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I don't understand what the "anomalies" this site detects in Denmark, Finland, and France represent, but the site itself says that they don't necessarily repres
by ykler 9y ago
I don't understand what the "anomalies" this site detects in Denmark, Finland, and France represent, but the site itself says that they don't necessarily represent censorship and that it has only confirmed censorship in the following 12 countries: Russia, China, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Turkey, India, Indonesia, Greece, Sudan, Belgium, Cyprus and Korea.
- atmosx 9y agoI'm Greek and I have no idea of wikipedia (or other) kind of censorship by the Greek state. I know that the Greek mass media is tightly controlled by the Greek oligarchy and Greece is 88th in Freedom of Speech Index and falling - but their grip over the populace has been severely weakened the last 5 years. I have no idea of internet state-level censorship though, are there any specific
- johncolanduoni 9y agoAll the sites I see blocked in Greece in those stats are for foreign online gambling.
- dragly 9y agoDenmark, Finland, France and many other countries censor The Pirate Bay: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countries_blocking_access_to_The_Pirate_Bay https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countries_blocking_access_to_T...
- masklinn 9y agoSo… that's a case of dishonestly conflating shutting down a locally illegal operations and speech/political censorship. Hardly helping the case.
- briandear 9y agoThe French definitely censor more than just pirate sites.
- C4K3 9y agoDenmark censors a lot more than just TPB, though it is probably the one website that causes most people to circumvent the censorship. In Denmark it all started out with blocking child porn sites, then it was expanded to copyright infringement, then it was expanded to companies operating illegally (counterfeit goods stores, illegal gambling, alternative medicine stores) and most recently the government started blocking "terror propaganda" [1] - which means they have begun censoring political speech. This is in spite of a constitution forbidding censorship, with the counterpoint being that since it's technically private companies doing the censorship, it doesn't violate the constitution. Even though ISPs will be taken to court if they don't censor sites [2] [1] https://www.information.dk/indland/2016/10/statsligt-debattoerkorps-forhindre-online-radikalisering https://www.information.dk/indland/2016/10/statsligt-debatto... [2] https://www.version2.dk/artikel/dansk-internetudbyder-traekkes-i-retten-manglende-dns-blokering-57006 https://www.version2.dk/artikel/dansk-internetudbyder-traekk...
- dragly 9y agoSorry, but I did not intend to compare or conflate the two cases. I wanted to give an answer to the parent poster why those countries might be listed on the above site.
- sverhagen 9y agoThat link says: blocking access due to copyright issues. Respectfully, I don't think you're doing justice to the Turkish freedom of speech issue of Wikipedia being blocked by bringing up The Pirate Bay.
- jerheinze 9y ago> That link says: blocking access due to copyright issues. Respectfully, I don't think you're doing justice to the Turkish freedom of speech issue of Wikipedia being blocked by bringing up The Pirate Bay. Can we both agree that both of these things shouldn't happen and ThePirateBay and Wikipedia shouldn't be censored by any country?
- epmaybe 9y agoSure, but there's a time and a place, if you know what I mean. One directly undermines access to information, whereas another has to do with copyright law.
- flyingfences 9y agoTorrents contain information. Blocking torrent aggregators directly undermines access to information.
- dragly 9y agoI did not mean to compare the two cases at all and am sorry if it came out that way. I just wanted to answer the parent post on 'what the "anomalies" this site detects in Denmark, Finland, and France represent' by pointing out that TPB is blocked/censored in these countries. I only meant to point out one possible reason why the above site listed these countries.
- timthelion 9y agoJust FYI, Youtube is heavilly sensored in the Czech Republic (we have very strong laws against political extremism, like jail time for extreme right wing speech..). But I don't know of any actual domains that are blocked. The government doesn't need a great firewall to censor. They can simply slap a 2 year jail sentence on anyone who shares a right wing video and that's enough to get youtube to censor itself. Edit: I mean extreme right wing, like KKK, nazi stuf ect.
- briandear 9y agoIs there jail time for extreme left wing speech? Like Che Guevara, Mao, Hugo Chavez? Not arguing -- just genuinely curious how extremism is defined there.
- timthelion 9y agoYou are very unlikely to go to jail for left wing speech. This isn't a matter of placement on a political spectrum though. The law is as follow: 1) No Nazi symbolism outside of a historic context. 2) No inciting racial hatred. 3) No expression of hatred against a protected minority (the wealthy are not a protected minority). These are very easy to prove, but none of them apply to normal left wingers. There are Islamist left wingers that fall into these categories because of their anti-semeticism or anti Christian sentiments. 4) No denying crimes against humanity. This DOES apply to left wingers. If you deny Stalin's genocide against the Ukrainians that would be illegal. It also equally applies to holocaust deniers. I don't know how often it comes up though. 5) No speach which undermines democratic values and seeks to opress others. I don't think that this is ever actually used. Though it might apply against left wingers.
- thenomad 9y agoOne note on this: some elements of the extreme left-wing have in the past had tendencies toward antisemitism, which obviously fits into 2) and potentially 1). So that's one issue.
- 9y ago
- jerheinze 9y agoThe map has "Confirmed censorship cases" and Denmark, Finland and France, ... all fit there. For Denmark for example: https://explorer.ooni.torproject.org/country/DK https://explorer.ooni.torproject.org/country/DK They're blocking http://thepiratebay.org http://thepiratebay.org, that's straight up censorship.
- sverhagen 9y agoThe latter being censorship is really an opinion rather than undisputed, fact, or a guaranteed majority opinion.
- jerheinze 9y ago> The latter being censorship is really an opinion rather than undisputed, fact, or a guaranteed majority opinion. So you're saying that "Denmark censors http://thepiratebay.org" http://thepiratebay.org" is not a fact that can be measured?
- cryptarch 9y agoThe censorship is a fact, only its justification is in dispute.
- masklinn 9y ago> They're blocking http://thepiratebay.org http://thepiratebay.org, that's straight up censorship. No, that's anti-piracy judgements.
- vldx 9y agoI don't think this list is complete. Qatar comes to my mind, where while being there recently, I've had multiple instances where given sites were blocked - i.e. redirect to censor.qa and passing unique query parameters along w/ your IP address.
- jerheinze 9y agoThey're basing their results on measurements that anyone can make, if there are very few people who do these measurements in a certain country then most probably no censorship case may come.
- wodenokoto 9y agoAs far as I can tell from the linked site, it is only thepiratebay.org that is censored in Denmark, and I can confirm that this censorship is dependant on your internet provider. My landline provider gives me access, but my mobile provider (TDC, same provider as the one tested on the linked site) does not give me access, saying that a court has banned access to the site, but not quoting any specific case.
- paulddraper 9y agoIDK about censorship, but France had strict laws when it comes to Nazi support or Holocaust denial.
- pharrington 9y agoClick on a country, then click on "Blocked Sites".
- wiz21c 9y agoYou talk about Belgium, but the wikipedia doesn't (I read it from Belgium right now). Could you elaborate on this Belgium censorship information ? Thanks!