5 ms·

But a senior engineer in Vancouver makes less than a coffee-fetching intern in SF.

mck- 10y ago
In a scenario where more YC companies set up shop in Vancouver, and US investors follow to bet on the next Slack up here, then this will naturally change as a function of supply/demand.
- drpgq 10y ago
  Maybe, although taxes are a lot higher in Canada for anything beyond an average salary.
  - Kluny 10y ago
    Yes, but you get healthcare and being non-white isn't illegal, so that helps. Also - not really? The highest federal tax bracket in Canada is 33%. The highest in the states is 39%. The highest provincial rate in BC is 12% and that's about the same as California. I'm sure there's a lot of variation depending on an individual's situation, but you're really deluding yourself if you think American taxes are low, for the shit deal you guys get. [1] California: http://www.bankrate.com/finance/taxes/state-taxes-california.aspx http://www.bankrate.com/finance/taxes/state-taxes-california... [2] BC: http://www.taxtips.ca/taxrates/bc.htm http://www.taxtips.ca/taxrates/bc.htm [3] US Federal: https://www.irs.com/articles/projected-us-tax-rates-2016 https://www.irs.com/articles/projected-us-tax-rates-2016 [4] Canada Federal: http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/ndvdls/fq/txrts-eng.html http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/ndvdls/fq/txrts-eng.html
    - refurb 10y ago
      Yes, but you get healthcare and being non-white isn't illegal, so that helps. That made me chuckle. You think Canada doesn't have racists? Good lord. And sure, if you just look at the income tax rates BC looks reasonable. Of course, if you look closer at the actual income brackets for each rate, it looks very different. That doesn't even include the sales tax (up to 15% in some provinces), taxes on alcohol, gas, etc.
      - Kluny 10y ago
        I was being facetious, and yes, we do absolutely have racists, and yes, most of the people in our prisons are not white (they're First Nations, in our case). Even so, we don't quite have the same legal system that seems to systematically lock up non-white people in bulk. A lower percentage of our population is in jail, they stay in for less time, and we have less violent crime overall. If you aren't white, I feel confident in saying you'll feel welcome here and won't get arrested for walking down the wrong street along at night.
        refurb 10y ago
        You mean the same Canada whose police would pick up drunk First Nations men, drive them out of town and let them freeze to death?[1] [1]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saskatoon_freezing_deaths https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saskatoon_freezing_deaths
        pcthrowaway 10y ago
        I'm sure Canada has had several such incidents (some that happened more recently than 17 years ago), but I'd wager that you're still safer here from the police (across the board, but especially for minorities), than you are in the U.S.
        K0SM0S 10y ago
        Frankly, seen from Europe, most things 'police', 'safety', 'justice' are nothing short of wtf-grade in the US. It's surreal, it's one of the closest thing there is to dystopia (of the wrong kind) in the west. Arguably SF/Bay is a bit of an island (even politically) but still deeply embedded in the rather 'extreme' US culture. By comparison Canada, much like Sweden or Switzerland here, feels like a pretty 'normal' country overall, much more reasonable in many regards. And it's safer there's no question about it.
        adventured 10y ago
