7 ms·

Adblock Plus announces members of independent Acceptable Ads Committee

50 points by shoniko 10y ago

belovedeagle 10y ago
Raise your hand if you're surprised that the only unfilled seats are the ones who will be in favor of fewer ads. I wonder how many meetings have been held already to discuss strategy, in their absence. I also wonder whether it will matter, with 7 seats for ad agencies (4+3; I'm not fooled by this "expert" bullshit for one second), and 3 for anti-ad advocates, plus some rando.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- tgsovlerkhgsel 10y ago
  The good thing is that everyone, including the ad agencies, has a motivation to not allow shitty ads. The acceptable ads program only affects people who have already demonstrated tech-savvyness (either directly or by having a relative helping with it) and unwillingness to tolerate bad ads by installing an adblocker in the first place. They know that if the ads get too annoying, people will block them completely, and they've seen how much it sucks when that happens. Hence, if they're smart, they'll try to be decent about the criteria (and might find a way to get rid of the taboola/outbrain clickbait that makes people disable acceptable ads, but is tolerated by ABP because it pays). If not, that's OK too - acceptable ads will die, and their ads will be blocked completely.
JadeNB 10y ago
Based on just a skim of the story: I'm sure that people will complain about this, and I'm sure that there genuinely is much to complain about—advertising is, almost by its nature I think, an adversarial business—but: Ever since ABP announced the Acceptable Ads program, the biggest complaint lodged against them has been that it's within their control, and so in their interest not to enforce policies strictly in their users' interest. (See https://hn.algolia.com/?query=Adblock%20Plus%20Acceptable%20Ads&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?query=Adblock%20Plus%20Acceptable%20... .) I am certain that this latest step is not perfect, but it is a step forward, and a sign of at least apparent willingness to listen to the community, and I am glad to see it.
- r00fus 10y ago
  I find the entire idea of "Acceptable Ads" to be the antithesis for an ad blocker. Ads are an infection vector and privacy leak. It's like concept of "acceptable groping" from an HR department. Completely at odds with their stated intent and standard ethics. Sorry, I'm now using uBlock Origin and/or Safari content blockers. I'll go with those organizations who don't have any interest/stake in permitting ads. If I am going to pay for content, I'll do so. If that's not kosher with the content producer, I'll simply abstain.
  - JadeNB 10y ago
    > Ads are an infection vector and privacy leak. Both of these are undeniably true about specific ads, but surely not the genre of advertising in general? I think that magazine ads, for example, are neither infection vectors nor privacy leaks. To the extent that these can be audited, surely preventing malware distribution and respecting my privacy are part of what should be included in the definition of 'acceptable'. (If they are not included, then I would argue that that is a failure of a specific implementation of "acceptable ads", not of the notion of acceptability itself.) > It's like concept of "acceptable groping" from an HR department. Completely at odds with their stated intent and standard ethics. While that is a potent analogy, I would argue that there's a difference: most of us agree that there is no level of groping that's acceptable; whereas I _think_ that, even among those of us who would like a web with no ads, the position that there is no level of advertising that's acceptable is extreme. > Sorry, I'm now using uBlock Origin and/or Safari content blockers. I'll go with those organizations who don't have any interest/stake in permitting ads. I agree, and don't mean to argue against those options. For what it's worth, I also use µBlock; I left ABP over what I perceived as conflicts of interest, and I am not interested in going back. Nonetheless, since some people do use it, surely this divestiture from a conflict of interest is a good thing, even if it's not perfect.
    - givinguflac 10y ago
      I think the point is, if one could guarantee no malware and tracking built into an ad (you can't, no one can) then many more people would be ok with ads all over to a certain extent. I'm not sure what you're getting at with the reference to magazine ads though- magazines are basically gigantic advertisements with some content mixed in. Do you really want that for the web?
anilshanbhag 10y ago
I am surprised Google does not have a seat at the table.
- JTon 10y ago
  Maybe to Google attending such an event legitimizes the use of ad-blocking tech. As far as I've seen, Google has either ignored it or been hostile towards it.
  - iLoch 10y ago
    They already do that with Google Contributor.
    - s3r3nity 10y ago
      Which has already been sunsetted... for a "new and better" one that hasn't launched yet, so I'm bearish. https://contributor.google.com/v/signupdisabled https://contributor.google.com/v/signupdisabled
- mlmlmasd 10y ago
