6 ms·

First serotonin neurons made from human stem cells (2015)

43 points by snake117 10y ago

d33 10y ago
> Because the neurons can be generated from induced pluripotent stem cells, which can be produced from a patient’s skin cells, “these could be useful for finding treatments for psychiatric disorders like depression, where we often see quite variable responses to drugs,” says Lu. “By identifying individual differences, this could be a step toward personalized medicine. Do we really need that much personalized medicine? My first thought is that it's going to drive prices up A LOT.
- visarga 10y ago
  Not if we can use cheap sensors, machine learning and automated chemical fabs to make it cheap again. From my understanding, personalized medicine is the way to go. Blockbuster model (like Viagra) can't adapt as efficiently as Netflix model (personalized drugs).
- kolinko 10y ago
  Right now, if someone is clinically depressed, we just shoot their serotonin levels higher (SSRIs) without going deeper into the root cause of the lowered serotonin levels. If we could pinpoint the places on that person's pathway of serotonin production and distribution, we could fix just the places that are broken. Essentially, getting the person to function normally with minimal side effects. Not to mention all kinds of problems where SSRIs don't help, are too generic (because it's just certain receptors that are broken, so driving serotonin higher makes certain system go overdrive), or not effective at all at inhibiting the reuptake. If I were to find a tech analogy... Imagine that we fix every car by attaching jet engines on it's back, without investigating the issue deeper. Jet engines will make the car go regardless of whether it's a broken wheel, messed up fuel injection, or whatever else. But, having a jet engine has it's faults, and really sometimes a bit of scotch tape would help and do a much better job. It's just that we need to know where to apply that scotch tape. Finally - right now it sometimes takes people a few years before they figure out the proper medication schedule. It's years of wasted work-hours, messed up relationships and life in general. Even if the cost was $20-$50k per one analysis - if the result was an exact schedule of drugs to take, and delivered within a week or so - it would still be a good investment for most members of society. And the price might not be $20k in the end, but closer to $1k, or less. That's cheaper than ten visits to a psychiatrist, so it ends up better economically compared to current solutions.
- DanBC 10y ago
  (Your downvote seemed unfair, so I upvoted you) Depression can be a fatal illness. In the UK suicide is the leading cause of death in men aged between 15 and 49; it's a significant cause of death for all adults. Not all those people have a diagnosis from a doctor, but it's likely that many of them have depression. There are wide variations in responses to SSRI medications. At the moment it's hard to know whether someone is going to respond to eg mirtazipine unless we actually give it to them. SSRIs take a few weeks to start working; the have a range of side effects that tend to be worst in those first few weeks; they take a while to "wash out" when you stop taking them; they have discontinuation effects that can be really unpleasant for some people; and there's increased risk of death by suicide during these tapers up and down. Personalised medicine would make some difference here in finding medication that's more likely to be effective. (For clarity, I believe that most people with mild to moderate depression need a talking therapy and help to change lifestyle, with meds on top if needed).
  - johnward 10y ago
    Also a large amount of people diagnosed with depression have some other mental illness such as bipolar. According to my doctor, the recent studies show that you don't want to be on an SSRI for bipolar as it makes the mood cycling worse.
  - EasyTiger_ 10y ago
    It blows my mind that accepted treatment for depression actually can make people more suicidal. But we can't give them anything that might make them feel good oh no, we can't have that
    - spinchange 10y ago
      It is a side effect we ought to one day be able to look back on and think it was still the dark ages of psychiatric medicine.
    - temp122616 10y ago
      Are you implying that there's a conspiracy not to help people feel better? Also, DanBC's point is accurate - for people with mild/moderate depression, talk therapy is as effective as pharmaceutical therapy. Thus, we already do have treatments that do not increase suicidal ideation.
un0 10y ago
How do this guys connect produced neurons to the cardiovascular system? =)
amelius 10y ago
How can these neurons be placed at the location where they are needed?

43 points by snake117 10y ago

d33 10y ago

> Because the neurons can be generated from induced pluripotent stem cells, which can be produced from a patient’s skin cells, “these could be useful for finding treatments for psychiatric disorders like depression, where we often see quite variable responses to drugs,” says Lu. “By identifying individual differences, this could be a step toward personalized medicine. Do we really need that much personalized medicine? My first thought is that it's going to drive prices up A LOT.

visarga 10y ago
Not if we can use cheap sensors, machine learning and automated chemical fabs to make it cheap again. From my understanding, personalized medicine is the way to go. Blockbuster model (like Viagra) can't adapt as efficiently as Netflix model (personalized drugs).
kolinko 10y ago
Right now, if someone is clinically depressed, we just shoot their serotonin levels higher (SSRIs) without going deeper into the root cause of the lowered serotonin levels. If we could pinpoint the places on that person's pathway of serotonin production and distribution, we could fix just the places that are broken. Essentially, getting the person to function normally with minimal side effects. Not to mention all kinds of problems where SSRIs don't help, are too generic (because it's just certain receptors that are broken, so driving serotonin higher makes certain system go overdrive), or not effective at all at inhibiting the reuptake. If I were to find a tech analogy... Imagine that we fix every car by attaching jet engines on it's back, without investigating the issue deeper. Jet engines will make the car go regardless of whether it's a broken wheel, messed up fuel injection, or whatever else. But, having a jet engine has it's faults, and really sometimes a bit of scotch tape would help and do a much better job. It's just that we need to know where to apply that scotch tape. Finally - right now it sometimes takes people a few years before they figure out the proper medication schedule. It's years of wasted work-hours, messed up relationships and life in general. Even if the cost was $20-$50k per one analysis - if the result was an exact schedule of drugs to take, and delivered within a week or so - it would still be a good investment for most members of society. And the price might not be $20k in the end, but closer to $1k, or less. That's cheaper than ten visits to a psychiatrist, so it ends up better economically compared to current solutions.
DanBC 10y ago
(Your downvote seemed unfair, so I upvoted you) Depression can be a fatal illness. In the UK suicide is the leading cause of death in men aged between 15 and 49; it's a significant cause of death for all adults. Not all those people have a diagnosis from a doctor, but it's likely that many of them have depression. There are wide variations in responses to SSRI medications. At the moment it's hard to know whether someone is going to respond to eg mirtazipine unless we actually give it to them. SSRIs take a few weeks to start working; the have a range of side effects that tend to be worst in those first few weeks; they take a while to "wash out" when you stop taking them; they have discontinuation effects that can be really unpleasant for some people; and there's increased risk of death by suicide during these tapers up and down. Personalised medicine would make some difference here in finding medication that's more likely to be effective. (For clarity, I believe that most people with mild to moderate depression need a talking therapy and help to change lifestyle, with meds on top if needed).
- johnward 10y ago
  Also a large amount of people diagnosed with depression have some other mental illness such as bipolar. According to my doctor, the recent studies show that you don't want to be on an SSRI for bipolar as it makes the mood cycling worse.
- EasyTiger_ 10y ago
  It blows my mind that accepted treatment for depression actually can make people more suicidal. But we can't give them anything that might make them feel good oh no, we can't have that
  - spinchange 10y ago
    It is a side effect we ought to one day be able to look back on and think it was still the dark ages of psychiatric medicine.
  - temp122616 10y ago
    Are you implying that there's a conspiracy not to help people feel better? Also, DanBC's point is accurate - for people with mild/moderate depression, talk therapy is as effective as pharmaceutical therapy. Thus, we already do have treatments that do not increase suicidal ideation.

un0 10y ago

How do this guys connect produced neurons to the cardiovascular system? =)

amelius 10y ago

How can these neurons be placed at the location where they are needed?