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Lyft donates $1M to the ACLU, condemns Trump’s immigration actions
- Pfhreak 10y agoUber undermining the taxi strike [1] yesterday was pretty visible -- at least in my social circle here in Seattle -- and when Lyft made this announcement we all deleted our Uber accounts. Will that have a material impact on anyone's bottom line? Who knows, but I'd love to see the graphs for new account signups/account deletions. [1] Taxis were not servicing JFK in support of those who were being detained there.
- jamalex 10y agoFor convenience, here's a link to the Uber help page for deleting your account: https://help.uber.com/h/24010fe7-7a67-4ee5-9938-c734000b144a https://help.uber.com/h/24010fe7-7a67-4ee5-9938-c734000b144a (They even give you a nice box to explain why)
- jasonbarone 10y agoFor convenience, here's a link to the Lyft help page for deleting your account: https://help.lyft.com/hc/en-us/articles/223281567-Delete-My-Account- https://help.lyft.com/hc/en-us/articles/223281567-Delete-My-.... Unforunately, it's not possible to do yourself. Both Lyft and Uber didn't suspend service to JFK last night because both are 24/7 platforms for anyone to drive and make money. Uber lowered/suspended surge pricing to make it affordable in/around the protests, while Lyft did not. Worth noting is that active drivers on both platforms were likely protesting at airports all over the world.
- banku_brougham 10y agocould you post the account setup page please? i've never used lyft, i assume its basically the same service?
- thesmallestcat 10y agoIt's an inferior service: Much longer waits for a ride, higher fares, tipping, awkward interactions, fewer ride options, buggy (in my experience) phone apps.
- gumby 10y agoDoesn't operate in as many locations, but pretty much the same, and often the same drivers. Informally it appears drivers I've talked to have preferred Lyft (have asked even when they were driving for Uber). Most of course demur, but I've never heard a driver say something nice about Uber while I have had several praise Lyft.
- praneshp 10y agoJust to give you a counter point, I was in India recently, and most drivers I spoke to loved Uber. That could be a combination of the alternative sucking, general employer treatment of employees not being great, etc.
- mozumder 10y agoHere's the great & intense statement from the New York Taxi Workers Alliance on their JFK strike: "NYTWA STATEMENT ON MUSLIM BAN: Professional drivers are over 20 times more likely to be murdered on the job than other workers. By sanctioning bigotry with his unconstitutional and inhumane executive order banning Muslim refugees from seven countries, the president is putting professional drivers in more danger than they have been in any time since 9/11 when hate crimes against immigrants skyrocketed. Our 19,000-member-strong union stands firmly opposed to Donald Trump's Muslim ban. As an organization whose membership is largely Muslim, a workforce that's almost universally immigrant, and a working-class movement that is rooted in the defense of the oppressed, we say no to this inhumane and unconstitutional ban. We know all too well that when government programs sanction outright Islamophobia, and the rhetoric of hate is spewed from the bully pulpit, hate crimes increase and drivers suffer gravely. Our Sikh and other non-Muslim brown and black members also suffer from anti-Muslim violence. Today, drivers are joining the protest at JFK Airport in support of all those who are currently being detained at the airport because of Trump's unconstitutional executive order. Drivers stand in solidarity with refugees coming to America in search of peace and safety and with those who are simply trying to return to their homes here in America after traveling abroad. We stand in solidarity with all of our peace-loving neighbors against this inhumane, cruel, and unconstitutional act of pure bigotry." From: https://www.facebook.com/nytwa/posts/1562624543751719 https://www.facebook.com/nytwa/posts/1562624543751719
- justinpombrio 10y agoI hate asking about downvotes, but I'm really confused why this comment has been pushed to the bottom. Why?
- rashkov 10y agoI think there's a pro-Uber case to be made here. Uber suspended surge pricing at a time when many people were trying to get to the protest at the airport, and while the airtrain was shut down which is what connects the subway system to the airport. Furthermore Uber offered to compensate its drivers who are affected by the ban, if they get stuck outside of the country. Edit: Maybe Uber mis-stepped by honoring requests for rides FROM the airport, but given the above I don't think they're doing this to grab money. It's actually a little sad to see the knee-jerk response by people lashing out at a company that is trying to help, in this instance.
- EthanHeilman 10y agoThe taxi strike was part of the protest at the airport. Offering reduced pricing was a way to hurt the taxi workers who were losing money to show solitary with the protest. If Uber was trying to help, they should have said so.