  This whole initiative (acceptable ads) came out of Google paying off Adblock Plus. http://www.businessinsider.com/google-microsoft-amazon-taboola-pay-adblock-plus-to-stop-blocking-their-ads-2015-2 http://www.businessinsider.com/google-microsoft-amazon-taboo...
danbruc 10y ago
I just read the criteria for acceptable ads the first time. Not that I really expected otherwise, but all the criteria are just about non-intrusiveness and recognizability, tracking is not mentioned once on the entire site. At least for me blinking text is not the primary concern, it is being tracked on every click I make. So in my opinion acceptable ads is not even roughly heading in the right direction.
- sgdread 10y ago
  Context is the king. Ads acceptable only when their subject matches context of browsing and the user intent. And works only when done in non-interruptible manner. If you break context and/or flow, people get uncomfortable, frustrated, angry. Angry people will install ad-blockers. Some examples: - if you search for a solution on how to fix a fridge, then fridge ads are acceptable. Google does exactly that in their search. - if you're on sports stats tracking site, then athletic gear, food, etc are acceptable - if I search stackoverflow for specific problem with my code - NO ads please, I'm not in a mood to buy something. - in movies: John Wick is using TTI Glock 17 - having TTI ad near is perfectly fine (people will crave to know what's those cool things he's using). I.e. product placement is the way to go. What's happening on TV? You're watching Keanu shredding through the movie, then it suddenly stops and Chevy ad coming in. WTF?!111
  - danbruc 10y ago
    As long as the context is what you are watching or searching right here and right now, that seems acceptable. If the context includes what I did a few minutes ago on another site, that is in my opinion no longer acceptable. And personally I would not mind if the entire advertising industry just went out of business, I think ads are simply a bad idea.
valine 10y ago
I'm okay with this. It's not like Adblock Plus is the only option or even the best option for ad blocking right now. I switched to uBlock Origin and never looked back.
SEJeff 10y ago
And if you don't want acceptable ads, use uBlock Origin: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/ublock-origin/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/ublock-origin... https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/ublock-origin/cjpalhdlnbpafiamejdnhcphjbkeiagm?hl=en https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/ublock-origin/cjpa... https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock
- LeoPanthera 10y ago
  Now recently made available for Safari! https://github.com/el1t/uBlock-Safari https://github.com/el1t/uBlock-Safari
  - anexprogrammer 10y ago
    ..and despite the Readme implying it may not be stable yet and it being prerelease I've found it flawless for the 2 or 3 weeks I've been happily running it!
    - SEJeff 10y ago
      And me for the past year or so!
  - Hoasi 10y ago
    Thanks for sharing! Long awaited.
- k1m 10y ago
  My Block Ads! site https://blockads.fivefilters.org https://blockads.fivefilters.org tries to detect your browser and recommend a suitable version of uBlock Origin. Links to Chrome, Firefox, Opera, Safari and Edge extensions. Intended to be an easy way to get friends and family to install for their browser.
- ethana 10y ago
  How long until the ABP guys stop their generosity and either 1) incorporate its acceptable ads into EasyList (which they maintain) or 2) block every other ad-blocker from leeching off their lists. I predict former. There are already tons of white-listed rules in EasyList. Until other ad blockers actually start to maintain their separate list, I don't see a reason to stop using ABP. Ghostery is the only extension that doesn't use EasyList as far as I know. But they too have their own telemetry tracking.
user5994461 10y ago
1) Left the acceptable ads enabled, didn't care. 2) Made a google search for "<popular software>" on my mother's computer. 3) All the first results were sponsored links from sites distributing a copy of the real software, but ridden with adware, or worse. 4) Disabled all ads without mercy. *) Switched to uBlock Origin later. ----- 5 years later... 6) Become sysadmin of a global company with more than 10 000 computers. 7) Distribute Chrome and Firefox to all of them with ad blocking software pre-installed.
- HeavenBanned 10y ago
  You're the hero we need.
- LeoPanthera 10y ago
  > with ad blocking software pre-installed Which?
CodeWriter23 10y ago
AdBlock. The software that unblocked ads. Orwell intended 1984 to be a cautionary tale, not an instruction manual.
COMPUTERLOSER 10y ago
No ads are acceptable if I choose to have an ad-blocker installed.
- nilved 10y ago
  Not sure why you got downvoted. I will not accept any ads.
  - manigandham 10y ago
    Do you expect content producers to get paid?
    - joelthelion 10y ago
      Not through ads displayed in my browser. There are other ways to get paid, though.
      - manigandham 10y ago
        So content displayed through browser should be behind a paywall then? What if the solution is ads blocked for a fee?
        mlmlmasd 10y ago
