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> The name UNIX is just not well defined. Saying Linux is a UNIX is perfectly valid imo, but everyone has a different idea of what UNIX means. The trademark UN
by jamiesonbecker 10y ago
> The name UNIX is just not well defined. Saying Linux is a UNIX is perfectly valid imo, but everyone has a different idea of what UNIX means.
The trademark UNIX® and its specification is (still) tightly controlled[1] and licensing and compliance was far too expensive for Linus to think about it for his tiny Linux-like OS. (A Linux distribution did recently get certified as UNIX® but that's a recent exception.)
There have been multiple lawsuits between different companies about what could be considered UNIX. The original Linux distribution was basically GNU (GNU is NOT UNIX) utilities wrapped around a deliberately non-UNIX kernel called Linux.
Back when people were trying to explain Linux to UNIX users, it was called "UNIX-like" or a UNIX® clone. Now that Linux has clearly eclipsed UNIX, even now no one really calls Linux, "UNIX" or vice-versa. They are very similar but they are different.
There is also another specification called POSIX. Even Windows NT had a POSIX-compliant layer for a while, and Services for UNIX had some licensed IP, but no one would claim that Windows NT was UNIX.
See also Lisivka's comments [2] further down: Linux is not UNIX.
See also the Single UNIX Specification[3].
1. http://www.opengroup.org/subjectareas/platform/unix http://www.opengroup.org/subjectareas/platform/unix
2. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13204551 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13204551
3. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_UNIX_Specification https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_UNIX_Specification
- AsyncAwait 10y agoI think Linux is perfectly UNIX in terms of userland and 'spirit', if you will. It's not UNIX officially, but that's because nobody bothered to pay for the licensing, since it's not worth it, not because it couldn't get certified as UNIX if somebody wanted to do it - in fact D. Ritchie himself said: "I think the Linux phenomenon is quite delightful, because it draws so strongly on the basis that Unix provided. Linux seems to be among the healthiest of the direct Unix derivatives, though there are also the various BSD systems as well as the more official offerings from the workstation and mainframe manufacturers." K. Thompson is also using Linux. I think that's the ultimate testament to it being 'Unix', unless you want the trademark for marketing purposes, like Apple does.
- aap_ 10y agoKen uses OS X.
- dekhn 10y agoHe also said he worked on the alpha version of Linux.
- AsyncAwait 10y agoAs per[1], "According to a 2009 interview, Thompson now uses a Linux-based operating system." He probably uses multiple systems, including macOS in some capacity, am sure, but it looks like he uses/used Linux. [1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ken_Thompson https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ken_Thompson
- aap_ 10y agoI can't find the source right now but Russ Cox posted to some newsgroup or mailing list that most golang developers use OS X these days (rsc, rob and ken for sure).
- aap_ 10y agoThe SUS is irrelevant to this question, just like POSIX, which you mention yourself. Probably not a single version of UNIX from Bell Labs could be called UNIX by these definitions, which is silly. Of course they are UNIX, more so than any other operating system. So what makes an operating system a UNIX? Decide for yourself! UNIX != UNIX®