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There's a lot of negativity here. And maybe all of you are right. But it would be interesting to think of the most positive , imaginary scenario: 1. Amazon bui

by petra 10y ago

There's a lot of negativity here. And maybe all of you are right. But it would be interesting to think of the most positive , imaginary scenario: 1. Amazon builds the service such that brands loose their power. All the negative psych/social phenomena of brand culture are gone, and with it, btw , all the ads. 2. High security + physical on and off switch make for an improved privacy situation , especially if you consider the current state of webcams. 3. Amazon builds the style consulting service as a positive service, consulting with feminists and psychologists, not using dark patterns, but to the opposite, using empowerment regarding bodies, etc. This may also building a fashion social network focused on positive feeling, maybe by limiting to the close social circle, or something else, because the goal here isn't attention, like facebook. 4. That service would be good, it would really help women look their best. 5. Clothes become more affordable. Now, if Amazon could do all of this, it would be really great for their business, so why wouldn't they try ?

AlexandrB 10y ago
> 1. Amazon builds the service such that brands loose their power. All the negative psych/social phenomena of brand culture are gone, and with it, btw , all the ads. This is extremely naive. Amazon's goal is to sell you more stuff, including clothes. In the long run this device will regularly tell you that you need new clothes because your outfits are no longer fashionable. Even if that's not a feature now and even if this version was created with the best intentions someone in marketing will see the power of this thing to sell people more stuff. It's their job. Edit: > Now, if Amazon could do all of this, it would be really great for their business, so why wouldn't they try ? How would what you listed be great for their business? Selling more stuff is great for their business and the best way to get there is to tell you that the stuff you already have is not good enough.
slackstation 10y ago
The reason why Amazon and more people don't do these things is because they are hard and success breeds expectations that can only hurt you. It's much cheaper and safer to build a politically neutral brand without expectations of some kind feminist message / worldview. If you go that route, it isn't going to sell more clothes but, it will invite people's hyper-sensitivity about every aspect of the product. You can only lose in that scenario, you aren't winning anything. Also, it's creepy that we replacing a task that friends used to do, (fashion / styling / taste advice) with a corporate cloud algorithm? Seriously, just get some friends that like fashion and ask them to rate your style. I guess it's a bit needy to ask them every morning but, then I suspect that most people don't have that many clothes and that many possible looks. Also, looking good is zero sum game. Ultimately, you just competing for the same pool of attention from your friends. If you are successful and soak it all up with your great Amazon(TM) fashion advice, then your friends will soon have it too and then you are back to where you started but, now you have this dependance on the kind of friend who gives you great advice (that you need to just look decent now, not better than average like before) except it keeps encouraging you to buy more fashionable (and thus more expensive) clothes. It's kinda a shitty friend at that point.
- petra 10y ago
  Great comment! And I agree with a lot of it. As for the question if political branding, maybe Amazon doesn't brand it this way, just says "data indicates our customers will love this service"? And customers ,coming with zero political expectations get all this benefit and are happy ?
- pbhjpbhj 10y ago
  >"just get some friends that like fashion and ask them to rate your style" // Or just wear clothing that you like and ignore fashion?
mdpopescu 10y ago
Upvoted because - even though I don't agree with you here - I managed to find someone more optimistic than I am.
- petra 10y ago
  It's not necessarily what i believe in,and the replies we're very good, but excessive optimism is one way to see what a product could be .
x2f10 10y ago
Now that you've done the optimism, let me help with the pessimism. >1. Amazon builds the service such that brands loose their power. All the negative psych/social phenomena of brand culture are gone, and with it, btw , all the ads. Brand culture is alive due to marketing / advertising. $AMZN wants to be paid to market / advertise. It's more likely the case that brands will be able to pay to have their brand identified via the cam (giving additional points) or have their brand (in a similar style) recommended to the user via the app / website. >2. High security + physical on and off switch make for an improved privacy situation , especially if you consider the current state of webcams. Agree, but a physical on and off switch makes the biggest selling feature useless: speech. Alexa loses it's cool if I have to constantly turn it on and off. And, heck, at that point, why not use a normal camera? >3. Amazon builds the style consulting service as a positive service, consulting with feminists and psychologists, not using dark patterns, but to the opposite, using empowerment regarding bodies, etc. This may also building a fashion social network focused on positive feeling, maybe by limiting to the close social circle, or something else, because the goal here isn't attention, like facebook. You will not convince me that this point is not in jest. The product is not a "feel good at any size" product. If it were, it's have a small utility for an even smaller group - this product is to _increase_ the importance of "fashion". >4. That service would be good, it would really help women look their best. I don't see how this is the conclusion from #3. >5. Clothes become more affordable. It wouldn't do much. $AMZN doesn't have much power in the fashion market.

