5 ms·

How about thermal printer receipts? Most are coated with BPA. How many are in your pocket right now? How about the fact that most McDonalds grill their burge

How about thermal printer receipts? Most are coated with BPA. How many are in your pocket right now? How about the fact that most McDonalds grill their burgers on grills that are covered with disposable teflon sheets? They don't tell the public that.

gumby 10y ago
> How about thermal printer receipts? Most are coated with BPA. BPA on thermal paper is indeed a worry (and of course most those "BPA-free" bottles use a different bisphenol plasticizer, just not bisphenol-A). > How about the fact that most McDonalds grill their burgers on grills that are covered with disposable teflon sheets? They don't tell the public that. But a teflon sheet? Teflon is so tightly linked that it is inert that is why it's non-stick! Yes, its production process is quite toxic, and of course if you heat it to the point of breaking it down you'll get toxic byproducts the will kill birds (with their hyper efficient gas exchange systems...that we don't have). I seriously doubt they heat their grills to 400 F. I once swallowed some strips of teflon tape (settling an argument with a friend...) and they were bright white and intact (sharp edges where cut were still sharp) on the way out.
- justin66 10y ago
  > if you heat it to the point of breaking it down you'll get toxic byproducts the will kill birds (with their hyper efficient gas exchange systems...that we don't have). Strange comment. Those fumes are rather unfriendly to humans, as well. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymer_fume_fever https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymer_fume_fever
  - stronglikedan 10y ago
    The key word is "kill". While it may cause this fever in humans, it won't kill them. However, it will kill birds, because of "their hyper efficient gas exchange systems...that we don't have". That's my takeaway, at least.
- jsight 10y ago
  It is hard to find data, but it sounds like the grill temp could range as high as 425 F.
  - joezydeco 10y ago
    Recipes vary, but many go up to 375F (at least in this McD engineering document) https://www.filepicker.io/api/file/9dQcRSZ8TMeeM7Y8Lx6w https://www.filepicker.io/api/file/9dQcRSZ8TMeeM7Y8Lx6w I want to believe that teflon is indeed totally inert until 500F, but somehow I just don't trust that. It's the low-temp PFOA leakage into the product I'm looking at here, not the fumes released at higher temps. If the wrappers are doing it at ambient, what's happening at cooking temperatures?
    - dpark 10y ago
      Why not? Given the number of people paranoid about teflon, I'd expect someone would have demonstrated the danger at lower temperatures by now if it exists.
      - joezydeco 10y ago
        That's we thought about the wrappers.
        dpark 10y ago
        3M agreed 15 years ago to phase out PFOA. We know (and knew) these chemicals were dangerous. Teflon has been heavily studied and widely used and we still don't have any evidence that it's dangerous.
    - nate_meurer 10y ago
      Absolutely, don't trust it. The fact of Teflon's extreme toxicity at temperatures commonly encountered in cooking is undisputed. Quoting from http://www.ewg.org/research/canaries-kitchen/teflon-offgas-studies http://www.ewg.org/research/canaries-kitchen/teflon-offgas-s...: > The lowest temperature at which nonstick coatings have been reported to kill birds in a peer-reviewed study is 396°F (202°C) That website offers a lot of evidence regarding Teflon's toxicity in other animals as well, but birds seem by far the most sensitive. Granted now, birds ain't humans. In particular, our unusually massive and efficient livers protect us from a lot of things that readily kill other animals (e.g., aflatoxin, which we withstand in much higher doses than most other creatures). But this just tells us that our bodies are somehow coping with the poison enough to allow our survival. It doesn't tell us the poison is harmless to us, and IMO fluorocarbon toxicity in humans has been woefully understudied.
- ScottBurson 10y ago
  The breakdown products of Teflon are also toxic to the prostate, as I found out personally once by eating lots of eggs scrambled in a Teflon skillet. I avoid it now.
  - koenigdavidmj 10y ago
    How much breakdown would really occur? If the whole point of Teflon is not to stick or react at all, I would expect that if you eat a brick of Teflon, you crap a brick of Teflon.
  - nate_meurer 10y ago
    Would you mind saying more about what happened to you?
    - ScottBurson 10y ago
      I don't remember exactly how long I had been using this skillet for my eggs -- a couple of months, perhaps, no more. I started having urinary difficulties, went to my doctor, and was diagnosed with Benign Prostate Hyperplasia. He didn't identify any specific cause nor prescribe any treatment, but somehow I got the idea that it might be the Teflon and stopped using it. The problem, which I had never had before, went away and has not recurred. It's possible this particular skillet had been overheated at some point, though I certainly wasn't using high heat to scramble eggs. But still, why take the chance? The ceramic non-stick surfaces you can get these days work well enough and are much safer (AFAIK, anyway).
      - nate_meurer 10y ago
        Interesting, thanks.
  - ars 10y ago
    Sorry, but that's pretty much impossible. The breakdown products of Teflon don't show up until temperatures at which your eggs would be charcoal. Teflon will not break down until temperature above 500F 260C - and if you were cooking your eggs that hot you were doing it wrong.
- rhcom2 10y ago
  > I once swallowed some strips of teflon tape (settling an argument with a friend...) and they were bright white and intact (sharp edges where cut were still sharp) on the way out. Oh god, thank goodness it didn't cut up your insides on the way out.
  - zepto 10y ago
    How do you know it didn't?
    - gumby 10y ago
      Ha ha! When I said "sharp" I meant "clearly defined" -- i.e. not broken down or visibly affected by the digestive process.
refurb 10y ago
We implant medical devices containing components entirely made our of teflon. If the FDA has deemed that low risk, I'm OK eating food that been cooking on it. Not to mention a ton of non-stick pans have telfon coatings.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