- rashkov 10y agoedit: Re-reading this, and I realize I missed your point. You're absolutely right -- they did not say "we are cutting surge pricing in support of the protest". This was my original post for posterity: "They did say so. This was their tweet: 'Our CEO's reaction to immigration order: "We'll compensate drivers impacted by the ban pro bono for next 3 months." http://ubr.to/standingup'" http://ubr.to/standingup'"
- pikzen 10y agoThey're helping their own workers. While a good thing, the rest of ther message is complete PR and sending ubers to JFK undermines the strikes, because it's such an easy way for them to make a profit.
- nerfhammer 10y agoTurning off surge pricing sends fewer Ubers to JFK! They make less money, not more with surge pricing off! Makes no sense!
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- malloreon 10y agoI'm a bit confused by the backlash at Uber. I saw the tweet saying they were suspending surge pricing to JFK. To me that make trips there less likely since drivers would make less. Wouldn't that be a show of solidarity with the temporarily striking taxi drivers union? I guess my question is, how does suspending surge pricing to JFK suggest Uber supports the executive order?
- koolba 10y agoDrivers don't know where they're going till the ride starts. I also don't think they can refuse to go to a destination without repercussions (i.e. Getting kicked out of Uber). If anything, disabling surge pricing lessens the impact of a taxi strike as going to/from the airport is more affordable and convenient then having zero or pricier options.
- 010a 10y agoThey could have disabled all pickups at JFK in true solidarity. I don't think disabling surge pricing is a show of solidarity. With Taxis striking, surge pricing would have skyrocketed. This feels more like Uber just wants to preempt an inevitable news story about how surge pricing hit 10x or something during the taxi strike, which would be bad PR. The article did say that Uber is working with its affected drivers to provide legal assistance. So, again, they're just protecting themselves. The company has practically no moral compass.
- jasonbarone 10y agoDid Lyft or any other services disable all pickups at JFK in true solidarity?
- icebraining 10y agoDid their workers agree to share that solidarity? Or are you saying they should have forced their workers to join the protest? Were taxi companies prohibiting drivers from picking up passengers?
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- inverse_pi 10y agoI don't get it. How about other people that were not part of the protest and were trying to get home/get to the airport? How about the Uber drivers trying to make a living? Just because they were not part of your protest you'll give them hate?
- kungfooguru 10y agoYes, it undermines the strike. Strikes are supposed to disrupt.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- benchaney 10y agoStrikes are intended to disrupt. They are not entitled to disrupt. There is a huge difference.
- pikzen 10y agoIn most professions, there's a feeling of unity. Taxi companies and drivers will either stand with striking drivers, or be respectful enough to not disrupt their action. Then comes Uber, the vulture that swoops in all in the name of disrupting the market. They're allowed to do it, sure. Whether it's morally right is another thing.
- benchaney 10y agoIt is definitely morally right. Calling Uber a vulture ignores the reality that the world doesn't stop just because some protesters are unhappy.
- eropple 10y ago"Some protestors are unhappy" is a really interesting way of phrasing "the federal government is embarking on a concerted attack on 1.7% of the population for reasons at best murky." Be better, please.
- benchaney 10y agoSo protesters are entitled to hold people hostage for an arbitrary amount of time, just because they are unhappy? Give me a break.
- dagw 10y agoWhere the bus services out of JFK also cancelled?
- baddox 10y agoIf they weren't, then the people who condemn Uber for not striking should also condemn the bus drivers for not striking.
- empath75 10y agoWhen you have an administration whose stated goal is to tear the fabric of the country apart, don't be surprised when that is what happens.
- closeparen 10y agoWe could say the same about the government (in fact, the protesters were saying that).
- danharaj 10y agoIt doesn't matter if they're entitled or not, they did it, and then Uber did what they did, and people are now evaluating those actions based on the facts and their values. You don't have to agree with every protest. There isn't a universal rule that says all protest is good. But every protest can be judged on its merits, which is what people are doing, not reducing the motivations to "just because they are unhappy". Implying that this protest was started "just because they are unhappy" is disingenuous and refuses to engage with the issues in good faith.
- benchaney 10y agoMy point isn't whether this particular protest is "good" or "bad". Even knowing relatively little about this protest, I think that I would likely agree with the protesters. My issue is that I don't see any reason why Uber should be obligated to stop service just because there is a protest going on. A lot of people in this thread seem to feel that having a protest entitles you to ruin other peoples' day and anyone who helps the people you are screwing is a bad guy. I see no good argument that supports that mentality.
- reacharavindh 10y agoI wonder if UBER could do anything evil with its location dara from customers and drivers... like identify who is joining protests and where etc.
- pfarnsworth 10y agoI don't see why Uber needs to be beholden to a taxi strike, since they're not taxis, that holds no meaningful purpose except hurting a large number of people trying to get to and from the airport. Since when do taxis get to unilaterally dictate what the moral way to protest is? Will taxi companies join Uber and help financially support the taxi drivers who are stuck out of the country because of Trump's ban? Are they immoral if they don't follow Uber's lead?
