete 9y ago
  > What about visibility (I assume, it doesn't have reflective property as traditional road sign paint)? At night? At rain? At other extreme weather conditions? So far, this seems to only be used for parking signs, where visibility isn't as much of a concern.
afandian 9y ago
Looking at the photos I'm surprised that the software isn't aware of panel edges. In this photo, for example, the "2" and "T" could have been shifted a little so that they didn't cross a boundary. https://www.visionect.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/sydney_epaper_traffic_sign_header9-900x500.jpg https://www.visionect.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/sydney_...
kevin_b_er 9y ago
This looks like a great recipe the 'parking laws' being changed with zero notice and your car getting towed away. No longer does the city have to send someone out to mark where your car is currently parked as an immediate towaway zone.
lozf 9y ago
My local bus stop has had an e-ink display showing when the next few bus routes are due, since last summer. I don't get to use it that often, but when I do it's often broken or stuck displaying wrong information. Just last week it was replaced, and this morning I noticed it appeared functional, but less accurate than Google Maps and Citymapper. So much potential, but seems to be poorly implemented by Tfl.gov.uk

173 points by Ursa83 9y ago

rprevolsek 9y ago

Are there any calculations made regarding life expectancy in comparison to LCD technologies?

Ursa83 9y ago
Hi, Ursa from Visionect here, the company powering the Sydney traffic signs. To answer your question: electronic paper technology is 99% more power efficient than LCD (uses energy only when changing content). In many applications, it can also prove to be as much as four times more reliable than LCD.
- askvictor 9y ago
  This doesn't actually answer the question of lifespan.
  - agumonkey 9y ago
    At least you can use all the money saved from electricity to pay for replacement .. hum
- JeremyCa 9y ago
  Love the 500..
- dragonmum 9y ago
  > Hi, Ursa from Visionect here, the company powering the Sydney traffic signs. You're also the poster of the article which is an ad from your company. > In many applications, it can also prove to be as much as four times more reliable than LCD. That's a really vague answer. Are you saying your solar powered road side display panels are 4 times more reliable than the LCD panels used with everything else? Could you share some data with us?
  - luka-birsa 9y ago
    Life expectancy of LCD/LEDs depends greatly on the type (consumer would die fairly quickly in outdoor scenarios) and I'm sure one could build an LCD/LED display that will last 4 years outdoors. It's hard to deploy such LCD/LED sign (you require power and lots of it to be visible in sunlight) but it's possible. The important thing here is that this first production outdoor deployment of EPD signs in the world works for for years without any serious problems which confirms that e-paper is a viable technology for outdoor deployments. There was a lot of skepticism back in 2013 if this is at all possible.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - dragonmum 9y ago
      > It's hard to deploy such LCD/LED sign (you require power and lots of it to be visible in sunlight) but it's possible. What? Most of the signboards you see on the road are LED signboards. You know the ones we have in freezing winter or in blazing summer! So not only is it possible, it's what's commonly done. > The important thing here is that this first production outdoor deployment There's very little data provided in the article, no real accurate data on what kind of environmental conditions were experienced by the devices. Seems like a puff piece.

JohnJamesRambo 9y ago

The contrast on those looks really bad compared to the normal ultra high contrast color schemes used in road signs. I'm not sure that reliability is more important than visibility.

Xoros 9y ago
Couldn't read the article (can't access) but I guess if it was dangerous in any way it would not been used for trafic regulation for 4 years, no ?
- Ursa83 9y ago
  Hi, the article is back up. No worries, you're right, the tech is perfectly safe for the road - in traffic signs and in many other applications (www.visionect.com/blog/electronic-paper-truck-displays). So many exciting projects yet to come!
  - chrisbennet 9y ago
    Do you (also) work for visionect?
throwasehasdwi 9y ago
The site was up a few minutes ago, I bet somebody thought they were getting DDoS'ed and took it down. Also normal road signs use retro reflective spheres mixed into the paint to increase brightness at night, not sure if those can be carried over to e-ink displays?
ornitorrincos 9y ago
From the page it seems that they have some kind of ilumination when it gets dark, now on foggy or rainy conditions it could be an issue
luka-birsa 9y ago
What is really important is the value that is provided to the city and end users - you get up to deliver information to your commuters in real time. This is hard/impossible to do if you need to deploy LCD signs that require massive roadworks to connect to power. The fact that they don't break down is just a further testament to e-paper's versatility - we'll see more and more applications using e-paper in digital signage. There's a lot of examples what our customers are building on our blog, like smart citizen information (https://www.visionect.com/blog/soofa-sign-reinventing-cityscape/ https://www.visionect.com/blog/soofa-sign-reinventing-citysc...) or trucks equipped with digital signs (https://www.visionect.com/blog/electronic-paper-truck-displays/ https://www.visionect.com/blog/electronic-paper-truck-displa...).