gumby 10y ago

> How about thermal printer receipts? Most are coated with BPA. BPA on thermal paper is indeed a worry (and of course most those "BPA-free" bottles use a different bisphenol plasticizer, just not bisphenol-A). > How about the fact that most McDonalds grill their burgers on grills that are covered with disposable teflon sheets? They don't tell the public that. But a teflon sheet? Teflon is so tightly linked that it is inert that is why it's non-stick! Yes, its production process is quite toxic, and of course if you heat it to the point of breaking it down you'll get toxic byproducts the will kill birds (with their hyper efficient gas exchange systems...that we don't have). I seriously doubt they heat their grills to 400 F. I once swallowed some strips of teflon tape (settling an argument with a friend...) and they were bright white and intact (sharp edges where cut were still sharp) on the way out.

justin66 10y ago
> if you heat it to the point of breaking it down you'll get toxic byproducts the will kill birds (with their hyper efficient gas exchange systems...that we don't have). Strange comment. Those fumes are rather unfriendly to humans, as well. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymer_fume_fever https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymer_fume_fever
- stronglikedan 10y ago
  The key word is "kill". While it may cause this fever in humans, it won't kill them. However, it will kill birds, because of "their hyper efficient gas exchange systems...that we don't have". That's my takeaway, at least.
jsight 10y ago
It is hard to find data, but it sounds like the grill temp could range as high as 425 F.
- joezydeco 10y ago
  Recipes vary, but many go up to 375F (at least in this McD engineering document) https://www.filepicker.io/api/file/9dQcRSZ8TMeeM7Y8Lx6w https://www.filepicker.io/api/file/9dQcRSZ8TMeeM7Y8Lx6w I want to believe that teflon is indeed totally inert until 500F, but somehow I just don't trust that. It's the low-temp PFOA leakage into the product I'm looking at here, not the fumes released at higher temps. If the wrappers are doing it at ambient, what's happening at cooking temperatures?
  - dpark 10y ago
    Why not? Given the number of people paranoid about teflon, I'd expect someone would have demonstrated the danger at lower temperatures by now if it exists.
    - joezydeco 10y ago
      That's we thought about the wrappers.
      - dpark 10y ago
        3M agreed 15 years ago to phase out PFOA. We know (and knew) these chemicals were dangerous. Teflon has been heavily studied and widely used and we still don't have any evidence that it's dangerous.
  - nate_meurer 10y ago
    Absolutely, don't trust it. The fact of Teflon's extreme toxicity at temperatures commonly encountered in cooking is undisputed. Quoting from http://www.ewg.org/research/canaries-kitchen/teflon-offgas-studies http://www.ewg.org/research/canaries-kitchen/teflon-offgas-s...: > The lowest temperature at which nonstick coatings have been reported to kill birds in a peer-reviewed study is 396°F (202°C) That website offers a lot of evidence regarding Teflon's toxicity in other animals as well, but birds seem by far the most sensitive. Granted now, birds ain't humans. In particular, our unusually massive and efficient livers protect us from a lot of things that readily kill other animals (e.g., aflatoxin, which we withstand in much higher doses than most other creatures). But this just tells us that our bodies are somehow coping with the poison enough to allow our survival. It doesn't tell us the poison is harmless to us, and IMO fluorocarbon toxicity in humans has been woefully understudied.
ScottBurson 10y ago
The breakdown products of Teflon are also toxic to the prostate, as I found out personally once by eating lots of eggs scrambled in a Teflon skillet. I avoid it now.
- koenigdavidmj 10y ago
  How much breakdown would really occur? If the whole point of Teflon is not to stick or react at all, I would expect that if you eat a brick of Teflon, you crap a brick of Teflon.
- nate_meurer 10y ago
  Would you mind saying more about what happened to you?
  - ScottBurson 10y ago
    I don't remember exactly how long I had been using this skillet for my eggs -- a couple of months, perhaps, no more. I started having urinary difficulties, went to my doctor, and was diagnosed with Benign Prostate Hyperplasia. He didn't identify any specific cause nor prescribe any treatment, but somehow I got the idea that it might be the Teflon and stopped using it. The problem, which I had never had before, went away and has not recurred. It's possible this particular skillet had been overheated at some point, though I certainly wasn't using high heat to scramble eggs. But still, why take the chance? The ceramic non-stick surfaces you can get these days work well enough and are much safer (AFAIK, anyway).
    - nate_meurer 10y ago
      Interesting, thanks.
- ars 10y ago
  Sorry, but that's pretty much impossible. The breakdown products of Teflon don't show up until temperatures at which your eggs would be charcoal. Teflon will not break down until temperature above 500F 260C - and if you were cooking your eggs that hot you were doing it wrong.
rhcom2 10y ago
> I once swallowed some strips of teflon tape (settling an argument with a friend...) and they were bright white and intact (sharp edges where cut were still sharp) on the way out. Oh god, thank goodness it didn't cut up your insides on the way out.
- zepto 10y ago
  How do you know it didn't?
  - gumby 10y ago
    Ha ha! When I said "sharp" I meant "clearly defined" -- i.e. not broken down or visibly affected by the digestive process.

refurb 10y ago

We implant medical devices containing components entirely made our of teflon. If the FDA has deemed that low risk, I'm OK eating food that been cooking on it. Not to mention a ton of non-stick pans have telfon coatings.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]