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This makes sense. Atlassian is good at making money from its services and it is increasing its overall ecosystem here. Github moves really slow in comparison.

This makes sense. Atlassian is good at making money from its services and it is increasing its overall ecosystem here. Github moves really slow in comparison. I guess Github is more focused, but there are a lot of contrasts between Github and Atlassian, and in terms of making money I think Atlassian is doing a lot better. Has Github acquired anything significant? Github should have acquired Zenhub (which is Trello integrated into Github for the most part) instead of slowing trying to recreate it -- although I guess Github has better code purity if they develop it themselves, but it means they move slower.

hashkb 10y ago
What does this have to do with h GitHub?
- mcintyre1994 10y ago
  BitBucket is owned by Atlassian and a competitor (the biggest?) to Github in the enterprise.
  - lukasm 10y ago
    and Github Project is a very basic Trello clone.
    - beat 10y ago
      Github Project is to Trello as Bitbucket is to Github. Guess which two products I use every day, and which two I avoid like the plague.
      - lukasm 10y ago
        Trello, Bitbucket and Github are mature products. Github Projects is MVP.
  - zuck9 10y ago
    Imo, GitLab is a more worthy competitor than BitBucket.
    - akjainaj 10y ago
      I agree with you, to me it looks like BitBucket hasn't evolved at all in five years. The only change worth mentioning is that they made me transition to an "Atlassian account", which was as annoying as when Flickr made me create a Yahoo account.
      - pretzel 10y ago
        There are a few new features over the last 5 years... * Merge checks * Build status (finally...) * Audit logs * Inline editing From: https://bitbucket.org/whats-new https://bitbucket.org/whats-new Nothing that keeps it above Github, but they always seem to maintain feature parity. /not a bitbucket shill //just don't like inaccurate comments.
        akjainaj 10y ago
        It's okay. It's just that I tried to use it a few months ago and saw they still don't even have syntax highlighting for diffs. It's pretty depressing and it makes it look like they have abandoned the service.
        WayneBro 10y ago
        I've been using BitBucket for years and the lack of syntax highlighting for diffs has never even occurred to me. Why would you want to use such a limited diff tool at all? Personally, I use the best diff tool that I can find and so far that's BeyondCompare from Scooter Software.
        marcinkuzminski 10y ago
        it becomes more important when you use this for code-review. Then reach diffs makes more sense. Once you start using them you don't want to go back :)
- bhouston 10y ago
  JIRA + Bitbucket (and now + Trello) is a very effective competitor to Github among enterprise companies. Github's issue tracker sort of sucks and this hurts it tremendously -- I know as I live with that shitty issue tracker in an enterprise situation.
  - baldfat 10y ago
    Personally all my own projects are on bitbucket. They were the first to provide free unlimited private repos and just has a great set of tools. So my personal preference is bitbucket over github.
    - egeozcan 10y ago
      They also support Mercurial, which I personally find to be a way better scm tool than git. Not trying to start the classic hg vs git debate, just saying that it's great to have the option.
      - maxxxxx 10y ago
        For some reason the enterprise version doesn't support mercurial, it's only git.
        lmm 10y ago
        The reason is it's a completely unrelated product (previously known as "stash") that Atlassian pretends is somehow connected for branding reasons.
        heywire 10y ago
        ...grumble grumble...Skype for Business...OneDrive for Business... (hate it when companies do this)
        positr0n 10y ago
        Yep, the two products are even written in separate languages! Bitbucket Server is written in Java and bitbucket.org is written in Python. I was dumbfounded when I found out they were two separate codebases.
rb808 10y ago
It makes sense mainly because Trello is a competitor to Atlassian and its best to kill it now before it takes too much market share. edit: Yes right now there might not be an exact competitor but in a few years it could easily match everything Jira does.
- ryanSrich 10y ago
  Is Trello really a competitor though? JIRA and Trello couldn't be more different. I'd think Trello and Asana are much closer competitors. JIRA is like an over engineered spaceship with more features than anyone could learn in a lifetime. Comparatively Trello functions more like a Prius. Priuses and spaceships don't compete.
  - wattt 10y ago
    Yes, I just recently evaluated switching my small team from JIRA->trello. I'd do it in a heartbeat if the licensing costs were better aligned.
  - matthewmacleod 10y ago
    I totally agree. Trello is not a competitor to JIRA. Don't get me wrong – I like them both. When I have to plan out personal projects, Trello is great. During the day, we use JIRA. The use cases are different, and the products are both suitable. I'm madly bemused that people look at the very, very surface layer of the UI (oh look, it has cards in columns!) and assume the products are the same.
  - RUG3Y 10y ago
    I think Trello fills a niche for people who don't need all of the features that JIRA provides, but they need something to track tickets/cards/whatever you want to call them. The products are pretty different but I can envision an overlap of users. I use both currently and if I didn't have Trello, I might have to use JIRA for everything.