        > What if the solution is ads blocked for a fee? The day I have to pay to not have manipulative bullshit spammed at me is the day I say goodbye to the internet. Fuck right off.
        openasocket 10y ago
        Would you prefer a paywall? Seriously asking
        mlmlmasd 10y ago
jasonkostempski 10y ago
There are really 3 separate things lumped into the word "ads". Advertisements (obvious); annoying UI/audio/video (modal dialogs, video, etc); and 3rd-party tracking. Advertisements in general I accept and I don't have any desire to prevent people or companies from including it in their own content, although, if included, I'll likely view the content as less reputable and the creator as having less integrity. Some people flat-out hate all ads and that's why they have an ad blocker. Their acceptable ad list would have 0 entries. Tracking is a non-starter for me, advertising is possible without tracking but it's not generally done that way, it works for TV and radio. Most "ad" networks don't actually give a hoot about advertising, they care about tracking and tricking companies into footing the bill for collecting the data. I use my ad blocker as a tracking blocker, I wouldn't have bothered to install it if tracking weren't possible. I have no qualms about preventing someone from collecting information about me. I'd want anything ads that come from a third-party to be off the acceptable ad list (effectively an empty list). Annoying UI I can tolerate to a point. Most of this is blocked by my "ad" blocker so I only see how bad it really is out there in the wild when I forget to install it. Assuming the ad blocker didn't do that, if things get too annoying I'd leave the site, if I find myself returning to the site and getting annoyed often, I'll filter out links to the site wherever I can. There are handful of really annoying sites that come up often enough that I've made a browser plug-in for myself to do link filtering on. Right now most of the sites on the list have a pay-wall or "ad" block blocker and keep playing the cat & mouse game and winning (good for them, they must imagine Sisyphus happy). This is how I wish "ad blocking" worked: Community driven list of "bad players", bad being any tracking, dark patterns, or very annoying UI; links to bad players get removed from all pages, I never want to see them or their click-baity titles ever again; white-list for site you want to let track, trick and annoy you; grey-list for sites you want to see but still block in the traditional way. This would also provide feedback to bad players, giving them a chance to change their ways and new players would fear getting added.
- manigandham 10y ago
  > Most "ad" networks don't actually give a hoot about advertising, they care about tracking and tricking companies into footing the bill for collecting the data. Where did you get this info from? Ad networks care very much about the ads.
mlmlmasd 10y ago
Fuck off ABP. Use uBlock Origin.
idiot_stick 10y ago
>Do you expect content producers to get paid? Expect? No. "Producing content" isn't difficult, nor is anyone entitled to profit from it.
- manigandham 10y ago
  How would you solve this? Paywalls for everything?
  - idiot_stick 10y ago
    >How would you solve this? Paywalls for everything? Sure, why not. I don't care. I have zero problem finding content I want via a variety of methods, free and paid. I have more content than I can consume. But if you choose to go the ad supported route, know that I'm going to block your ads, so there's no point complaining about it.
- pcwalton 10y ago
  It's ignorant, insulting comments like this that give programmers a bad name among artists. Please stop.
  - idiot_stick 10y ago
    >It's ignorant, insulting comments like this that give programmers a bad name among artists. Please stop. Do you think you deserve to be paid for this comment? No? Then what are you arguing about. But while we're name-calling, you have to be pretty daft and technically illiterate to think that "creating content" is difficult, or even an ends to anything. Please stop. PS: I'm not a programmer.
    - manigandham 10y ago
      "content" has a very wide meaning and there are millions of people who have worked incredibly hard on content you read and watch online. Surely you understand this? Or are you only consuming meme gifs or something?
makecheck 10y ago
Well, the definition to me is quite simple: “a non-animating image or line of text that occupies no more than 2% of available space, served directly by the displayed web site domain”. Also, it’s definitely not just advertisers these days that make me go straight for the uBlock Origin settings panel. I’d say on 50% of browsed articles, some obnoxious component halfway down the page auto-plays a VIDEO with SOUND. This isn’t advertising, this is just some web site’s utterly misguided thinking in what a person might want when visiting a written article online over a limited data channel! And yet, “ad”-blocking tools work just as well: select obnoxious element, turn it off. (And you can sort of tell they expect you to do this now, because some of these video players are buried in about 6 layers of HTML components that appear to have no real value other than to make it harder to find the element that actually makes the video go away.)