- tn13 10y agoKudos to Uber and Lyft both here. I had to travel to SFO yday and I managed to find an Uber. Despite protests and all, we need transportation people. I donated money to ACLU.
- giaour 10y agoI deleted my account, too, but I wonder if that was the most effective way to register my discontent with Uber. It was estimated in December that Uber spends about $1.55 for every dollar of revenue they take in [1], so refusing to use Uber isn't exactly hurting their bottom line. On the other hand, I've yet to talk to an Uber driver that doesn't also accept fares via Lyft, and if we can convince drivers to abandon Uber by shifting our consumer dollars to Lyft, then the Uber brand and platform will lose value. [1] https://techcrunch.com/2016/12/21/uber-losses-expected-to-hit-3-billion-in-2016-despite-revenue-growth/ https://techcrunch.com/2016/12/21/uber-losses-expected-to-hi...
- koolba 10y agoWhy is a company that is losing money and having what's left of their lunch taken by a gorilla of a competitor (Uber) throwing away $1M like this? If I were an investor in Lyft I'd sue them.
- camus2 10y ago> Why is a company that is losing money and having what's left of their lunch taken by a gorilla of a competitor (Uber) throwing away $1M like this? If I were an investor in Lyft I'd sue them. PR and upmanship against Uber.
- staticassertion 10y agoYou can easily see this as marketing. I'm certainly more inclined to use their services now.
- akuma73 10y agoWhat about the other half of the country?
- lvh 10y agoLyft and services like it seem to be intrinsically tied to urban centers, which also overwhelmingly lean liberal.
- akuma73 10y agoOverwhelmingly liberal is not 99%. It's more like 66-80%. For example,in very liberal San Jose, Trump got 20% of the vote. It's still a large percentage of the potential customers.
- blhack 10y agoEvery Trump supporter I know is embarrassed by the travel ban. So this doesn't quite effect "half of the country".
- facetube 10y agoDonald Trump is being powered by conspiracy theorist Steve Bannon, the "Breitbart News" head and board member of Cambridge Analytica, an analytics firm that used psychological profiling to cynically exploit the American electorate. Despite his inexperience and stated desire to "blow things up", he was appointed to an influential national security position, over the Joint Chiefs of Staff [1]. This is an existential threat to the American public and to the world. 1: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38787241 http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38787241 2: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/cambridge-analytica-steve-bannon-robert-rebekah-mercer-donald-trump-conflicts-of-interest-white-a7435536.html http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/cambridge-a... 3: http://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/12/the-british-data-crunchers-who-say-they-helped-donald-trump-to-win/ http://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/12/the-british-data-cruncher... 4: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cambridge_Analytica https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cambridge_Analytica
- stephancoral 10y agoBannon is not a founder of Breitbart, but came on after Andrew Breitbart's death. But yes, he is a terrible danger to the states. This is like a bad movie.
- facetube 10y agoI'm unclear on his exact relationship with "Breitbart News", but I relied on this for the "founder" statement: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Bannon#Breitbart_News https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Bannon#Breitbart_News.
- joojoobeez 10y ago.
- eganist 10y agoNo country has an obligation to do business with the United States either. If we pull back, not only will our economy will suffer for it, but many people will lose their jobs as well as their lives.
- asktomsk 10y agoPolitical shit like this should not be allowed here.
- cycrutchfield 10y agoHow is it overtly political to note that Lyft has donated $1m to the ACLU? If anything it is newsworthy. Glad you created an account just to share this with us.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- dmix 10y agoI agree that 99% of the time we should keep it non-political on HN. This isn't a political forum. But certain times where fundamental values get challenged then it's okay to cross the line and stand up to say something. Columbia had a great statement about this: https://twitter.com/nancysitu/status/825727645795155968 https://twitter.com/nancysitu/status/825727645795155968 But I agree that it should only be done in the right time and place. Far too often people get hysterical these days and call anyone they disagree with Hitler every time they utter a sentence. Where when it gets to the point it really matters to stand up they become far less persuasive.
- dropit_sphere 10y ago>But certain times The sovereign is he who decides the exception.
- facetube 10y agoAt what point does the situation become dire enough to warrant your attention?
- tomjen3 10y agoHN is not the place to post politics. There are plenty of other sites.
- tibbon 10y agoWhy will Uber not pull their heads out of their ass and have any moral-basis for operation? It's not like they don't hire a ton of Green Card holders...