  - farkas 10y ago
    We don't view JIRA and Trello as competitors. JIRA shines in areas that (a) have workflow and (b) require repeatable processes across a number of people. Once you have 20+ people on a project, you need repeatable processes. In cases like bug tracking, project management, customer service, help desks, HR onboarding and hundreds others you need workflow. Trello shines in areas where you have (a) small teams or (b) require ad-hoc semi-structured data. In small teams, even if repeatable process would help you, it's not worth the cost of setting up a system - you achieve it by social means. Trello also has many, many use-cases where you want to start something quick, or personal. In this case it really shines, with near-zero friction to get started. Scott, CEO Atlassian
Gelob 10y ago
Thats about all Atlassian is good at. HipChat has become an abomination of a client across Windows and Mac. Every new release is about fixing functionality they broke with the previous release and even then it still isn't fixed. Logging in from multiple places has always been terrible. I'll be logged in on Mac and available but randomly get emails as if I'm offline. I'll be online on my phone and get e-mails. I wan't emails of messages when I'm actually offline and not logged in but HipChat doesn't seem to care and emails me anyways sometimes. The option to turn off email notifications isn't very configurable either. Its off or on. Look at the release notes for windows and mac and search for reconnection. Just about every release has a fix for reconnecting going back to 2014. https://www.hipchat.com/release_notes/mac https://www.hipchat.com/release_notes/mac https://www.hipchat.com/release_notes/windows https://www.hipchat.com/release_notes/windows
- chinhodado 10y ago
  And don't even get me started on SourceTree. Just about every release since 1.5.2 is a disaster, to the point of almost non-usable right now.
  - st3v3r 10y ago
    Like what? SourceTree works just about perfectly for me.
  - edraferi 10y ago
    Really? I'm pretty happy with it. Definitely better than Github desktop, and more full featured than the light git extensions you find in most editors. What Git GUI do you prefer?
    - SippinLean 10y ago
      GitKraken looks promising, and introduces some new UI concepts (drag and drop merging, for example). It's still fairly young but could be a competitor.
      - 10y ago
dhagz 10y ago
Atlassian provides a whole gamut of enterprise-geared software development tools, whereas GitHub has only just recently started actively pursuing enterprise accounts and providing the features they want. In addition, Atlassian's services are spread out across many products, which can increase mobility. GitHub has only one product, so while they probably have many teams working on many features, there is still one product they can push releases to.
NeilDoyle 10y ago
It makes sense for them to increase their overall ecosystem with Slack's growth looming.
criley2 10y ago
I find it amusing that someone thinks Github moves slow in comparison to Atlassian. I feel like about 30% of all Github features have been released since the last major point release of Jira and Confluence, which themselves were buggy, poorly tested, crud as well. How does Atlassian move "fast"? Has Atlassian done.... anything worth noting in the past 3 years?
- cookiecaper 10y ago
  Atlassian is a bootstrapped enterprise software company. That alone should earn them a lot of respect. I think that Atlassian's pace matches their customer's wishes. I believe that Bitbucket is more or less on ice, functions as a free GitHub for private repos, and provides an outlet for Atlassian to try to convert people into enterprise clients, and I think this is their intention for Trello too. Enterprise clients do _not_ like rapid change, so I think that JIRA/Atlassian is on track. In the last 3 years, JIRA has integrated GreenHopper as JIRA Agile, and I don't know what/if anything else they've done, but I don't follow JIRA closely.
  - seanjregan 10y ago
    Mr..Mrs. Cookie! I love Ice.... In my drinks but not for Bitbucket. Bitbucket has released some pretty major stuff in just the last 6 months or so. Built in Pipelines are an example. We've got some other stuff coming soon and there is always more in the pipeline after that. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11759733 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11759733 Bitbucket added support for large files and went a step beyond GitHub and Gitlab by adding file chunking to speed things up in a big way. Bitbucket added file previews to help those working with large files like gaming devs. Smart mirroring to helps remote devs work faster. I could go on but I don't want to spam this thread with a feature list. There's a nice little post here with some things. https://blog.bitbucket.org/page/2/ https://blog.bitbucket.org/page/2/ Do you use Trello instead of JIRA? If so, awesome! It is a great product. We love it so much we spent around a full year of revenue to acquire them so rest assured that big of a bet isn't so we can just convert it into a lead gen tool. We believe Trello can be much bigger that than. (Alas, I can't comment on that right now as it is in deal closure period) If you don't use JIRA LMK what you use and what you like better. I'm always up for listening to what we are doing well and can do better. Caveat- if you can't tell I work on BB and JIRA. If you are in SF, I'll buy you a beer & a cookie for the answers, if not I'll just keep following this thread.

