5 ms·

There are studies performed on this stuff by actual economists out there, to save you using self-reporting surveys from online recruitment companies. http://sp

by anjc 10y ago

There are studies performed on this stuff by actual economists out there, to save you using self-reporting surveys from online recruitment companies. http://spectrum.ieee.org/at-work/education/the-stem-crisis-is-a-myth http://spectrum.ieee.org/at-work/education/the-stem-crisis-i... http://www.epi.org/publication/pm195-stem-labor-shortages-microsoft-report-distorts/ http://www.epi.org/publication/pm195-stem-labor-shortages-mi... >The average hourly wage for college-educated workers in computer and math occupations rose 5.3 percent over 11 years, from $37.27 in 2000 to $39.24 in 2011 (in 2012 dollars), which translates to an average wage increase of less than half a percent per year. If a labor shortage existed in these occupations, one would expect wages to rise sharply as employers try to lure scarce workers to their firms.

arjie 10y ago
2000? At the peak of the dot-com boom?
- crusso 10y ago
  Yeah, that's the part that had me scratching my head. Any study that makes no attempt to smooth out dramatic outlier time periods is highly suspect.
yummyfajitas 10y ago
If your study is claiming that software engineer compensation rose no more rapidly than the population at as a whole (they also saw a 5% increase), then something is deeply wrong with your study. Note that "Computer and math occupations" is a broad catch-all term which includes all sorts of professions, such as: Computer User Support Specialist: Provide technical assistance to computer users. Answer questions or resolve computer problems for clients in person, or via telephone or electronically. May provide assistance concerning the use of computer hardware and software, including printing, installation, word processing, electronic mail, and operating systems. Excludes "Network and Computer Systems Administrators" (15-1142). https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes150000.htm https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes150000.htm https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes151151.htm https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes151151.htm No one claimed that the guy who fixes your printer or helps you change the font in word experienced large pay increases.
- anjc 10y ago
  If your contention that it rose is based on your experience in SV or NY or similar, then you're probably not getting a complete picture of the state of the industry.
- Amezarak 10y ago
  Here in flyover country, companies are paying new-grad software engineers 30-38k.
  - valuearb 10y ago
    Here in dirt poor arizona new grad software engineers make $70K+
  - nostrebored 10y ago
    And how does cost of living compare? Median salary?
    - Amezarak 10y ago
      Don't get me wrong, the cost of living is much lower than SV, but there are several major industries here that pay 2-3x that rate for less skilled work. Even many service-type jobs pay better. A buddy of mine that dropped out of college was making more money than I did right out of school managing McDonald's. I personally left software engineering (regretfully, I love it, and still do what personal projects I can) to do a government job that is at least somewhat technical that constituted a massive raise over my old salary - and as I worked there for a few years and was a high performer, I did get several big raises before leaving.
  - mywittyname 10y ago
    Do you have an actual tech sector where you're at though. I also live in a flyover state and the average salary for a software engineer is $91,894, and that's well below the national average. For S&G, I looked up salaries for software engineers in some random cities in the middle of nowhere and I have yet to find a place with an average salary close to that. Edmond, OK: 73,005; Eden Prairie, MN: 77,325 (23% below the national average); and the worst so far: Tuscaloosa, AL: $62,020. Perhaps a few companies can get away paying so little, but it's hard to say that's the norm when they are so far below average, even for towns in the middle of nowhere.

by anjc 10y ago

arjie 10y ago

2000? At the peak of the dot-com boom?

crusso 10y ago
Yeah, that's the part that had me scratching my head. Any study that makes no attempt to smooth out dramatic outlier time periods is highly suspect.

yummyfajitas 10y ago

If your study is claiming that software engineer compensation rose no more rapidly than the population at as a whole (they also saw a 5% increase), then something is deeply wrong with your study. Note that "Computer and math occupations" is a broad catch-all term which includes all sorts of professions, such as: Computer User Support Specialist: Provide technical assistance to computer users. Answer questions or resolve computer problems for clients in person, or via telephone or electronically. May provide assistance concerning the use of computer hardware and software, including printing, installation, word processing, electronic mail, and operating systems. Excludes "Network and Computer Systems Administrators" (15-1142). https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes150000.htm https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes150000.htm https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes151151.htm https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes151151.htm No one claimed that the guy who fixes your printer or helps you change the font in word experienced large pay increases.

anjc 10y ago
If your contention that it rose is based on your experience in SV or NY or similar, then you're probably not getting a complete picture of the state of the industry.
Amezarak 10y ago
Here in flyover country, companies are paying new-grad software engineers 30-38k.
- valuearb 10y ago
  Here in dirt poor arizona new grad software engineers make $70K+
- nostrebored 10y ago
  And how does cost of living compare? Median salary?
  - Amezarak 10y ago
    Don't get me wrong, the cost of living is much lower than SV, but there are several major industries here that pay 2-3x that rate for less skilled work. Even many service-type jobs pay better. A buddy of mine that dropped out of college was making more money than I did right out of school managing McDonald's. I personally left software engineering (regretfully, I love it, and still do what personal projects I can) to do a government job that is at least somewhat technical that constituted a massive raise over my old salary - and as I worked there for a few years and was a high performer, I did get several big raises before leaving.
- mywittyname 10y ago
  Do you have an actual tech sector where you're at though. I also live in a flyover state and the average salary for a software engineer is $91,894, and that's well below the national average. For S&G, I looked up salaries for software engineers in some random cities in the middle of nowhere and I have yet to find a place with an average salary close to that. Edmond, OK: 73,005; Eden Prairie, MN: 77,325 (23% below the national average); and the worst so far: Tuscaloosa, AL: $62,020. Perhaps a few companies can get away paying so little, but it's hard to say that's the norm when they are so far below average, even for towns in the middle of nowhere.