4 ms·

borderline industries such as drug and gun production are heavily licensed and controlled by the state. I believe this case should fall into a similar category.

borderline industries such as drug and gun production are heavily licensed and controlled by the state. I believe this case should fall into a similar category. >Where exactly do you draw the line? You can kill with a hammer too, but noone will hold hammer maker complicit.

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
E6300 10y ago
How could that possibly work? Gun manufacture requires machinery and resources, and drug production requires specific knowledge that's not widely disseminated. Anyone can learn how to write software.
- chillingeffect 10y ago
  Sales would be the point of control. Gun manufacturing equipment is not prohibitive. Zip guns and 3-d printers facilitate it. Drug production for cocaine, heroin, cannabis and others is as simple as a garden. Not that I agree the kid should be arrested. I simply perceive the feasibility of software prohibition via government license to be as effective as it is for guns and drugs.
  - E6300 10y ago
    > Sales would be the point of control. Do you mean sales of the software itself? There's no way that could work. Secretly transferring a bitstring is one of the easiest things to do. At best you could catch the money laundering. > Drug production for cocaine, heroin, cannabis and others is as simple as a garden. I was thinking of drugs in general. Including for example antibiotics and cancer drugs. AFAIK, practically no one knows how to make stuff like that.
    - inlined 10y ago
      > Do you mean sales of the software itself? There's no way that could work. Loaning a gun is even easier, but it seems regulated too. I've seen a friend verbally say in front of others that he was transferring full ownership a gun when a friend asked to borrow one for the range because that's what the laws of his state required (WA). He then informed his friend that he would certainly appreciate the gun being transferred back in a week but he had no recourse if not.
      - cmdrfred 10y ago
        >Loaning a gun is even easier, Really? You're going to make that claim? Prove it: Just encrypt a gun with my public key and send it to me over email.
      - E6300 10y ago
        I mean, are we talking about just regulating or about actually enforcing regulations?
  - 15charlimit 10y ago
    >I simply perceive the feasibility of software prohibition via government license to be as effective as it is for guns and drugs. In other words, not effective at all against the people you're attempting to target (criminals) and only negatively affecting the people who don't deserve or need to be targeted (law abiding citizens)? Yeah, that'll work great. /s
- M_Grey 10y ago
  Realistically more people could learn to run a CNC milling AR-15 parts, than could learn to write code of similar efficacy.
  - E6300 10y ago
    Well, I've heard of quite a few malware pieces. I've never heard of hand-crafted black market AR-15s.
    - abeyer 10y ago
      https://ghostgunner.net/ https://ghostgunner.net/ "As shipped, Ghost Gunner manufactures mil-spec AR-15 and AR-308 lower receivers to completion. With simple tools and point and click software, the machine automatically finds and aligns to your 80% lower to get to work. No prior CNC knowledge or experience is required to manufacture from design files. Legally manufacture unserialized AR rifles in the comfort and privacy of your home."
      - E6300 10y ago
        That's just another level of indirection. "I'm not selling guns, I'm selling machines that automatically make guns." "I'm not selling malware. I'm selling random bitstrings. Here's the email of someone who sells a different kind of random bitstrings, and here's a URL where you can download an AES implementation." You still need someone with the technical know-how to make that machinery, and the commercialization of such machinery is very easy to regulate because pretty much only industries use CNC machines. Computers, on the other hand, are everywhere.
tantalor 10y ago
No, they are controlled by lobbyists working on behalf of the industry to limit entry into the market. It's about profit, not safety.
- BanzaiTokyo 10y ago
  "No" what? Could you explain what do you mean by that. Just to be clear, I didn't make any statements about control.
  - tantalor 10y ago
    You say the e.g. gun industry is "controlled by the state". This is wrong; the industry regulates itself by means of lobbying.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

E6300 10y ago

How could that possibly work? Gun manufacture requires machinery and resources, and drug production requires specific knowledge that's not widely disseminated. Anyone can learn how to write software.

chillingeffect 10y ago
Sales would be the point of control. Gun manufacturing equipment is not prohibitive. Zip guns and 3-d printers facilitate it. Drug production for cocaine, heroin, cannabis and others is as simple as a garden. Not that I agree the kid should be arrested. I simply perceive the feasibility of software prohibition via government license to be as effective as it is for guns and drugs.
- E6300 10y ago
  > Sales would be the point of control. Do you mean sales of the software itself? There's no way that could work. Secretly transferring a bitstring is one of the easiest things to do. At best you could catch the money laundering. > Drug production for cocaine, heroin, cannabis and others is as simple as a garden. I was thinking of drugs in general. Including for example antibiotics and cancer drugs. AFAIK, practically no one knows how to make stuff like that.
  - inlined 10y ago
    > Do you mean sales of the software itself? There's no way that could work. Loaning a gun is even easier, but it seems regulated too. I've seen a friend verbally say in front of others that he was transferring full ownership a gun when a friend asked to borrow one for the range because that's what the laws of his state required (WA). He then informed his friend that he would certainly appreciate the gun being transferred back in a week but he had no recourse if not.
    - cmdrfred 10y ago
      >Loaning a gun is even easier, Really? You're going to make that claim? Prove it: Just encrypt a gun with my public key and send it to me over email.
    - E6300 10y ago
      I mean, are we talking about just regulating or about actually enforcing regulations?
- 15charlimit 10y ago
  >I simply perceive the feasibility of software prohibition via government license to be as effective as it is for guns and drugs. In other words, not effective at all against the people you're attempting to target (criminals) and only negatively affecting the people who don't deserve or need to be targeted (law abiding citizens)? Yeah, that'll work great. /s
M_Grey 10y ago
Realistically more people could learn to run a CNC milling AR-15 parts, than could learn to write code of similar efficacy.
- E6300 10y ago
  Well, I've heard of quite a few malware pieces. I've never heard of hand-crafted black market AR-15s.
  - abeyer 10y ago
    https://ghostgunner.net/ https://ghostgunner.net/ "As shipped, Ghost Gunner manufactures mil-spec AR-15 and AR-308 lower receivers to completion. With simple tools and point and click software, the machine automatically finds and aligns to your 80% lower to get to work. No prior CNC knowledge or experience is required to manufacture from design files. Legally manufacture unserialized AR rifles in the comfort and privacy of your home."
    - E6300 10y ago
      That's just another level of indirection. "I'm not selling guns, I'm selling machines that automatically make guns." "I'm not selling malware. I'm selling random bitstrings. Here's the email of someone who sells a different kind of random bitstrings, and here's a URL where you can download an AES implementation." You still need someone with the technical know-how to make that machinery, and the commercialization of such machinery is very easy to regulate because pretty much only industries use CNC machines. Computers, on the other hand, are everywhere.

tantalor 10y ago

No, they are controlled by lobbyists working on behalf of the industry to limit entry into the market. It's about profit, not safety.

BanzaiTokyo 10y ago
"No" what? Could you explain what do you mean by that. Just to be clear, I didn't make any statements about control.
- tantalor 10y ago
  You say the e.g. gun industry is "controlled by the state". This is wrong; the industry regulates itself by means of lobbying.