hashkb 10y ago

What does this have to do with h GitHub?

mcintyre1994 10y ago
BitBucket is owned by Atlassian and a competitor (the biggest?) to Github in the enterprise.
- lukasm 10y ago
  and Github Project is a very basic Trello clone.
  - beat 10y ago
    Github Project is to Trello as Bitbucket is to Github. Guess which two products I use every day, and which two I avoid like the plague.
    - lukasm 10y ago
      Trello, Bitbucket and Github are mature products. Github Projects is MVP.
- zuck9 10y ago
  Imo, GitLab is a more worthy competitor than BitBucket.
  - akjainaj 10y ago
    I agree with you, to me it looks like BitBucket hasn't evolved at all in five years. The only change worth mentioning is that they made me transition to an "Atlassian account", which was as annoying as when Flickr made me create a Yahoo account.
    - pretzel 10y ago
      There are a few new features over the last 5 years... * Merge checks * Build status (finally...) * Audit logs * Inline editing From: https://bitbucket.org/whats-new https://bitbucket.org/whats-new Nothing that keeps it above Github, but they always seem to maintain feature parity. /not a bitbucket shill //just don't like inaccurate comments.
      - akjainaj 10y ago
        It's okay. It's just that I tried to use it a few months ago and saw they still don't even have syntax highlighting for diffs. It's pretty depressing and it makes it look like they have abandoned the service.
        WayneBro 10y ago
        I've been using BitBucket for years and the lack of syntax highlighting for diffs has never even occurred to me. Why would you want to use such a limited diff tool at all? Personally, I use the best diff tool that I can find and so far that's BeyondCompare from Scooter Software.
        marcinkuzminski 10y ago
        it becomes more important when you use this for code-review. Then reach diffs makes more sense. Once you start using them you don't want to go back :)
bhouston 10y ago
JIRA + Bitbucket (and now + Trello) is a very effective competitor to Github among enterprise companies. Github's issue tracker sort of sucks and this hurts it tremendously -- I know as I live with that shitty issue tracker in an enterprise situation.
- baldfat 10y ago
  Personally all my own projects are on bitbucket. They were the first to provide free unlimited private repos and just has a great set of tools. So my personal preference is bitbucket over github.
  - egeozcan 10y ago
    They also support Mercurial, which I personally find to be a way better scm tool than git. Not trying to start the classic hg vs git debate, just saying that it's great to have the option.
    - maxxxxx 10y ago
      For some reason the enterprise version doesn't support mercurial, it's only git.
      - lmm 10y ago
        The reason is it's a completely unrelated product (previously known as "stash") that Atlassian pretends is somehow connected for branding reasons.
        heywire 10y ago
        ...grumble grumble...Skype for Business...OneDrive for Business... (hate it when companies do this)
        positr0n 10y ago
        Yep, the two products are even written in separate languages! Bitbucket Server is written in Java and bitbucket.org is written in Python. I was dumbfounded when I found out they were two separate codebases.

rb808 10y ago

It makes sense mainly because Trello is a competitor to Atlassian and its best to kill it now before it takes too much market share. edit: Yes right now there might not be an exact competitor but in a few years it could easily match everything Jira does.

ryanSrich 10y ago
Is Trello really a competitor though? JIRA and Trello couldn't be more different. I'd think Trello and Asana are much closer competitors. JIRA is like an over engineered spaceship with more features than anyone could learn in a lifetime. Comparatively Trello functions more like a Prius. Priuses and spaceships don't compete.
- wattt 10y ago
  Yes, I just recently evaluated switching my small team from JIRA->trello. I'd do it in a heartbeat if the licensing costs were better aligned.
- matthewmacleod 10y ago
  I totally agree. Trello is not a competitor to JIRA. Don't get me wrong – I like them both. When I have to plan out personal projects, Trello is great. During the day, we use JIRA. The use cases are different, and the products are both suitable. I'm madly bemused that people look at the very, very surface layer of the UI (oh look, it has cards in columns!) and assume the products are the same.
- RUG3Y 10y ago
  I think Trello fills a niche for people who don't need all of the features that JIRA provides, but they need something to track tickets/cards/whatever you want to call them. The products are pretty different but I can envision an overlap of users. I use both currently and if I didn't have Trello, I might have to use JIRA for everything.
- farkas 10y ago
  We don't view JIRA and Trello as competitors. JIRA shines in areas that (a) have workflow and (b) require repeatable processes across a number of people. Once you have 20+ people on a project, you need repeatable processes. In cases like bug tracking, project management, customer service, help desks, HR onboarding and hundreds others you need workflow. Trello shines in areas where you have (a) small teams or (b) require ad-hoc semi-structured data. In small teams, even if repeatable process would help you, it's not worth the cost of setting up a system - you achieve it by social means. Trello also has many, many use-cases where you want to start something quick, or personal. In this case it really shines, with near-zero friction to get started. Scott, CEO Atlassian