by petra 10y ago

AlexandrB 10y ago

> 1. Amazon builds the service such that brands loose their power. All the negative psych/social phenomena of brand culture are gone, and with it, btw , all the ads. This is extremely naive. Amazon's goal is to sell you more stuff, including clothes. In the long run this device will regularly tell you that you need new clothes because your outfits are no longer fashionable. Even if that's not a feature now and even if this version was created with the best intentions someone in marketing will see the power of this thing to sell people more stuff. It's their job. Edit: > Now, if Amazon could do all of this, it would be really great for their business, so why wouldn't they try ? How would what you listed be great for their business? Selling more stuff is great for their business and the best way to get there is to tell you that the stuff you already have is not good enough.

slackstation 10y ago

The reason why Amazon and more people don't do these things is because they are hard and success breeds expectations that can only hurt you. It's much cheaper and safer to build a politically neutral brand without expectations of some kind feminist message / worldview. If you go that route, it isn't going to sell more clothes but, it will invite people's hyper-sensitivity about every aspect of the product. You can only lose in that scenario, you aren't winning anything. Also, it's creepy that we replacing a task that friends used to do, (fashion / styling / taste advice) with a corporate cloud algorithm? Seriously, just get some friends that like fashion and ask them to rate your style. I guess it's a bit needy to ask them every morning but, then I suspect that most people don't have that many clothes and that many possible looks. Also, looking good is zero sum game. Ultimately, you just competing for the same pool of attention from your friends. If you are successful and soak it all up with your great Amazon(TM) fashion advice, then your friends will soon have it too and then you are back to where you started but, now you have this dependance on the kind of friend who gives you great advice (that you need to just look decent now, not better than average like before) except it keeps encouraging you to buy more fashionable (and thus more expensive) clothes. It's kinda a shitty friend at that point.

petra 10y ago
Great comment! And I agree with a lot of it. As for the question if political branding, maybe Amazon doesn't brand it this way, just says "data indicates our customers will love this service"? And customers ,coming with zero political expectations get all this benefit and are happy ?
pbhjpbhj 10y ago
>"just get some friends that like fashion and ask them to rate your style" // Or just wear clothing that you like and ignore fashion?

mdpopescu 10y ago

Upvoted because - even though I don't agree with you here - I managed to find someone more optimistic than I am.

petra 10y ago
It's not necessarily what i believe in,and the replies we're very good, but excessive optimism is one way to see what a product could be .

x2f10 10y ago

Now that you've done the optimism, let me help with the pessimism. >1. Amazon builds the service such that brands loose their power. All the negative psych/social phenomena of brand culture are gone, and with it, btw , all the ads. Brand culture is alive due to marketing / advertising. $AMZN wants to be paid to market / advertise. It's more likely the case that brands will be able to pay to have their brand identified via the cam (giving additional points) or have their brand (in a similar style) recommended to the user via the app / website. >2. High security + physical on and off switch make for an improved privacy situation , especially if you consider the current state of webcams. Agree, but a physical on and off switch makes the biggest selling feature useless: speech. Alexa loses it's cool if I have to constantly turn it on and off. And, heck, at that point, why not use a normal camera? >3. Amazon builds the style consulting service as a positive service, consulting with feminists and psychologists, not using dark patterns, but to the opposite, using empowerment regarding bodies, etc. This may also building a fashion social network focused on positive feeling, maybe by limiting to the close social circle, or something else, because the goal here isn't attention, like facebook. You will not convince me that this point is not in jest. The product is not a "feel good at any size" product. If it were, it's have a small utility for an even smaller group - this product is to _increase_ the importance of "fashion". >4. That service would be good, it would really help women look their best. I don't see how this is the conclusion from #3. >5. Clothes become more affordable. It wouldn't do much. $AMZN doesn't have much power in the fashion market.