6 ms·

By the point where they were about to have an airport police officer beat the crap out of the passenger (which they did, BTW -- he suffered a concussion and two

By the point where they were about to have an airport police officer beat the crap out of the passenger (which they did, BTW -- he suffered a concussion and two lost teeth!) it should have become clear that this wasn't going to go well. So once it was clear that Dao wasn't going to leave his seat voluntarily, they should have brought in a higher-up with the authority to offer more compensation to get another volunteer -- or simply pick another person to involuntarily deplane. (They could also have publicly threatened Dao with a civil lawsuit, figuring that even if that didn't change his mind, it would deter the next person they picked from doing the same thing he did.)

differentView 10y ago
Saw on TV news this morning, those weren't even real cops. They were private security hired by United. They were even told to stop wearing jackets that said "POLICE" months ago, but kept wearing them.
- joezydeco 10y ago
  They were Chicago Department of Aviation police. They're hired by the City Aviation department and usually have police training, but are not allowed to arrest citizens or carry guns (although they have been asking). http://www.chicagomag.com/city-life/April-2017/3-Things-to-Know-About-the-Officers-in-the-United-Airlines-Fiasco/ http://www.chicagomag.com/city-life/April-2017/3-Things-to-K... tldr: They're rent-a-cops hired by the airport, not United.
  - 15155 10y ago
    So, it stands to reason they have _zero_ civil immunity, unlike a sworn officer?
    - joezydeco 10y ago
      It does stand to reason. However, this is Chicago. Locals know to never assume anything about city government because you'll tend to discover the opposite later on.
      - neeleshs 10y ago
        Fascinating. I'm genuinely curious to know some examples of this.
        toomuchtodo 10y ago
        Google "Chicago government corruption". Having lived in Chicago before, you fear the Chicago Police and your local alderman is the fixer.
        joezydeco 10y ago
        Here's a pretty famous example. If you're the mayor and you want to close an airport, do you follow FAA procedure and give notice to the government and all the aircraft owners (especially the ones with planes parked on the tarmac)? Nope! You shut it down in the middle of the night and bulldoze the runway. Problem solved! https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2003/march/31/mayor-daley-bulldozes-chicagos-meigs-field-(2) https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2003/march/31/m... http://www.airspacemag.com/flight-today/day-shut-down-meigs-field-180952788/ http://www.airspacemag.com/flight-today/day-shut-down-meigs-...
    - true_religion 10y ago
      They're sworn officers acting off duty.
      - Animats 10y ago
        Not necessarily.[1] Also, Illinois law doesn't give local police state-wide jurisdiction. (Some states, including California, do, but Illinois does not.) Unless they're off-duty Chicago cops, they don't have any more authority than ordinary rent-a-cops. They could be charged with assault and battery. [1] http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/politics/ct-united-airlines-ohare-incident-city-council-met-20170411-story.html http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/politics/ct-united-...
    - srtjstjsj 10y ago
      Why would you assume they aren't sworn officers? They are government employees.
nikanj 10y ago
They don't want to have that higher-up with authority on every airport. The fewer people can dole out compensation, the less compensation you end up paying.
- justinclift 10y ago
  Doesn't seem to be a policy that's working out well for them though, when factoring in things like this happening.
DigitalJack 10y ago
The dude was complicit in the clusterfuck. Having seen the video it would surprise me if the man was sober and mentally sound. The the officers screwed up the extraction, but the guy was ridiculous. Did he actually believe wailing like a 2 year old and doing his damnedest to hold on to his chair would result in his remaining on the flight? His face injuries were caused when he finally lost his grip on his seat. The effort of the guy extracting him suddenly had no resistance and the guy sprang out across the aisle and whacked his face hard on the aisle arm rest opposite him. The whole thing was a shitstorm where mistakes kept compounding, made by both parties. Of course the whole thing was instigated by united and I firmly believe they were in the wrong, but the passenger was obnoxious and not free of blame.
- victorhooi 10y ago
  There are professionals that are trained to deal with this situation. They have both the training, tools and experience to deal with this. I'm not sure what happened here - apparently the officers were "Chicago Aviation Police" - which is different to the "Chicago Police Department" (i.e. what you and I would know as real police officers). Surely there was somebody they could have escalated to (or simply called in the actual Police Department) if they thought it had to come to this?
  - colmvp 10y ago
    A mentally unstable person decided to go on a police car and start yelling at the police. While up there, she broke the rear windows too. What did the police do? Did they shoot her? Did they taze her? Did they beat her? No. They waited. They waited till she came down from the top of the car at which point they restrained her. Those police officers deserve praise for defusing the situation without escalating it. And at the same time, it also shows that yes, police can find ways to control situations without resorting to extreme violence. Even in this case on the airplane, I could easily imagine a competent officer saying to United, "is there any way you could convince someone else to give up their seat? Maybe offer more money?"
  - srtjstjsj 10y ago
    They are real police officers. http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-united-chicago-aviation-police-met-20170413-story.html http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-united-chicago-aviatio...
FabHK 10y ago
If they just picked another passenger, that rewards stubborn unruly behaviour. Next pax would then be well advised also to throw a hissy fit.