Gelob 10y ago

Thats about all Atlassian is good at. HipChat has become an abomination of a client across Windows and Mac. Every new release is about fixing functionality they broke with the previous release and even then it still isn't fixed. Logging in from multiple places has always been terrible. I'll be logged in on Mac and available but randomly get emails as if I'm offline. I'll be online on my phone and get e-mails. I wan't emails of messages when I'm actually offline and not logged in but HipChat doesn't seem to care and emails me anyways sometimes. The option to turn off email notifications isn't very configurable either. Its off or on. Look at the release notes for windows and mac and search for reconnection. Just about every release has a fix for reconnecting going back to 2014. https://www.hipchat.com/release_notes/mac https://www.hipchat.com/release_notes/mac https://www.hipchat.com/release_notes/windows https://www.hipchat.com/release_notes/windows

chinhodado 10y ago
And don't even get me started on SourceTree. Just about every release since 1.5.2 is a disaster, to the point of almost non-usable right now.
- st3v3r 10y ago
  Like what? SourceTree works just about perfectly for me.
- edraferi 10y ago
  Really? I'm pretty happy with it. Definitely better than Github desktop, and more full featured than the light git extensions you find in most editors. What Git GUI do you prefer?
  - SippinLean 10y ago
    GitKraken looks promising, and introduces some new UI concepts (drag and drop merging, for example). It's still fairly young but could be a competitor.
    - 10y ago

dhagz 10y ago

Atlassian provides a whole gamut of enterprise-geared software development tools, whereas GitHub has only just recently started actively pursuing enterprise accounts and providing the features they want. In addition, Atlassian's services are spread out across many products, which can increase mobility. GitHub has only one product, so while they probably have many teams working on many features, there is still one product they can push releases to.

NeilDoyle 10y ago

It makes sense for them to increase their overall ecosystem with Slack's growth looming.

criley2 10y ago

I find it amusing that someone thinks Github moves slow in comparison to Atlassian. I feel like about 30% of all Github features have been released since the last major point release of Jira and Confluence, which themselves were buggy, poorly tested, crud as well. How does Atlassian move "fast"? Has Atlassian done.... anything worth noting in the past 3 years?

cookiecaper 10y ago
Atlassian is a bootstrapped enterprise software company. That alone should earn them a lot of respect. I think that Atlassian's pace matches their customer's wishes. I believe that Bitbucket is more or less on ice, functions as a free GitHub for private repos, and provides an outlet for Atlassian to try to convert people into enterprise clients, and I think this is their intention for Trello too. Enterprise clients do _not_ like rapid change, so I think that JIRA/Atlassian is on track. In the last 3 years, JIRA has integrated GreenHopper as JIRA Agile, and I don't know what/if anything else they've done, but I don't follow JIRA closely.
- seanjregan 10y ago
  Mr..Mrs. Cookie! I love Ice.... In my drinks but not for Bitbucket. Bitbucket has released some pretty major stuff in just the last 6 months or so. Built in Pipelines are an example. We've got some other stuff coming soon and there is always more in the pipeline after that. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11759733 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11759733 Bitbucket added support for large files and went a step beyond GitHub and Gitlab by adding file chunking to speed things up in a big way. Bitbucket added file previews to help those working with large files like gaming devs. Smart mirroring to helps remote devs work faster. I could go on but I don't want to spam this thread with a feature list. There's a nice little post here with some things. https://blog.bitbucket.org/page/2/ https://blog.bitbucket.org/page/2/ Do you use Trello instead of JIRA? If so, awesome! It is a great product. We love it so much we spent around a full year of revenue to acquire them so rest assured that big of a bet isn't so we can just convert it into a lead gen tool. We believe Trello can be much bigger that than. (Alas, I can't comment on that right now as it is in deal closure period) If you don't use JIRA LMK what you use and what you like better. I'm always up for listening to what we are doing well and can do better. Caveat- if you can't tell I work on BB and JIRA. If you are in SF, I'll buy you a beer & a cookie for the answers, if not I'll just keep following this thread.