- TeMPOraL 10y ago
  > some of these video players are buried in about 6 layers of HTML components that appear to have no real value other than to make it harder to find the element that actually makes the video go away. My impression is that this is just an unintended effect of the proliferation of JavaScript frameworks and the evolving web "best practices". Makes it no less annoying, though.
manigandham 10y ago
We're one of the companies on the committee. Lots of strong emotions here, as usual with anything ad related on HN. The fact is that advertising pays for much of the internet content you consume for free. Yes, it's not ideal and the online implementation is poorly done most of the time. It's because of perverse incentives and a lack of regulation in the entire industry that force bad formats, fraudsters, malware, and the pursuit of data and volume to win over quality and user experience. As much as I don't care for the ABP approach, it's something that can be used to actually make progress and that's what this is, progress. It's finally some outside pressure on the industry to change from the segment of the advertising mechanism that matters most - the people themselves.
- mlmlmasd 10y ago
  > The fact is that advertising pays for much of the internet content you consume for free. I've never had free internet... which ISP do you use? > It's because of perverse incentives and a lack of regulation in the entire industry that force bad formats, fraudsters, malware, and the pursuit of data and volume to win over quality and user experience. The whole point of advertising is to trick people into buying shit they don't need. > As much as I don't care for the ABP approach, it's something that can be used to actually make progress and that's what this is, progress. This is a step backwards, not progress. > It's finally some outside pressure on the industry to change from the segment of the advertising mechanism that matters most - the people themselves. Bullshit. This is a way of lifting the pressure on the industry, and this initiative is mostly supported by players in the industry. Not the people.
  - TheIronYuppie 10y ago
    DISCLOSURE: I WORK AT GOOGLE ON NOTHING AD RELATED BUT IT CERTAINLY PAYS MY SALARY. >> The fact is that advertising pays for much of the internet content you consume for free. > I've never had free internet... which ISP do you use? How many payments from Comcast to New York Times happen per year? Hint, the number rhymes with buck mall. >> It's because of perverse incentives and a lack of regulation in the entire industry that force bad formats, fraudsters, malware, and the pursuit of data and volume to win over quality and user experience. > The whole point of advertising is to trick people into buying shit they don't need. Or, it's to inform you about the stuff that's out there. It's all perspective. "Trick"? What phone do you own? I guarantee you heard about it through some form of advertisement. And before you say that it's only because you read a review about it - I 1000% guarantee you saw an ad somewhere that primed you to even read the article. >> As much as I don't care for the ABP approach, it's something that can be used to actually make progress and that's what this is, progress. > This is a step backwards, not progress. Why? >> It's finally some outside pressure on the industry to change from the segment of the advertising mechanism that matters most - the people themselves. > Bullshit. This is a way of lifting the pressure on the industry, and this initiative is mostly supported by players in the industry. Not the people. There's no one on the other side right now - ABP is at least bringing the people to the table. If you don't like it, then turn on and pay for Google Contributor (see earlier disclosure about my employer) and then no ads AND the site you visits actually get paid.
maxaf 10y ago
I'm opposed to all advertising and marketing on ethical grounds. In my book human attention isn't for sale, and all attempts to sell my attention will be dealt with by technical means with extreme prejudice. It's true that content producers need to get paid; it's not true that human attention is an acceptable currency for which this payment must be exchanged. Find some other way. Show some fucking adaptability.
- accountface 10y ago
  The current concept of advertising has been around for more than 200 years now... I think the "all ads have to go away forever" approach is doomed to fail.
  - openasocket 10y ago
    Depending on your definition, advertising has been around for millennia. Hell, there are billboard advertisements in Pompeii. https://blogs.ubc.ca/etec540sept10/2010/11/29/the-evolution-of-advertising-from-papyrus-to-youtube/ https://blogs.ubc.ca/etec540sept10/2010/11/29/the-evolution-...
  - maxaf 10y ago
    You have a point. To be fair, I don't really care what happens to advertising at large as long as advertising is kept as far away as possible from me and mine.
- manigandham 10y ago
  > it's not true that human attention is an acceptable currency Why? How about people decide what they feel is acceptable for themselves. The answer is choice between advertising and payment, ideally a slider to dial your preferred setting. Extremes never work.