        Sweden is now the rape capital of the West, with a rape rate twice that of the US. Its violent crime has skyrocketed the last 20 years and looks to keep getting worse. How do you consider that pretty normal? Further, Europe on average has a higher violent crime rate than the US. Europe's largest nation by population - Russia - has nearly four times the murder rate of the US.
    - sanguine234 10y ago
      Please watch this, it is not only funny but clear and real picture of Canadian healthcare. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2jijuj1ysw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2jijuj1ysw
    - adventured 10y ago
      > and being non-white isn't illegal You sure about that? Canada is, 78% white, 92% white + asian, only 1.2% hispanic and only 2.9% black. 700 million hispanics in the Americas, and Canada somehow only has ~300,000. The US is around 15%-16% black by comparison, and 20% or more hispanic. Sure sounds like it may be illegal to be non-white in Canada, how else to explain the lack of diversity?
  - JamilD 10y ago
    That's a common misconception. I paid more in US + California taxes than Canada + Ontario taxes at the same company, same salary, when I moved location.
    - Pxtl 10y ago
      Yeah, you'd be surprised by how many tax dollars you can save by not obliterating a 3rd world country once every few years :)
    - deleted 10y ago
      [deleted]
    - drpgq 10y ago
      I'm skeptical, because both Ontario and the feds have raised the higher tax brackets in the last few years, plus the dollar is around 74 cents to the US dollar now.
  - vkou 10y ago
    The highest marginal income tax rate in Vancouver, BC is 47%. The highest marginal income tax rate in California is 52%. For that tax money, in Vancouver, you will also get free* healthcare. In San Francisco, you will get... Actually, I'm not sure what you'll get. The biggest prison system in the world? The biggest military in the world? * At the higher tax brackets, you will need to pay a $1,800/year MSP premium for a family, or $900/year for an individual.
    - drpgq 10y ago
      Yeah but where do those highest marginal rates kick in? Especially with the Canadian dollar this week being around 74 cents.
      - vkou 10y ago
        Compare for yourself. https://smartasset.com/taxes/california-tax-calculator#IrgvHiKwtv https://smartasset.com/taxes/california-tax-calculator#IrgvH... https://simpletax.ca/calculator https://simpletax.ca/calculator At wages of (All amounts are in USD): $100,000 USD, $200,000 USD, and $400,000 USD, you will pay: $32,000, $69,000, and $159,000 in taxes in California. $28,000, $73,500, $169,000 in taxes in BC. But that's just income tax. There's also Social Security/Unemployment Insurance contributions. In the US, 13%[1] of your salary up to $130,000 will go to social security contributions. In Canada, 10% of your salary, up to $40,000 USD will go towards the CPP and Unemployment Insurance. So, at the $100,000 USD salary, you will pay $45,000 in taxes in California. In BC, you will pay $32,000 in taxes. At $200,000 USD, you will pay $86,000 in taxes in California. In BC, you will pay... $77,500. At pretty much every tax bracket, you will pay more taxes in California, and get less for them, then you would in BC. As it turns out, maintaining twelve super-aircraft carrier groups is expensive. Mind you, BC is not all flowers and roses. The provincial government runs the place with all the integrity and forward-thinking of a banana republic. [1] Yes, your employer pays half of it. That money would have otherwise gone towards your salary.
branchless 10y ago
They are both disgusting.