askvictor 9y ago

Site seems to be down?

esteradezelak 9y ago
site back up
- chrisbennet 9y ago
  How many HN id's do you have dude? I'm counting at least 3 on this thread alone; luka-birsa, Ursa83 and esteradezelak. I get that you want to put your ad on HN but atroturfing us isn't going to help you.
  - napsy 9y ago
    please stop deducting things, you're terrible.

noir_lord 9y ago

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:cURJPVAVfbwJ:blog.parknews.biz/2017/05/visionect-powered-electronic-paper-reports-zero-failures/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk&client=ubuntu http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:cURJPVA...

Quequau 9y ago

I would love to have an unadorned A3 or larger e-Ink device to mount on the wall next to my front door for a smart calendar/weather/to-do. I also really, really want an A4 sized eReader but for reasons completely beyond me the only manufacturer of such a device is Sony and not only are they ridiculously overpriced they've got bizarre anti-consumer constraint to basic functionality as well.

slackingoff2017 9y ago
Big e-ink displays are not happening any time soon. There's so many patents on the technology that it only makes sense to use on devices with huge margins. It's much like 3D printing where our wonderful patent system kept the ecosystem nice and chilly for 15 years.
Ursa83 9y ago
https://www.visionect.com/shop/ https://www.visionect.com/shop/ <- Have you tried e-paper development kits or signs? :)
- igk 9y ago
  Damn, I want those now...but the price is kinda hefty for a toy right now (4k for 32"?) Anyone know any cheaper competitors?
  - samch 9y ago
    Straight from the source: http://shopkits.eink.com/product/signage-evaluation-kit-v3-with-31-2-epaper-display-ed312tt2/ http://shopkits.eink.com/product/signage-evaluation-kit-v3-w...
    - dalanmiller 9y ago
      Would you happen to know why these are so expensive per inch in size versus say a color screen?
- Quequau 9y ago

kbart 9y ago

This article is jut an ad. What I'd really like to know: - What is total cost and what maintenance is required (annually) and how does it compare to the traditional road signs? - What about visibility (I assume, it doesn't have reflective property as traditional road sign paint)? At night? At rain? At other extreme weather conditions? - What connection is used and how secure is it (I assume, it's controlled remotely)? - What protections does it have against vandalism and theft?

Ursa83 9y ago
This might explain things a bit more: www.visionect.com/blog/worlds-first-epaper-traffic-signs In short, the signs are paperlike, with a 180-degree viewing angle and no glare, but they do have a frontlight. They connect via 3G and have tamper detection.
- the8472 9y ago
  I think he meant retro-reflective properties of normal roadsigns. Merely being paper-like is not the same.
bostonpete 9y ago
> What about visibility (I assume, it doesn't have reflective property as traditional road sign paint)? At night? At rain? At other extreme weather conditions? So far, this seems to only be used for parking signs, where visibility isn't as much of a concern.

afandian 9y ago

Looking at the photos I'm surprised that the software isn't aware of panel edges. In this photo, for example, the "2" and "T" could have been shifted a little so that they didn't cross a boundary. https://www.visionect.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/sydney_epaper_traffic_sign_header9-900x500.jpg https://www.visionect.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/sydney_...

kevin_b_er 9y ago

This looks like a great recipe the 'parking laws' being changed with zero notice and your car getting towed away. No longer does the city have to send someone out to mark where your car is currently parked as an immediate towaway zone.

lozf 9y ago

My local bus stop has had an e-ink display showing when the next few bus routes are due, since last summer. I don't get to use it that often, but when I do it's often broken or stuck displaying wrong information. Just last week it was replaced, and this morning I noticed it appeared functional, but less accurate than Google Maps and Citymapper. So much potential, but seems to be poorly implemented by Tfl.gov.uk