50 points by shoniko 10y ago

Raise your hand if you're surprised that the only unfilled seats are the ones who will be in favor of fewer ads. I wonder how many meetings have been held already to discuss strategy, in their absence. I also wonder whether it will matter, with 7 seats for ad agencies (4+3; I'm not fooled by this "expert" bullshit for one second), and 3 for anti-ad advocates, plus some rando.

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
tgsovlerkhgsel 10y ago
The good thing is that everyone, including the ad agencies, has a motivation to not allow shitty ads. The acceptable ads program only affects people who have already demonstrated tech-savvyness (either directly or by having a relative helping with it) and unwillingness to tolerate bad ads by installing an adblocker in the first place. They know that if the ads get too annoying, people will block them completely, and they've seen how much it sucks when that happens. Hence, if they're smart, they'll try to be decent about the criteria (and might find a way to get rid of the taboola/outbrain clickbait that makes people disable acceptable ads, but is tolerated by ABP because it pays). If not, that's OK too - acceptable ads will die, and their ads will be blocked completely.

JadeNB 10y ago

Based on just a skim of the story: I'm sure that people will complain about this, and I'm sure that there genuinely is much to complain about—advertising is, almost by its nature I think, an adversarial business—but: Ever since ABP announced the Acceptable Ads program, the biggest complaint lodged against them has been that it's within their control, and so in their interest not to enforce policies strictly in their users' interest. (See https://hn.algolia.com/?query=Adblock%20Plus%20Acceptable%20Ads&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?query=Adblock%20Plus%20Acceptable%20... .) I am certain that this latest step is not perfect, but it is a step forward, and a sign of at least apparent willingness to listen to the community, and I am glad to see it.

r00fus 10y ago
I find the entire idea of "Acceptable Ads" to be the antithesis for an ad blocker. Ads are an infection vector and privacy leak. It's like concept of "acceptable groping" from an HR department. Completely at odds with their stated intent and standard ethics. Sorry, I'm now using uBlock Origin and/or Safari content blockers. I'll go with those organizations who don't have any interest/stake in permitting ads. If I am going to pay for content, I'll do so. If that's not kosher with the content producer, I'll simply abstain.
- JadeNB 10y ago
  > Ads are an infection vector and privacy leak. Both of these are undeniably true about specific ads, but surely not the genre of advertising in general? I think that magazine ads, for example, are neither infection vectors nor privacy leaks. To the extent that these can be audited, surely preventing malware distribution and respecting my privacy are part of what should be included in the definition of 'acceptable'. (If they are not included, then I would argue that that is a failure of a specific implementation of "acceptable ads", not of the notion of acceptability itself.) > It's like concept of "acceptable groping" from an HR department. Completely at odds with their stated intent and standard ethics. While that is a potent analogy, I would argue that there's a difference: most of us agree that there is no level of groping that's acceptable; whereas I _think_ that, even among those of us who would like a web with no ads, the position that there is no level of advertising that's acceptable is extreme. > Sorry, I'm now using uBlock Origin and/or Safari content blockers. I'll go with those organizations who don't have any interest/stake in permitting ads. I agree, and don't mean to argue against those options. For what it's worth, I also use µBlock; I left ABP over what I perceived as conflicts of interest, and I am not interested in going back. Nonetheless, since some people do use it, surely this divestiture from a conflict of interest is a good thing, even if it's not perfect.
  - givinguflac 10y ago
    I think the point is, if one could guarantee no malware and tracking built into an ad (you can't, no one can) then many more people would be ok with ads all over to a certain extent. I'm not sure what you're getting at with the reference to magazine ads though- magazines are basically gigantic advertisements with some content mixed in. Do you really want that for the web?

anilshanbhag 10y ago

I am surprised Google does not have a seat at the table.