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- zerdmann 10y agoI think instead of commending Lyft for what could be seen as marketing (they also did not stand in solidarity with the JFK strike, we should be discussing ways that ride-sharing technology can be used to support unionized drivers. I admittedly don't know much about the details, but apps like Curb http://gocurb.com/ http://gocurb.com/ at least claim to be working with licensed cabbies. I'd love more information on alternatives to the big ride-sharing apps that are more overtly focused on workers rights, instead of calling a fleet of contractors "disruptive."
- Malician 10y agoI agree that Uber should have participated in the strike. You said "welcome to post-truth politics" and "clearly and unambiguously untrue." Please demonstrate that I am a liar.
- makomk 10y agoYour only comment in this entire discussion is this one, yet you are implying I am somehow calling you a liar. Please explain yourself.
- dang 10y agoWe detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13515263 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13515263 and marked it off-topic.
- imaginenore 10y agoIf you're talking about moral basis, why would you support the immigration from these radical muslim countries? Huge percentages of them hold truly un-American, anti-liberal, anti-women, anti-gay beliefs. Listen to what these muslims say themselves: 13% percent of Syrian refugees support ISIS, another 10% have mixed feelings about it. Source: Arab Center for Research and Policy Studies http://english.dohainstitute.org/file/Get/40ebdf12-8960-4d18-8088-7c8a077e522e http://english.dohainstitute.org/file/Get/40ebdf12-8960-4d18... And if you think they change their beliefs upon immigration, think again: 52% of British muslims think homosexuality should be illegal http://edition.cnn.com/2016/04/11/europe/britain-muslims-survey/ http://edition.cnn.com/2016/04/11/europe/britain-muslims-sur... 40% of UK muslims want Sharia Law in predominantly muslim areas: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1510866/Poll-reveals-40pc-of-Muslims-want-sharia-law-in-UK.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1510866/Poll-reveals-... 27% of British muslims sympathize with the Charlie Hedbo terrorist act: https://muslimstatistics.files.wordpress.com/2015/03/bbc-today-programme_british-muslims-poll_final-tables_feb2015.pdf https://muslimstatistics.files.wordpress.com/2015/03/bbc-tod...
- dang 10y agoReligious flamewars are not welcome here (nor prepared lists of religious flamewar talking points). We warned you about this at least once before. If you do it again, we will ban you. We detached this comment from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13515321 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13515321 and marked it off-topic.
- imaginenore 10y agoThat was not a prepared list of talking points. I just searched for the fresh polls that support my argument. Of course, I understand your desire to censor me, since you don't have an actual counter-argument.
- throwawaybeta 10y agoRead the welcome page[0]. You broke HN's rules. >"you don't have an actual counter-argument" So, you're just looking for a fight. [0]news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html
- israeli77 10y agoLyft operates in Malaysia, where Israelis are banned from entering unless they get a letter of approval from the Ministry of Home Affairs, which is nearly impossible for the average Israeli. I'm curious if Lyft has any qualms about operating in Malaysia? I understand their disgust with Trump's action but I do hope they're consistent with their views.
- throwawaybeta 10y agoTo clarify, lyft does not operate outside of the states. They partner with Grab and DiDi. For lyft to stay consistent with their views, they'd have to cease partnership with Grab. With the claimed $1MM donation they paint a positive picture for us(fellow HN users reactions show they are more likely to use lyft, lyft will thus earn off us), but it would simply be loss of potential revenue in the case of Malaysia.
- jy1 10y agoTry placing your lyft pin in Kuala Lumpur airport.
- throwawaybeta 10y agoThat is the result of their partnership[0]. IMO, partnering with already established services is much safer than what Uber did. [0]http://take.lyft.com/global/ http://take.lyft.com/global/
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- sontek 10y agoI'm surprised everyone is jumping on Lyft even though Thiel is a major investor in Lyft and a huge supporter of Trump. I think it'd make most sense to avoid both services if you are concerned about the recent immigration ban.
- astronautjones 10y agoLots of boycotts are of the moment - like if I applied my politics and boycotted equivocally I couldn't buy gasoline or pay my utilities or work for my employer. When one breaks out (esp in a competitive market), it's easy to decide to join in (with fervor). It's always been that way.
- nojvek 10y agoI really really like Lyft. It seems Trevis is kind of a scumbag, kind of like Trump in a way who wants to win at any cost and has little sympathy for people in his way. Hearing employees at Uber crying, drivers getting scammed into leases, terrible customer support. I'm glad I didn't accept the offer.
- calciphus 10y agoDoes anyone have a reliable source that Lyft was still operating at JFK during the protest? I can't honestly figure out if they were or not. No horse in this race, just seen it reported both ways, trying to figure it out.