8 ms·

Mainstream VR HMDs Are Coming, with a Range of Specs and Features

47 points by SkarredGhost 10y ago

yodon 10y ago
Microsoft and Unity are doing an amazing job building development tools for Windows Holographic devices like these (yes, I know today it's just HoloLens but these run the same tech just in a VR context). My concern is I've not seen any support for 3dof or 6dof tracked controllers in those dev tools, which means applications supporting those controllers could be dangerously late in arriving (I love Unity's integrated HoloLens simulator and debugger, but it took a long time after device release for that to hit release builds of the tooling)
- drzaiusapelord 10y ago
  I don't think MS is going to sell controllers for Holographic or Hololens. It'll be BYOC perhaps with the exception of a Xbox VR headset. I suspect the game plan is to use all those cameras on the Hololens to not only do tracking but to also track hands and perhaps fingers, Kinect-style for a seamless experience. Its suspicious MS isn't talking controllers and I think its because they want to usher in a controller-less solution first with the option to use a kb/m, gamepad, or 3rd party spatial controllers if need be, say for gaming, but for general purpose, your hands will be all you need. In some early hololens concept videos they featured people interacting with it using just their hands. I think they want to make this happen when they finally release hololens, so they aren't going to invest in controller solutions. Worse, from a more practical level, hololens uses inside-out markerless tracking so without a bunch of USB cameras or a Vive-like lighthouse system, they actually can't support controllers.
arcanus 10y ago
What about the computer needed to drive these displays? Will they all require a 1k computer with a top of the line AMD/NVIDIA GPU? That is the biggest cost barrier to large scale VR adoption. To say nothing of the lack of killer software...
- corysama 10y ago
  Microsoft is shooting for significantly lower specs than Oculus and Vive. http://thenextweb.com/microsoft/2016/12/08/microsoft-unveils-surprisingly-low-spec-requirements-vr-window-holographic/ http://thenextweb.com/microsoft/2016/12/08/microsoft-unveils... You can run VR on cheaper computers, you just need to downgrade your expectations about what you hope to see. Oculus and Vive agreed on a high quality bar as their recommendation. I guess MS is going to shoot for simpler, more utilitarian apps.
  - marricks 10y ago
    That approach sounds good on paper, but when Microsoft have high persistence screens and lower refresh rate coupled with a computer that can drop frames users will feel awful. Lots of nausea. And then, once someone has a shitty time in VR it spoils them for it in the future. I showed my boss the rift DK1 and he's pretty against the whole system now, not to mentioned people he tells about it. There's a reason Oculus/Valve created a high bar, it's easy to get people turned off on it.
- drzaiusapelord 10y ago
  Only if you want to play gorgeous looking games. For TPS report writing, your built in card is fine. It won't be pretty but you'll be able to use VR Excel or casual gaming with mobile-like low poly and low textures. I think its very clear MS is pushing into the low end to entice businesses, not gamers. I imagine a separate Xbox VR product is going to come out that will be higher spec than these HMDs and will come with proper spatial controllers.
  - thinkmassive 10y ago
    Finally, the solution to every downside about open offices! As a bonus we can increase the employee density by about 400% /s
  - ashark 10y ago
    > It won't be pretty but you'll be able to use VR Excel > I think its very clear MS is pushing into the low end to entice businesses I can't come up with a reason this would be desirable. There are eye and mental health issues that seem like serious roadblocks to making everyone use these things for whole workdays, and if you have to revert to a normal screen much of the time then what's the point of messing with VR? Just one more gadget. Plus any battery-powered device will suffer from greatly increased power drain compared with doing the same stuff in a normal desktop, even with a lower-fidelity VR experience. 8hr battery with monitor versus 4hr battery with VR (I'm being generous)? The productivity benefit from VR would have to be enormous to make that look like a good trade. I can see it for some niche applications (3d modeling or CAD, maybe) but for MS Office cowboys? What's the pitch?

47 points by SkarredGhost 10y ago

yodon 10y ago

Microsoft and Unity are doing an amazing job building development tools for Windows Holographic devices like these (yes, I know today it's just HoloLens but these run the same tech just in a VR context). My concern is I've not seen any support for 3dof or 6dof tracked controllers in those dev tools, which means applications supporting those controllers could be dangerously late in arriving (I love Unity's integrated HoloLens simulator and debugger, but it took a long time after device release for that to hit release builds of the tooling)

drzaiusapelord 10y ago
I don't think MS is going to sell controllers for Holographic or Hololens. It'll be BYOC perhaps with the exception of a Xbox VR headset. I suspect the game plan is to use all those cameras on the Hololens to not only do tracking but to also track hands and perhaps fingers, Kinect-style for a seamless experience. Its suspicious MS isn't talking controllers and I think its because they want to usher in a controller-less solution first with the option to use a kb/m, gamepad, or 3rd party spatial controllers if need be, say for gaming, but for general purpose, your hands will be all you need. In some early hololens concept videos they featured people interacting with it using just their hands. I think they want to make this happen when they finally release hololens, so they aren't going to invest in controller solutions. Worse, from a more practical level, hololens uses inside-out markerless tracking so without a bunch of USB cameras or a Vive-like lighthouse system, they actually can't support controllers.

arcanus 10y ago

What about the computer needed to drive these displays? Will they all require a 1k computer with a top of the line AMD/NVIDIA GPU? That is the biggest cost barrier to large scale VR adoption. To say nothing of the lack of killer software...

corysama 10y ago
Microsoft is shooting for significantly lower specs than Oculus and Vive. http://thenextweb.com/microsoft/2016/12/08/microsoft-unveils-surprisingly-low-spec-requirements-vr-window-holographic/ http://thenextweb.com/microsoft/2016/12/08/microsoft-unveils... You can run VR on cheaper computers, you just need to downgrade your expectations about what you hope to see. Oculus and Vive agreed on a high quality bar as their recommendation. I guess MS is going to shoot for simpler, more utilitarian apps.
- marricks 10y ago
  That approach sounds good on paper, but when Microsoft have high persistence screens and lower refresh rate coupled with a computer that can drop frames users will feel awful. Lots of nausea. And then, once someone has a shitty time in VR it spoils them for it in the future. I showed my boss the rift DK1 and he's pretty against the whole system now, not to mentioned people he tells about it. There's a reason Oculus/Valve created a high bar, it's easy to get people turned off on it.
drzaiusapelord 10y ago
Only if you want to play gorgeous looking games. For TPS report writing, your built in card is fine. It won't be pretty but you'll be able to use VR Excel or casual gaming with mobile-like low poly and low textures. I think its very clear MS is pushing into the low end to entice businesses, not gamers. I imagine a separate Xbox VR product is going to come out that will be higher spec than these HMDs and will come with proper spatial controllers.
- thinkmassive 10y ago
  Finally, the solution to every downside about open offices! As a bonus we can increase the employee density by about 400% /s
- ashark 10y ago
  > It won't be pretty but you'll be able to use VR Excel > I think its very clear MS is pushing into the low end to entice businesses I can't come up with a reason this would be desirable. There are eye and mental health issues that seem like serious roadblocks to making everyone use these things for whole workdays, and if you have to revert to a normal screen much of the time then what's the point of messing with VR? Just one more gadget. Plus any battery-powered device will suffer from greatly increased power drain compared with doing the same stuff in a normal desktop, even with a lower-fidelity VR experience. 8hr battery with monitor versus 4hr battery with VR (I'm being generous)? The productivity benefit from VR would have to be enormous to make that look like a good trade. I can see it for some niche applications (3d modeling or CAD, maybe) but for MS Office cowboys? What's the pitch?