JTon 10y ago
Maybe to Google attending such an event legitimizes the use of ad-blocking tech. As far as I've seen, Google has either ignored it or been hostile towards it.
- iLoch 10y ago
  They already do that with Google Contributor.
  - s3r3nity 10y ago
    Which has already been sunsetted... for a "new and better" one that hasn't launched yet, so I'm bearish. https://contributor.google.com/v/signupdisabled https://contributor.google.com/v/signupdisabled
mlmlmasd 10y ago
This whole initiative (acceptable ads) came out of Google paying off Adblock Plus. http://www.businessinsider.com/google-microsoft-amazon-taboola-pay-adblock-plus-to-stop-blocking-their-ads-2015-2 http://www.businessinsider.com/google-microsoft-amazon-taboo...

danbruc 10y ago

I just read the criteria for acceptable ads the first time. Not that I really expected otherwise, but all the criteria are just about non-intrusiveness and recognizability, tracking is not mentioned once on the entire site. At least for me blinking text is not the primary concern, it is being tracked on every click I make. So in my opinion acceptable ads is not even roughly heading in the right direction.

sgdread 10y ago
Context is the king. Ads acceptable only when their subject matches context of browsing and the user intent. And works only when done in non-interruptible manner. If you break context and/or flow, people get uncomfortable, frustrated, angry. Angry people will install ad-blockers. Some examples: - if you search for a solution on how to fix a fridge, then fridge ads are acceptable. Google does exactly that in their search. - if you're on sports stats tracking site, then athletic gear, food, etc are acceptable - if I search stackoverflow for specific problem with my code - NO ads please, I'm not in a mood to buy something. - in movies: John Wick is using TTI Glock 17 - having TTI ad near is perfectly fine (people will crave to know what's those cool things he's using). I.e. product placement is the way to go. What's happening on TV? You're watching Keanu shredding through the movie, then it suddenly stops and Chevy ad coming in. WTF?!111
- danbruc 10y ago
  As long as the context is what you are watching or searching right here and right now, that seems acceptable. If the context includes what I did a few minutes ago on another site, that is in my opinion no longer acceptable. And personally I would not mind if the entire advertising industry just went out of business, I think ads are simply a bad idea.

valine 10y ago

I'm okay with this. It's not like Adblock Plus is the only option or even the best option for ad blocking right now. I switched to uBlock Origin and never looked back.

SEJeff 10y ago

And if you don't want acceptable ads, use uBlock Origin: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/ublock-origin/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/ublock-origin... https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/ublock-origin/cjpalhdlnbpafiamejdnhcphjbkeiagm?hl=en https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/ublock-origin/cjpa... https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock

LeoPanthera 10y ago
Now recently made available for Safari! https://github.com/el1t/uBlock-Safari https://github.com/el1t/uBlock-Safari
- anexprogrammer 10y ago
  ..and despite the Readme implying it may not be stable yet and it being prerelease I've found it flawless for the 2 or 3 weeks I've been happily running it!
  - SEJeff 10y ago
    And me for the past year or so!
- Hoasi 10y ago
  Thanks for sharing! Long awaited.
k1m 10y ago
My Block Ads! site https://blockads.fivefilters.org https://blockads.fivefilters.org tries to detect your browser and recommend a suitable version of uBlock Origin. Links to Chrome, Firefox, Opera, Safari and Edge extensions. Intended to be an easy way to get friends and family to install for their browser.
ethana 10y ago
How long until the ABP guys stop their generosity and either 1) incorporate its acceptable ads into EasyList (which they maintain) or 2) block every other ad-blocker from leeching off their lists. I predict former. There are already tons of white-listed rules in EasyList. Until other ad blockers actually start to maintain their separate list, I don't see a reason to stop using ABP. Ghostery is the only extension that doesn't use EasyList as far as I know. But they too have their own telemetry tracking.

user5994461 10y ago

1) Left the acceptable ads enabled, didn't care. 2) Made a google search for "<popular software>" on my mother's computer. 3) All the first results were sponsored links from sites distributing a copy of the real software, but ridden with adware, or worse. 4) Disabled all ads without mercy. *) Switched to uBlock Origin later. ----- 5 years later... 6) Become sysadmin of a global company with more than 10 000 computers. 7) Distribute Chrome and Firefox to all of them with ad blocking software pre-installed.

HeavenBanned 10y ago
You're the hero we need.
LeoPanthera 10y ago
> with ad blocking software pre-installed Which?

CodeWriter23 10y ago

AdBlock. The software that unblocked ads. Orwell intended 1984 to be a cautionary tale, not an instruction manual.