differentView 10y ago

Saw on TV news this morning, those weren't even real cops. They were private security hired by United. They were even told to stop wearing jackets that said "POLICE" months ago, but kept wearing them.

joezydeco 10y ago
They were Chicago Department of Aviation police. They're hired by the City Aviation department and usually have police training, but are not allowed to arrest citizens or carry guns (although they have been asking). http://www.chicagomag.com/city-life/April-2017/3-Things-to-Know-About-the-Officers-in-the-United-Airlines-Fiasco/ http://www.chicagomag.com/city-life/April-2017/3-Things-to-K... tldr: They're rent-a-cops hired by the airport, not United.
- 15155 10y ago
  So, it stands to reason they have _zero_ civil immunity, unlike a sworn officer?
  - joezydeco 10y ago
    It does stand to reason. However, this is Chicago. Locals know to never assume anything about city government because you'll tend to discover the opposite later on.
    - neeleshs 10y ago
      Fascinating. I'm genuinely curious to know some examples of this.
      - toomuchtodo 10y ago
        Google "Chicago government corruption". Having lived in Chicago before, you fear the Chicago Police and your local alderman is the fixer.
      - joezydeco 10y ago
        Here's a pretty famous example. If you're the mayor and you want to close an airport, do you follow FAA procedure and give notice to the government and all the aircraft owners (especially the ones with planes parked on the tarmac)? Nope! You shut it down in the middle of the night and bulldoze the runway. Problem solved! https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2003/march/31/mayor-daley-bulldozes-chicagos-meigs-field-(2) https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2003/march/31/m... http://www.airspacemag.com/flight-today/day-shut-down-meigs-field-180952788/ http://www.airspacemag.com/flight-today/day-shut-down-meigs-...
  - true_religion 10y ago
    They're sworn officers acting off duty.
    - Animats 10y ago
      Not necessarily.[1] Also, Illinois law doesn't give local police state-wide jurisdiction. (Some states, including California, do, but Illinois does not.) Unless they're off-duty Chicago cops, they don't have any more authority than ordinary rent-a-cops. They could be charged with assault and battery. [1] http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/politics/ct-united-airlines-ohare-incident-city-council-met-20170411-story.html http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/politics/ct-united-...
  - srtjstjsj 10y ago
    Why would you assume they aren't sworn officers? They are government employees.

nikanj 10y ago

They don't want to have that higher-up with authority on every airport. The fewer people can dole out compensation, the less compensation you end up paying.

justinclift 10y ago
Doesn't seem to be a policy that's working out well for them though, when factoring in things like this happening.

DigitalJack 10y ago

The dude was complicit in the clusterfuck. Having seen the video it would surprise me if the man was sober and mentally sound. The the officers screwed up the extraction, but the guy was ridiculous. Did he actually believe wailing like a 2 year old and doing his damnedest to hold on to his chair would result in his remaining on the flight? His face injuries were caused when he finally lost his grip on his seat. The effort of the guy extracting him suddenly had no resistance and the guy sprang out across the aisle and whacked his face hard on the aisle arm rest opposite him. The whole thing was a shitstorm where mistakes kept compounding, made by both parties. Of course the whole thing was instigated by united and I firmly believe they were in the wrong, but the passenger was obnoxious and not free of blame.

victorhooi 10y ago
There are professionals that are trained to deal with this situation. They have both the training, tools and experience to deal with this. I'm not sure what happened here - apparently the officers were "Chicago Aviation Police" - which is different to the "Chicago Police Department" (i.e. what you and I would know as real police officers). Surely there was somebody they could have escalated to (or simply called in the actual Police Department) if they thought it had to come to this?
- colmvp 10y ago
  A mentally unstable person decided to go on a police car and start yelling at the police. While up there, she broke the rear windows too. What did the police do? Did they shoot her? Did they taze her? Did they beat her? No. They waited. They waited till she came down from the top of the car at which point they restrained her. Those police officers deserve praise for defusing the situation without escalating it. And at the same time, it also shows that yes, police can find ways to control situations without resorting to extreme violence. Even in this case on the airplane, I could easily imagine a competent officer saying to United, "is there any way you could convince someone else to give up their seat? Maybe offer more money?"
- srtjstjsj 10y ago
  They are real police officers. http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-united-chicago-aviation-police-met-20170413-story.html http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-united-chicago-aviatio...

FabHK 10y ago

If they just picked another passenger, that rewards stubborn unruly behaviour. Next pax would then be well advised also to throw a hissy fit.