mck- 10y ago

In a scenario where more YC companies set up shop in Vancouver, and US investors follow to bet on the next Slack up here, then this will naturally change as a function of supply/demand.

drpgq 10y ago
Maybe, although taxes are a lot higher in Canada for anything beyond an average salary.
- Kluny 10y ago
  Yes, but you get healthcare and being non-white isn't illegal, so that helps. Also - not really? The highest federal tax bracket in Canada is 33%. The highest in the states is 39%. The highest provincial rate in BC is 12% and that's about the same as California. I'm sure there's a lot of variation depending on an individual's situation, but you're really deluding yourself if you think American taxes are low, for the shit deal you guys get. [1] California: http://www.bankrate.com/finance/taxes/state-taxes-california.aspx http://www.bankrate.com/finance/taxes/state-taxes-california... [2] BC: http://www.taxtips.ca/taxrates/bc.htm http://www.taxtips.ca/taxrates/bc.htm [3] US Federal: https://www.irs.com/articles/projected-us-tax-rates-2016 https://www.irs.com/articles/projected-us-tax-rates-2016 [4] Canada Federal: http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/ndvdls/fq/txrts-eng.html http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/ndvdls/fq/txrts-eng.html
  - refurb 10y ago
    Yes, but you get healthcare and being non-white isn't illegal, so that helps. That made me chuckle. You think Canada doesn't have racists? Good lord. And sure, if you just look at the income tax rates BC looks reasonable. Of course, if you look closer at the actual income brackets for each rate, it looks very different. That doesn't even include the sales tax (up to 15% in some provinces), taxes on alcohol, gas, etc.
    - Kluny 10y ago
      I was being facetious, and yes, we do absolutely have racists, and yes, most of the people in our prisons are not white (they're First Nations, in our case). Even so, we don't quite have the same legal system that seems to systematically lock up non-white people in bulk. A lower percentage of our population is in jail, they stay in for less time, and we have less violent crime overall. If you aren't white, I feel confident in saying you'll feel welcome here and won't get arrested for walking down the wrong street along at night.
      - refurb 10y ago
        You mean the same Canada whose police would pick up drunk First Nations men, drive them out of town and let them freeze to death?[1] [1]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saskatoon_freezing_deaths https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saskatoon_freezing_deaths
        pcthrowaway 10y ago
        I'm sure Canada has had several such incidents (some that happened more recently than 17 years ago), but I'd wager that you're still safer here from the police (across the board, but especially for minorities), than you are in the U.S.
        K0SM0S 10y ago
        Frankly, seen from Europe, most things 'police', 'safety', 'justice' are nothing short of wtf-grade in the US. It's surreal, it's one of the closest thing there is to dystopia (of the wrong kind) in the west. Arguably SF/Bay is a bit of an island (even politically) but still deeply embedded in the rather 'extreme' US culture. By comparison Canada, much like Sweden or Switzerland here, feels like a pretty 'normal' country overall, much more reasonable in many regards. And it's safer there's no question about it.
        adventured 10y ago
        Sweden is now the rape capital of the West, with a rape rate twice that of the US. Its violent crime has skyrocketed the last 20 years and looks to keep getting worse. How do you consider that pretty normal? Further, Europe on average has a higher violent crime rate than the US. Europe's largest nation by population - Russia - has nearly four times the murder rate of the US.
  - sanguine234 10y ago
    Please watch this, it is not only funny but clear and real picture of Canadian healthcare. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2jijuj1ysw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2jijuj1ysw
  - adventured 10y ago
    > and being non-white isn't illegal You sure about that? Canada is, 78% white, 92% white + asian, only 1.2% hispanic and only 2.9% black. 700 million hispanics in the Americas, and Canada somehow only has ~300,000. The US is around 15%-16% black by comparison, and 20% or more hispanic. Sure sounds like it may be illegal to be non-white in Canada, how else to explain the lack of diversity?
- JamilD 10y ago
  That's a common misconception. I paid more in US + California taxes than Canada + Ontario taxes at the same company, same salary, when I moved location.
  - Pxtl 10y ago
    Yeah, you'd be surprised by how many tax dollars you can save by not obliterating a 3rd world country once every few years :)
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
  - drpgq 10y ago
    I'm skeptical, because both Ontario and the feds have raised the higher tax brackets in the last few years, plus the dollar is around 74 cents to the US dollar now.
- vkou 10y ago
  The highest marginal income tax rate in Vancouver, BC is 47%. The highest marginal income tax rate in California is 52%. For that tax money, in Vancouver, you will also get free* healthcare. In San Francisco, you will get... Actually, I'm not sure what you'll get. The biggest prison system in the world? The biggest military in the world? * At the higher tax brackets, you will need to pay a $1,800/year MSP premium for a family, or $900/year for an individual.
  - drpgq 10y ago
    Yeah but where do those highest marginal rates kick in? Especially with the Canadian dollar this week being around 74 cents.
    - vkou 10y ago
      Compare for yourself. https://smartasset.com/taxes/california-tax-calculator#IrgvHiKwtv https://smartasset.com/taxes/california-tax-calculator#IrgvH... https://simpletax.ca/calculator https://simpletax.ca/calculator At wages of (All amounts are in USD): $100,000 USD, $200,000 USD, and $400,000 USD, you will pay: $32,000, $69,000, and $159,000 in taxes in California. $28,000, $73,500, $169,000 in taxes in BC. But that's just income tax. There's also Social Security/Unemployment Insurance contributions. In the US, 13%[1] of your salary up to $130,000 will go to social security contributions. In Canada, 10% of your salary, up to $40,000 USD will go towards the CPP and Unemployment Insurance. So, at the $100,000 USD salary, you will pay $45,000 in taxes in California. In BC, you will pay $32,000 in taxes. At $200,000 USD, you will pay $86,000 in taxes in California. In BC, you will pay... $77,500. At pretty much every tax bracket, you will pay more taxes in California, and get less for them, then you would in BC. As it turns out, maintaining twelve super-aircraft carrier groups is expensive. Mind you, BC is not all flowers and roses. The provincial government runs the place with all the integrity and forward-thinking of a banana republic. [1] Yes, your employer pays half of it. That money would have otherwise gone towards your salary.

branchless 10y ago

They are both disgusting.