COMPUTERLOSER 10y ago

No ads are acceptable if I choose to have an ad-blocker installed.

nilved 10y ago
Not sure why you got downvoted. I will not accept any ads.
- manigandham 10y ago
  Do you expect content producers to get paid?
  - joelthelion 10y ago
    Not through ads displayed in my browser. There are other ways to get paid, though.
    - manigandham 10y ago
      So content displayed through browser should be behind a paywall then? What if the solution is ads blocked for a fee?
      - mlmlmasd 10y ago
        > What if the solution is ads blocked for a fee? The day I have to pay to not have manipulative bullshit spammed at me is the day I say goodbye to the internet. Fuck right off.
        openasocket 10y ago
        Would you prefer a paywall? Seriously asking
        mlmlmasd 10y ago

jasonkostempski 10y ago

There are really 3 separate things lumped into the word "ads". Advertisements (obvious); annoying UI/audio/video (modal dialogs, video, etc); and 3rd-party tracking. Advertisements in general I accept and I don't have any desire to prevent people or companies from including it in their own content, although, if included, I'll likely view the content as less reputable and the creator as having less integrity. Some people flat-out hate all ads and that's why they have an ad blocker. Their acceptable ad list would have 0 entries. Tracking is a non-starter for me, advertising is possible without tracking but it's not generally done that way, it works for TV and radio. Most "ad" networks don't actually give a hoot about advertising, they care about tracking and tricking companies into footing the bill for collecting the data. I use my ad blocker as a tracking blocker, I wouldn't have bothered to install it if tracking weren't possible. I have no qualms about preventing someone from collecting information about me. I'd want anything ads that come from a third-party to be off the acceptable ad list (effectively an empty list). Annoying UI I can tolerate to a point. Most of this is blocked by my "ad" blocker so I only see how bad it really is out there in the wild when I forget to install it. Assuming the ad blocker didn't do that, if things get too annoying I'd leave the site, if I find myself returning to the site and getting annoyed often, I'll filter out links to the site wherever I can. There are handful of really annoying sites that come up often enough that I've made a browser plug-in for myself to do link filtering on. Right now most of the sites on the list have a pay-wall or "ad" block blocker and keep playing the cat & mouse game and winning (good for them, they must imagine Sisyphus happy). This is how I wish "ad blocking" worked: Community driven list of "bad players", bad being any tracking, dark patterns, or very annoying UI; links to bad players get removed from all pages, I never want to see them or their click-baity titles ever again; white-list for site you want to let track, trick and annoy you; grey-list for sites you want to see but still block in the traditional way. This would also provide feedback to bad players, giving them a chance to change their ways and new players would fear getting added.

manigandham 10y ago
> Most "ad" networks don't actually give a hoot about advertising, they care about tracking and tricking companies into footing the bill for collecting the data. Where did you get this info from? Ad networks care very much about the ads.

mlmlmasd 10y ago

Fuck off ABP. Use uBlock Origin.

idiot_stick 10y ago

>Do you expect content producers to get paid? Expect? No. "Producing content" isn't difficult, nor is anyone entitled to profit from it.

manigandham 10y ago
How would you solve this? Paywalls for everything?
- idiot_stick 10y ago
  >How would you solve this? Paywalls for everything? Sure, why not. I don't care. I have zero problem finding content I want via a variety of methods, free and paid. I have more content than I can consume. But if you choose to go the ad supported route, know that I'm going to block your ads, so there's no point complaining about it.
pcwalton 10y ago
It's ignorant, insulting comments like this that give programmers a bad name among artists. Please stop.
- idiot_stick 10y ago
  >It's ignorant, insulting comments like this that give programmers a bad name among artists. Please stop. Do you think you deserve to be paid for this comment? No? Then what are you arguing about. But while we're name-calling, you have to be pretty daft and technically illiterate to think that "creating content" is difficult, or even an ends to anything. Please stop. PS: I'm not a programmer.
  - manigandham 10y ago
    "content" has a very wide meaning and there are millions of people who have worked incredibly hard on content you read and watch online. Surely you understand this? Or are you only consuming meme gifs or something?

makecheck 10y ago

Well, the definition to me is quite simple: “a non-animating image or line of text that occupies no more than 2% of available space, served directly by the displayed web site domain”. Also, it’s definitely not just advertisers these days that make me go straight for the uBlock Origin settings panel. I’d say on 50% of browsed articles, some obnoxious component halfway down the page auto-plays a VIDEO with SOUND. This isn’t advertising, this is just some web site’s utterly misguided thinking in what a person might want when visiting a written article online over a limited data channel! And yet, “ad”-blocking tools work just as well: select obnoxious element, turn it off. (And you can sort of tell they expect you to do this now, because some of these video players are buried in about 6 layers of HTML components that appear to have no real value other than to make it harder to find the element that actually makes the video go away.)

TeMPOraL 10y ago
> some of these video players are buried in about 6 layers of HTML components that appear to have no real value other than to make it harder to find the element that actually makes the video go away. My impression is that this is just an unintended effect of the proliferation of JavaScript frameworks and the evolving web "best practices". Makes it no less annoying, though.

manigandham 10y ago

We're one of the companies on the committee. Lots of strong emotions here, as usual with anything ad related on HN. The fact is that advertising pays for much of the internet content you consume for free. Yes, it's not ideal and the online implementation is poorly done most of the time. It's because of perverse incentives and a lack of regulation in the entire industry that force bad formats, fraudsters, malware, and the pursuit of data and volume to win over quality and user experience. As much as I don't care for the ABP approach, it's something that can be used to actually make progress and that's what this is, progress. It's finally some outside pressure on the industry to change from the segment of the advertising mechanism that matters most - the people themselves.

mlmlmasd 10y ago
> The fact is that advertising pays for much of the internet content you consume for free. I've never had free internet... which ISP do you use? > It's because of perverse incentives and a lack of regulation in the entire industry that force bad formats, fraudsters, malware, and the pursuit of data and volume to win over quality and user experience. The whole point of advertising is to trick people into buying shit they don't need. > As much as I don't care for the ABP approach, it's something that can be used to actually make progress and that's what this is, progress. This is a step backwards, not progress. > It's finally some outside pressure on the industry to change from the segment of the advertising mechanism that matters most - the people themselves. Bullshit. This is a way of lifting the pressure on the industry, and this initiative is mostly supported by players in the industry. Not the people.
- TheIronYuppie 10y ago
  DISCLOSURE: I WORK AT GOOGLE ON NOTHING AD RELATED BUT IT CERTAINLY PAYS MY SALARY. >> The fact is that advertising pays for much of the internet content you consume for free. > I've never had free internet... which ISP do you use? How many payments from Comcast to New York Times happen per year? Hint, the number rhymes with buck mall. >> It's because of perverse incentives and a lack of regulation in the entire industry that force bad formats, fraudsters, malware, and the pursuit of data and volume to win over quality and user experience. > The whole point of advertising is to trick people into buying shit they don't need. Or, it's to inform you about the stuff that's out there. It's all perspective. "Trick"? What phone do you own? I guarantee you heard about it through some form of advertisement. And before you say that it's only because you read a review about it - I 1000% guarantee you saw an ad somewhere that primed you to even read the article. >> As much as I don't care for the ABP approach, it's something that can be used to actually make progress and that's what this is, progress. > This is a step backwards, not progress. Why? >> It's finally some outside pressure on the industry to change from the segment of the advertising mechanism that matters most - the people themselves. > Bullshit. This is a way of lifting the pressure on the industry, and this initiative is mostly supported by players in the industry. Not the people. There's no one on the other side right now - ABP is at least bringing the people to the table. If you don't like it, then turn on and pay for Google Contributor (see earlier disclosure about my employer) and then no ads AND the site you visits actually get paid.

maxaf 10y ago

I'm opposed to all advertising and marketing on ethical grounds. In my book human attention isn't for sale, and all attempts to sell my attention will be dealt with by technical means with extreme prejudice. It's true that content producers need to get paid; it's not true that human attention is an acceptable currency for which this payment must be exchanged. Find some other way. Show some fucking adaptability.

accountface 10y ago
The current concept of advertising has been around for more than 200 years now... I think the "all ads have to go away forever" approach is doomed to fail.
- openasocket 10y ago
  Depending on your definition, advertising has been around for millennia. Hell, there are billboard advertisements in Pompeii. https://blogs.ubc.ca/etec540sept10/2010/11/29/the-evolution-of-advertising-from-papyrus-to-youtube/ https://blogs.ubc.ca/etec540sept10/2010/11/29/the-evolution-...
- maxaf 10y ago
  You have a point. To be fair, I don't really care what happens to advertising at large as long as advertising is kept as far away as possible from me and mine.
manigandham 10y ago
> it's not true that human attention is an acceptable currency Why? How about people decide what they feel is acceptable for themselves. The answer is choice between advertising and payment, ideally a slider to dial your preferred setting. Extremes never work.